Ganondorf runs a gauntlet.

yes thats the black materia

huge materia come in different colors red blue yellow green

But the one Sephiroth uses Cloud to gain is the Black one, for meteor casting.

Originally posted by Burning thought
1. I dont know that, and considering ive not played LOZ I will not be convinced by you saying so. Ofcourse it discredits them, it discredits them because first and foremost Link is pretty much human, so the excistence of toonforce in the game points out the fact that feats beyond his canon structure and limit especially in gameplay are automatically toonforce, the granite thing was incosistent with what link is, having 1000+ ton strength is not realistic considering he would not need a sword at all.

I could own you like your dad owned your mother with his heavy fists 😉 , and ill do it now:

This just shows your lack of precision when you blunder into a thread, as well as your huge bias and how most of your claims are likely thus, just a lot of frequent blabberings. I mean jesus on the same page, the very first page you claim Ganon gets to Kiljaeden, then you claim Kratos (wtf, how?) defeats ganon despite him apprently being able to turn Sephiroth into a bodiless soul or sealing him away, I mean its obvious we all know you like Kratos but your bias makes you blind which is why you fail in most threads.

2. I did not make a claim, I made a statement, There is no indication in the game where Sephiroth claims he will use Cloud as part of his master plans the way Kain uses Raziel. The burdon of proof is to provide that Cloud is indeed used.

Indeed? How are those therapy classes for your suicidal tendencies going?

1. Kratos has soul resistance as of GoW3 I believe. Beating Hades and shit. I admit I did not think of sealing him away, yeah, if that would work on Kratos it is a win(but I am not so sure he could seal a being so large away).

2. You claimed Sephiroth has no plans for Cloud.

But fine, whatever.

In FFVII, Sephiroth uses and succeeds in his plan of using Cloud to get the Black Materia. It is through controlling Cloud that he receives it.

That is about the only time he has done something like this however.

ok ok but still the category is huge materia. and that was part of sephiroth's master plan so... sephiroth used cloud for his master plan.

Originally posted by Burning thought
1. Just a parasite, not evil at all....

You really have no idea about the LOK do you, I rest my case, you've never played any of them lol....your just puting "evil" in front of everything Kain or Raziel may be against, rather pathetic considering half of the beings are not evil at all, hell many who play the game sympathise with the Hyldan race and see them as the right, unlike most other lesser story lines (see Okami, Xenosaga, FF, LOZ) the legacy of Kain has an extremely adult and intellectual view on the storyline, this allows the players to decide themselves and the characters are presented strongly enough for their views to be evaluated by the players, thus another reason why the dynamic characters are far superior to aforementioned ideas because they convey a view that the player themselves can judge without having whats right and wrong tossed at them like they are young children, I can see how that may appeal to you but it does not make an advanced or unique story.

2. Then if you dont care go away, nobody else cares what you think either, and most people? theres no most at all, the only section I exist is this one tiny piece, your invisible imaginary buddies that apparently back you up dont exist and the only real people who disagree with me are those that cannot debate with me or have favoured characters that I debate with them against, they can never actually defeat my arguments.

3. The first legacy of Kain's story was greater than FF7 by far although unlike FF, the legacy of Kain series works as a whole. But you would not understand that having not played the games.

Damn I must have hit a nerve, its no wonder you enjoy LOZ, Okami, its maturity level is certainly quite far above yours, your like a crying infant whos pacifier has fallen from the pram. And Xenosaga, is that not the one with the queer looking robot chick? all about a boring bunch of corporations after some artifacts power, yes....massively unique....never been done before in the slightest lol...

1. parasites are evil to their victims, and the elder god never felt sorry for his place in the world. people can also sympathise, and to a MUCH greater extent with necron/udo/zeus. doesnt change the fact that GOOD vs EVIL formula is just as present in legacy of kain as any other game

no, it seems like i know the story better than you do, and its been proven over the time uve been here. im not PUTTING evil against aything, the generic formula of good vs evil is present in many of the LOK games, thats a fact that raziel will more than agree with. sympathising isnt mutually exclusive with evil, idiot. okami and xenosaga's storylines are better than legacy of kain by atleast a factor of 2. dont BULLSHIT about thins uve never played because your intellectual capacity is such that you consider games like LOK "deep", your a kid, i doubt youve had much experience with mature fiction, inside or outside video games.

2. you dont care, and thats only because you get raped everytime you enter into a debate and continue on to fill your post with logical and linguistic fallacies meant to keep the conversation going no matter what. and let me rephrase, ALL those barring a handfull who have encountered you on kmc, think you are the most ridiculous fanboy they have ever seen, who has no idea how to have a real debate. when things get hot, you spam reports to try and get the other person banned. thats all you are, and the fact that your entire life exists to bullshit about a fictional character that u ride in ur dreams, in this tiny corner of one forum on the internet is quite pathetic. newsflash, every1 can debate better than you, including the idiots here. what you do isnt DEBATING, BT and debating shudnt be used in the same sentence. {for INSTANCE, no idiot wud debate agains the STORYLINE of video games that he or she hanst played, but lo and behold, here you are}.

3. in ur dreams. not to say that it was greatness embodied, it was just superior to first LOK in every way. and STOP moaning, after being raped. ive played it, others have played it, you FAIL.

lmao, you havent played okami u bumbling fool. nor xenosaga. ur ignorance is proof of that. and YEAH thats ALL xenosaga is, it isnt really a melting pot of freudian/jungian/neitczhian psychology mixes with gnostic and judeo christian mythology, seemlessly assimilated into hawkingian physics and the space opera genre pioneered by kubrik. no no no , it isnt about the death of god and our place in the universe or the collective unconcious and people's will to power, it isnt REALLY about the maiden of mary and the gnostic concepts of jesus and gnosification. no no no, its just a bunch of queer robot chicks and space corporations fighting as claimed by the resident idiot of kmc's video game corner who claims that he has never played the game in the first place,
{and im sure you dont understand most of those references seeing that your limit of understanding DEEP concepts ends on LOK. so i dont begrudge you ur ignorance}

really, could you BE more of a joke BT?

K. So how much does Kain weigh? I have some math to do.

Wow...Burning Thought is a douche...

Here's my answer to the debate. Ganon throws Kain into space, OR; directly at the ground. Here's a snippet of basic math using less then the strength of Link, who is weaker than Ganon.

Conversions:
K = 2551457081.25 joule = 2551457081.25 joule
m = 200 pound = 90.71847399995 kilogram

v = 7500.0000000021 meter/second

Tadah; Kain explodes into lollersauce.

i doubt kain weighs that much he's anorexic

Originally posted by NemeBro
1. Link being human means what? And he is not human, he is Hylian, a fictional race. Krillin from DBZ is human...And near the start of DBZ he could bust at least a mountain with ease. So being "human" means nothing. He was able to lift the granite with an item he got five minutes before the final fight in the game. It was like his final great powerup. He did not have the Golden Gauntlets which allowed him to do that before fighting Ganon. The Golden Gauntlets were implemented in the game so you could do that, yet it is toonforce?

Indeed? How are those therapy classes for your suicidal tendencies going?

1. Kratos has soul resistance as of GoW3 I believe. Beating Hades and shit. I admit I did not think of sealing him away, yeah, if that would work on Kratos it is a win(but I am not so sure he could seal a being so large away).

2. You claimed Sephiroth has no plans for Cloud.

But fine, whatever.

In FFVII, Sephiroth uses and succeeds in his plan of using Cloud to get the Black Materia. It is through controlling Cloud that he receives it.

That is about the only time he has done something like this however.

1. It means everything. humans are not attributed any incredible attributes and from reading their LOZ wiki articles, Link is often refered to as human, in fact humans succeed over the Hylians in the storyline or so it says, fact is, by actual canon of the characters and their limits, their nothing more than actual humans, considering toonforce exists in the game, this further solidifies the fact that any of links major feats, certainly those that are not empowered by a sort of item or power are merely toonforce/game play fun. The golden gauntlets are inconsistent with the rest of the game after that, tossing that granite was the only impressive thing ive seen from them, other than that, he has shown me that his strength cannot be that great considering the physics of the world.

1. So you assume and speculate on soul resistances.....just because hes going to fight Hades in GOW 3...thats a mighty basis....

So size is important on what Ganon can seal? I like how this is not mentioned before.

2. I claimed that Sephiroth has no plans when fighting Cloud, the fact he uses Cloud in Disc 2 has no baring on my point and argument which was unlike Kain, Sephiroth has no reason to let Cloud live in AC or in their major battles.

Originally posted by leonheartmm
1. parasites are evil to their victims, and the elder god never felt sorry for his place in the world. people can also sympathise, and to a MUCH greater extent with necron/udo/zeus. doesnt change the fact that GOOD vs EVIL formula is just as present in legacy of kain as any other game

no, it seems like i know the story better than you do, and its been proven over the time uve been here. im not PUTTING evil against aything, the generic formula of good vs evil is present in many of the LOK games, thats a fact that raziel will more than agree with. sympathising isnt mutually exclusive with evil, idiot. okami and xenosaga's story lines are better than legacy of kain by atleast a factor of 2. dont BULLSHIT about thins uve never played because your intellectual capacity is such that you consider games like LOK "deep", your a kid, i doubt youve had much experience with mature fiction, inside or outside video games.

2. you dont care, and thats only because you get raped everytime you enter into a debate and continue on to fill your post with logical and linguistic fallacies meant to keep the conversation going no matter what. and let me rephrase, ALL those barring a handfull who have encountered you on kmc, think you are the most ridiculous fanboy they have ever seen, who has no idea how to have a real debate. when things get hot, you spam reports to try and get the other person banned. thats all you are, and the fact that your entire life exists to bullshit about a fictional character that u ride in ur dreams, in this tiny corner of one forum on the internet is quite pathetic. newsflash, every1 can debate better than you, including the idiots here. what you do isnt DEBATING, BT and debating shudnt be used in the same sentence. {for INSTANCE, no idiot wud debate agains the STORYLINE of video games that he or she hanst played, but lo and behold, here you are}.

3. in ur dreams. not to say that it was greatness embodied, it was just superior to first LOK in every way. and STOP moaning, after being raped. ive played it, others have played it, you FAIL.

lmao, you havent played okami u bumbling fool. nor xenosaga. ur ignorance is proof of that. and YEAH thats ALL xenosaga is, it isnt really a melting pot of freudian/jungian/neitczhian psychology mixes with gnostic and judeo christian mythology, seemlessly assimilated into hawkingian physics and the space opera genre pioneered by kubrik. no no no , it isnt about the death of god and our place in the universe or the collective unconcious and people's will to power, it isnt REALLY about the maiden of mary and the gnostic concepts of jesus and gnosification. no no no, its just a bunch of queer robot chicks and space corporations fighting as claimed by the resident idiot of kmc's video game corner who claims that he has never played the game in the first place,
{and im sure you dont understand most of those references seeing that your limit of understanding DEEP concepts ends on LOK. so i dont begrudge you ur ignorance}

really, could you BE more of a joke BT?

Dont be daft, now your just tossing "evil" in front of anything in LOK again and good job at ignoring my point, you did not every address it, your simply sitting there claiming again without even reference.

No youve shown many times you have no idea about LOK, stop sniveling. I have read plenty on both story lines, their background and ideals are fairly basic although I admit, Xenosaga is the better of the two and perhaps close to LOK standard.

2. Some more ranting and sniveling, grow up kid, and half of this paragraph is simply slight rephrasing of what I have said to you before, go and invent your own comebacks if you want to try and insult me. I like to report trolls such as you, otherwise we would have an overflow of whining children such as yourself.

3. "zomg u failz!" what a child lol, and your just making statements again, theres not even a constructive opinion.

Your just chucking in content that its touched upon, the main storyline is still mostly about corporations after this Ark thing, the fact theres a few references chucked in there for good measure means little, theres similar things in all gaming, DMC has mythological references yet its still a fairly bland and common story, not to say its boring but its not unique, LOK has one of the most popular myths of all, vampires.

I could be you 🙂

Spoiler:
There could not have been a better come back

Originally posted by ScreamPaste
Here's my answer to the debate. Ganon throws Kain into space, OR; directly at the ground. Here's a snippet of basic math using less then the strength of Link, who is weaker than Ganon.

Conversions:
K = 2551457081.25 joule = 2551457081.25 joule
m = 200 pound = 90.71847399995 kilogram

v = 7500.0000000021 meter/second

Tadah; Kain explodes into lollersauce.

Yes and using my own Balance guardian magic regulation+access to weather, time, souls, light and energy=Kain causes the big bang and blasts the LOZ universe and Ganon into another dimension, see wat i dids there?

Although on a more serious note, its not like Ganon would touch kain anyway, one teleport and he is out of range of Ganon even touching him, especially if he mists.

One thing I'd like to point out. BT, earlier in the thread you said something along the lines of Kain being more or less untouchable in mist form, even surviving lava...see, the problem with that is that...well, if he in mist form, it means its some type of liquid (I'm assuming it's a blood mist kinda thing). Ganon might not be able to physically grab Kain in the form, but force him to somehow mist into lava, and he'll end up evaporating.
😐

Mist is vapour, you cant evapourate something already in vapour form, if you do your simply making more vapour which I pointed out in the starkiller thread would simply make it more of a difficulty to fight Kain considering you would not know which direction he is coming from, and which part of the mist is actually him. And how could you force Kain to mist into lava anyway? furthermore I missed the fact theres lava in this match for Ganon to make use of, is there lava? I dont remember OP saying so.

There is no lava, unless Ganondorf can create it or is powerful enough to draw it from the Earth's crust.

Kain obviously would have to be able to retain control of himself in his mist form, so how far apart can the particles be before his control on them fades? Right now, Ganon could exhale and possibly take Kain's head off.

not really, and his has more control over them than a gust of wind lol....right now Ganon would have to make sure Kains fragments are scattered but this is a stupid conversation, Kain can go in and out of mist in a blink, its not like Kain is going to spend all his time in mist form.

He can split himself apart to move through bars and cracks and things, so his mist can be seperated. Its going to be no good trying to hit Kain.

Well, I've still got to read the thread at some point, but right now there's still a number of things Ganon can do to Kain. Possession, inter-dimensional sealing, other stuff...

I'm sure I could still make the wind thing work, but I've got to do a bit of looking into the ways that Ganon might go about doing it.

Mist is made up of water droplets, hence clouds, FYI, BT.

Ganon teleports next to Kain, and grabs and throws him to the ground in one move, it's outside Kain's reaction time and it'd result in a very large crator filled with a smear of charred vampire shmutz.

If Kain mists, Ganon strikes him with lightning, evaporating him.

Kain literally has no chance.

Edit; your claim of Kain recreating the big bang was lol-worthy.

Bullshit, Ganon is not that fast, its not outside of Kains reaction time at all lol, and only through your fanfiction is Ganon of any high amount of strength.

This is what happens, Kain uses infnite magic through repel shield, becomes invincible, then uses the power of dimension to travel to Hyrule and causes the big bang through energy.

Kain misting would make him immune to Ganon, all he can do is try and make more vapour by electrocuting it.

kain simply has to do any number of moves, blood shower, soul destruction, time aura+teleport, Ganon is screwed.

Bullshit, Ganon is not that fast, its not outside of Kains reaction time at all lol, and only through your fanfiction is Ganon of any high amount of strength.

This is what happens, Kain uses infnite magic through repel shield, becomes invincible, then uses the power of dimension to travel to Hyrule and causes the big bang through energy.

Kain misting would make him immune to Ganon, all he can do is try and make more vapour by electrocuting it.

kain simply has to do any number of moves, blood shower, soul destruction, time aura+teleport, Ganon is screwed.