Originally posted by darthgoober
The claim made was that Surfer couldn't tag Zoom. Therefor the speed in which Surfer's board can travel is perfectly relevant information since I was talking about him one shotting Zoom with a Bullrush.
Originally posted by darthgoober
Surfer can move through time too...
So can Wally.
Now that I look back, that was part of Jay's point. It doesn't matter how fast you are, Zoom only has to WANT to be faster. He exists in a different time frame. Beings like Grandmaster or even more powerful, Odin, can reach outside of their own time-frame and such. Whether or not the Surfer can do this?
That's up to Goob.
Originally posted by darthgoober
The claim made was that Surfer couldn't tag Zoom. Therefor the speed in which Surfer's board can travel is perfectly relevant information since I was talking about him one shotting Zoom with a Bullrush.
Because Surfer can bullrush somebody who Wally West even while amped could only see as a blur ? Somebody who can control how fast he is moving compared to everything around him ? Because obviously Zoom can't just knock him off his board and even if he did, Surfer's awesome h2h capabilities would make him able to handle him.
I'm trying really hard not to insult you, and I usually can't stand discussing with fanbo..ahem.. fans.. so you'll have to excuse me for stopping this discussion at this point.
Originally posted by Kris Blaze
So can Wally.Now that I look back, that was part of Jay's point. It doesn't matter how fast you are, Zoom only has to WANT to be faster. He exists in a different time frame. Beings like Grandmaster or even more powerful, Odin, can reach outside of their own time-frame and such. Whether or not the Surfer can do this?
That's up to Goob.
So he exist in a different time frame... you mean kinda like Sentry? Does that mean that we assume no one can hit Sentry based off of logic, or do we still go by feats and showings? If it's the latter, when has Zoom reacted to something moving at 1,000 times lightspeed?
Originally posted by darthgoober
So he exist in a different time frame... you mean kinda like Sentry? Does that mean that we assume no one can hit Sentry based off of logic, or do we still go by feats and showings? If it's the latter, when has Zoom reacted to something moving at 1,000 times lightspeed?
What's this about Sentry?
And it doesn't matter how fast or slow Zoom's opponent's moves, he moves ahead of them....
Originally posted by Philosophía
Because Surfer can bullrush somebody who Wally West even while amped could only see as a blur ? Somebody who can control how fast he is moving compared to everything around him ? Because obviously Zoom can't just knock him off his board and even if he did, Surfer's awesome h2h capabilities would make him able to handle him.I'm trying really hard not to insult you, and I usually can't stand discussing with fanbo..ahem.. fans.. so you'll have to excuse me for stopping this discussion at this point.
Originally posted by Kris Blaze
What's this about Sentry?And it doesn't matter how fast or slow Zoom's opponent's moves, he moves ahead of them....
Originally posted by darthgoober
Sentry exist in a different timeframe, that's why I brought up the comparison. If that alone is enough to give someone the speed edge, it means that logically, Sentry can't be touched by Supes...
When Sentry displays that he's so too fast for the fastest man alive + the speed of 2 other flashes, we'll start talking.
http://img149.imageshack.us/img149/7814/flashv2200page09bc6.jpg (galen)
Originally posted by Kris Blaze
When Sentry displays that he's so too fast for the fastest man alive + the speed of 2 other flashes, we'll start talking.http://img149.imageshack.us/img149/7814/flashv2200page09bc6.jpg (galen)
Originally posted by Kris Blaze
It doesn't matter how fast you are, Zoom only has to WANT to be faster.
inaccurate. zoom could NOT exceed flash's speed once flash recited the formula.
Originally posted by Philosophía
Because Surfer can bullrush somebody who Wally West even while amped could only see as a blur ?
inaccurate. amped enough flash was EVEN with him and fought him h2h. what's more--flash has gone FASTER. he didn't even enter the SF while fighting zoom.
Originally posted by darthgoober
How fast was Wally moving when he saw Zoom as a blur?
lightspeed.
SS doesnt need to be able to physically react to zoom. All he would need to do is perceive him and he would be able to throw up a forcefield(which he does with a thought). While the flashes senses are sped up, they r still regular human senses. SS senses are sped up and advanced far beyond regular human senses(both traditional senses and cosmic senses). His cosmic sense will instantly alert him to the presence of Zoom even if he cant see him with his traditional senses. SS could then create a forcefield (which he does with a thought) which would pretty much be the end of Zoom.
http://img90.imageshack.us/img90/3006/silversurfer199612206jx3.jpg
Here SS races past billions and billions of stars and is able to focus upon each of them. Though each star appears to him as only a spark of light , he is able to note the position of each and calculate his position in the universe. This feat is relevant because it shows how fast SS traditional perception is and how far greater the speed of SS thought process is of his already uber fast perceptions. SS is able to focus on each of the billions and billions of stars he passes, though they appear only as sparks of light(which is a testament to the speed he is moving at), the fact that he is able to visually perceive and focus on each and every spark is extremely impressive. However it is even more impressive that even after only seeing sparks of light, he is able to mentally note each of their positions and simultaneously use them to calculate his position in the universe. His mental processing and reaction speed and is therefore much greater than that of his visual perception.
Hence if SS is even able to visually perceive zoom slightly (whether as blur,flash of yellow,etc), his mental speed will enable him create a forcefield in time to defend against zooms attack. Since SS perceptions are highly enhanced as well as sped up (unlike flash whose perceptions are only sped up ), visually perceiving zoom even for the slightest of moments is certainly a possibility. That however is not even of great importance considering that SS non-traditional senses i.e his cosmic sense will immediately alert him to zooms presence. Hence even if he cant see zoom in the slightest he would still be able to erect a forcefield (which is done mentally) as soon as he is aware of zooms presence via his cosmic senses (which will be immediately).
Originally posted by darthgoober
Well if we're going off feats and showings rather than logic, when has Zoom reacted to something moving at 1,000 times lightspeed?
You're not listening.
Zoom exists AHEAD of our time. Evidently Sentry's different timeframe doesn't make a difference, and he cannot CONTROL SAID TIMEFRAME.
Zoom can.
Originally posted by darthgoober
Sentry exist in a different timeframe, that's why I brought up the comparison. If that alone is enough to give someone the speed edge, it means that logically, Sentry can't be touched by Supes...
Originally posted by Kris Blaze
You're not listening.Zoom exists AHEAD of our time. Evidently Sentry's different timeframe doesn't make a difference, and he cannot CONTROL SAID TIMEFRAME.
Zoom can.
where are you getting this? a character's speculation? if someone can move fast enough, they can (and have) battle zoom on an even footing. and even if ss can only APPROACH his speed, zoom's punching power would be geometrically LESS than what it would be were ss standing still. zoom could hit him a BILLION times but without the momentum gained from his speed advantage, each blow would be meaningless. worse in fact--each blow would simply tell ss where zoom is.
Originally posted by leonidas
where are you getting this? a character's speculation? if someone can move fast enough, they can (and have) battle zoom on an even footing. and even if ss can only APPROACH his, zoom's punching power would be geometrically LESS than what it would be were ss standing still. zoom could hit him a BILLION times but without the momentum gained from his speed advantage, each blow would be meaningless. worse in fact--each blow would simply tell ss where zoom is.
http://img149.imageshack.us/img149/7814/flashv2200page09bc6.jpg
"He can control how fast or slow he moves ahead in time"
Originally posted by Kris Blaze
http://img149.imageshack.us/img149/7814/flashv2200page09bc6.jpg"He can control how fast or slow he moves ahead in time"
"COULD have been derailed."
regardless of the explanation it has been shown on panel that if one goes fast enough, one can not only see him, but match him and battle him on equal footing. with ss's ability to perceive time, he could say if jay was right or not, but it doesn't change the fact that with enough speed, zoom's speed can be equalled.
