Hiller, Iceman and Maverick.....

Impediment, you can clearly see the nonsense in the criteria for this thread.

You are not a fool, you are a logical, unbiased moderator. His criteria is ridiculous, it doesn't work and it defies sense.

Handicaps are ridiculous when they are so retarded and extreme. This thread should be locked.

The only one who feels it works is Ariel and Mon, kind of. Nobody else finds it cool, and by the way, you've endured this before. You've gotten continual complaints about Rogue Jedi's inability to comprehend what makes a decent thread and how his inability to accept his misgivings causes threads like this.

It's about time you did something about it.

He says he has no issue with someone saying who wins or whatever, but when we do, he says "No but that's not allowed because I said so and it's my thread and I'm allowed to change what I want.". You are the moderator and you have already disagree with his opinion and agreed with ours.

You should get rid of gimping. It's not helping the forum and more debates here are about gimping than they are about the actual characters.

-AC

Okay, let me say this, having read posts by AC and RJ:

RJ: I have to agree the other party that your handicaps are, unfortunately, very restricting. I'm not going to use the term "gimped", because, honestly, I don't like that term. I appreciate you coming to me with your complaints, however, people do have the right to post their opinions in your thread that you made. If I told AC that he was not allowed to post in here because his opinions, however blunt they may be, I would be wrong.

AC: The only thing I have to ask of you, sir, is that you refrain from such bold and, sometimes, blunt opinions. You are a good debater, I have to admit. However, you sometimes tend to go for the throat, if you get my drift. I can't lock this thread, because I would be just as much in the wrong had I, for example, sided with RJ to ask you to not post in here simply because you don't agree with his posts.

Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
should get rid of gimping. It's not helping the forum and more debates here are about gimping than they are about the actual characters.

-AC

When you say "gimping", do you mean very one sided (spite) fights, or things that violate MVF rule #7?

Originally posted by Impediment
Okay, let me say this, having read posts by AC and RJ:

RJ: I have to agree the other party that your handicaps are, unfortunately, very restricting. I'm not going to use the term "gimped", because, honestly, I don't like that term. I appreciate you coming to me with your complaints, however, people do have the right to post their opinions in your thread that you made. If I told AC that he was not allowed to post in here because his opinions, however blunt they may be, I would be wrong.

AC: The only thing I have to ask of you, sir, is that you refrain from such bold and, sometimes, blunt opinions. You are a good debater, I have to admit. However, you sometimes tend to go for the throat, if you get my drift. I can't lock this thread, because I would be just as much in the wrong had I, for example, sided with RJ to ask you to not post in here simply because you don't agree with his posts.

I agree that I brought SS and the others way down, but it was only in the interest of giving the Earth pilots a fighting chance. What's wrong with that? I said they all have the same max speed in the OP, because if SS and his posse are at full strength,, duh, Hiller and the others are pwned epically in minutes. Piloting skill, that's what I set out for.

Originally posted by Impediment
AC: The only thing I have to ask of you, sir, is that you refrain from such bold and, sometimes, blunt opinions. You are a good debater, I have to admit. However, you sometimes tend to go for the throat, if you get my drift. I can't lock this thread, because I would be just as much in the wrong had I, for example, sided with RJ to ask you to not post in here simply because you don't agree with his posts.

I'm not going to refrain from holding any kind of opinion. This isn't a forum full of kids. Ariel is approaching 40 and you're much older than me, too.

Mon doesn't take what I say seriously, and he's 26.

We're not children. So there's no need to comfort blanket them. If the aforementioned people can't take my opinions, then that's honestly tough shit, would you not agree? They're grown ass men ALLEGEDLY. By age at least. Don't you think it's a bit perverse asking a 23 year old male to stop going for the throat of a near 40 year old one? Surely he can handle himself.

You've seen the way he posts. At least I post on topic, no matter how vehement I am. He sits there replying AT me, not TO me, with YouTube videos and nonsense.

As for the previous quote; I think that if a thread's participants need SEVERE handicapping to make the fight possible, it shouldn't be allowed.

This thread, for example. If the only way a discussion or fight can be had is by severely, illogically and retardedly crippling the stance of another, then don't allow it.

Captain America Vs Darth Maul, say. To say "They don't have a shield or a sabre respectively.", that would be taking away something from BOTH opponents, yet...they would still be able to have a conceivably entertaining battle without any dumb criteria.

This one is a prime example of how NOT to do it. So is his Bob Lee Swagger thread. Other people gimp too, it is NOT just Ariel, but at the same time he is most prominent.

Also, he fails time and time again to grasp WHY it's stupid. Evidenced here;

Originally posted by Rogue Jedi
I agree that I brought SS and the others way down, but it was only in the interest of giving the Earth pilots a fighting chance. What's wrong with that? I said they all have the same max speed in the OP, because if SS and his posse are at full strength,, duh, Hiller and the others are pwned epically in minutes. Piloting skill, that's what I set out for.

WHY do you still not get it?

"I brought him down because otherwise the rest would get pwned.". EXACTLY.

So then instead of INSISTING on an unworkable-unless-gimped fight, why not just think of a fight that's workable without gimping?

Please tell me why you do not get that.

-AC

I'm not here to hold any hands or powder anyone's butt, AC. Age means nothing to me, rather maturity does. A member came to me and asked me, a moderator, to step in and ask for you to, hopefully, not be so blunt. Simple.

As far as my opinions go on RJ's threads, well.............that is why I consider myself to be an un-biased mod: I don't take sides or throw my opinions.

I love debating in the MVF, and I consider myself a nerd who loves discussing such scenarios.

Seriously, if you have issues with "gimping" and other such spite topics, why not just go to the MVF Social Thread and we will discuss it there? That's why I made it.

Originally posted by Impediment
When you say "gimping", do you mean very one sided (spite) fights, or things that violate MVF rule #7?

When a thread is made where one character clearly has every advantage and then ridiculous amounts of down-grading is done until that character loses and that is the strict reason for the thread, to have that character lose, that is the problem.

Slight modes like taking away weapons to have H2H fights etc isn't the problem.

Originally posted by Robtard
When a thread is made where one character clearly has every advantage and then ridiculous amounts of down-grading is done until that character loses and that is the strict reason for the thread, to have that character lose, that is the problem.

Slight modes like taking away weapons to have H2H fights etc isn't the problem.

So, again, we have a spite issue here?

How would you recommend we try to solve this?

There is no solving it. Either we allow the thread starter to handicap as they see fit, or allow no handicapping at all. There is no grey area.

If the rule is altered to "Well, handicapping is allowed ONLY to a certain point", just imagine the shitstorm.

Originally posted by Impediment
So, again, we have a spite issue here?

How would you recommend we try to solve this?

I say nothing, as I have no problem telling RJ (and others) why their gimping fails.

Originally posted by Rogue Jedi
There is no solving it. Either we allow the thread starter to handicap as they see fit, or allow no handicapping at all. There is no grey area.

If the rule is altered to "Well, handicapping is allowed ONLY to a certain point", just imagine the shitstorm.

By that logic, then, how would I, as a mod, handle it when other posters chime in and start to wail on said thread settings?

My goal is to be as fair as I can, all the while not taking sides.

Sometimes I feel as if I am being pushed by both sides to, in fact, take a side.

I will only take sides if I feel that I absolutely have to.

I mean, this is why we debate, right?

Originally posted by Impediment
By that logic, then, how would I, as a mod, handle it when other posters chime in and start to wail on said thread settings?

My goal is to be as fair as I can, all the while not taking sides.

Sometimes I feel as if I am being pushed by both sides to, in fact, take a side.

I will only take sides if I feel that I absolutely have to.

I mean, this is why we debate, right?

Then in that case, when people complain to you, come in, objectively view the thread; take into account the opposing viewpoints and tell the retarded people/side they're wrong.

Then end the thread. (or not)

Originally posted by Impediment
By that logic, then, how would I, as a mod, handle it when other posters chime in and start to wail on said thread settings?

My goal is to be as fair as I can, all the while not taking sides.

Sometimes I feel as if I am being pushed by both sides to, in fact, take a side.

I will only take sides if I feel that I absolutely have to.

I mean, this is why we debate, right?

They shouldn't "wail", they should either accept the conditions or not post at all. If no MVF rules are being broken, then their "wailing" is a moot point.

I start all my threads with a certain set of conditions. If I **** up and misjudge the playing field, then I am completely open to any and all thoughts on new conditions, or altering the current ones. Rob knows this. sadako knows this. Or, of it is obvious right away a certain side wins, then I am also open to new conditions to create an even playing field. This comes in handy when I rush making a thread and don't think things through, making it one sided by mistake.

This thread, it is as close as we can get to an even playing field, that's why I handicapped SS and crew.

With all due respect, Ariel's last post is absolute horseshit.

For one, he should stop "rushing" in his thread creation and avoid thinking things through.

Two, Impediment, look at this and make a decision. You're a mod, and nothing's getting done here. It's a simple premise.

He continually makes threads that are spite driven or gimped to retardation. His excuse is "If I didn't gimp it, it'd be pointless.", EXACTLY. If it's pointless, stop making them, focus on making threads that do NOT REQUIRE handicapping to this degree or gimping to this degree.

Do you understand what I'm saying? If the only way THIS thread can happen is with such retarded criteria, why not...just...make one that isn't as retarded? If people spend more time discussing the criteria of a battle than the battle itself, then obviously there's an issue.

What you SHOULD do is just say that there's no gimping in either direction. If you have to handicap someone so a thread will work, not to make it more interesting, but so it will WORK, then it obviously needs to be closed.

The whole "They should just not post." bs is dumb. If we'd not posted, what would have happened? Wasted thread that nobody wants to partake in because it's retarded. Ariel obviously has a thing for gimped threads, people have complained about this time and time again, Impediment.

So if it were ignored NOW, it would have come up again in time.

The solution is that you need to stop handicaps. They need to be removed from this forum. You can have plenty of fun discussion without them. It will cause people to put more thought into the threads they create, too.

"Oh wait, I can't create a *Gimp thread* because handicaps are gone. Guess I have to pick a more creative, workable alternative.". Unlike Ariel, who just types names and presses "Post Thread".

It's the best solution and you know it is.

-AC

Relax. Take a pill.

Originally posted by Rogue Jedi
They shouldn't "wail", they should either accept the conditions or not post at all. If no MVF rules are being broken, then their "wailing" is a moot point.

I start all my threads with a certain set of conditions. If I **** up and misjudge the playing field, then I am completely open to any and all thoughts on new conditions, or altering the current ones. Rob knows this. sadako knows this. Or, of it is obvious right away a certain side wins, then I am also open to new conditions to create an even playing field. This comes in handy when I rush making a thread and don't think things through, making it one sided by mistake.

Not to take sides, but this seems to be very logical.

If someone is a dumbass and makes a simple mistake, just alter the thread conditions.

I've done it before in a Voldemort thread. I forgot one major detail that allowed an easy win, or something.

If someone forgets, in AC's scenario, to remove Captain America's shield, but remove the Jedi's saber, then it is perfectly understandable to go back and correct that mistake, which is what RJ is saying.

However, that would be gimping the Jedi as the saber is extremely important to their ability to fight. It is integral and symbolic, for thousands of years, to a Jedi. It is almost an extension of the Jedi. To remove it would be to horribly gimp them. Captain America, on the other hand, is a trained martial artist, his extreme durability, super strength, etc. He is a beast without his shield, and has fought quite a few times without it.

See how it works, AC? Do you see how gimping can be interpreted from a different set of opinions?

And, no, I think Robtard has done a good job at NOT gimping people and going along with scenarios.

Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
Two, Impediment, look at this and make a decision. You're a mod, and nothing's getting done here. It's a simple premise.

-AC

Dude. Cool it. Stop being an a**hole. Imp's doing plenty.

Originally posted by dadudemon
However, that would be gimping the Jedi as the saber is extremely important to their ability to fight. It is integral and symbolic, for thousands of years, to a Jedi. It is almost an extension of the Jedi. To remove it would be to horribly gimp them. Captain America, on the other hand, is a trained martial artist, his extreme durability, super strength, etc. He is a beast without his shield, and has fought quite a few times without it.

So Jedi are nothing without their weapons? No.

Captain America's shield is every bit as essential, iconic and integral to his fighting style, this is seen in the movies.

Either way, he isn't saying what I'm saying.

Originally posted by dadudemon
See how it works, AC? Do you see how gimping can be interpreted from a different set of opinions?

No, gimping to Ariel's degree is dumb.

Hence why Imp is going to get rid of handicaps and/or gimping.

-AC

I see gimping a lot in the Games Vs and some of it is understandable, but nothing that goes so far as to force the participants to ignore the laws of physics just to qualify for any form of discussion.

Originally posted by Rogue Jedi
There is no solving it. Either we allow the thread starter to handicap as they see fit, or allow no handicapping at all. There is no grey area.

If the rule is altered to "Well, handicapping is allowed ONLY to a certain point", just imagine the shitstorm.

Wrong. Now I am I guess the "newest" poster on the MVF and that's fine, however throughout my time here I have noticed that RJ does not only "handicap" his threads from the beginning, but if someone does win with logic he goes on to further handicap shit. Shouldn't it just be established that you can only severely **** a side over once and if they still win then just accept it and move on? I'm not here to start shit with people I like these silly little scenarios for some reason, and they kill downtime. But when I post a relevant point sometimes I will only say RJ in this case because I've had situations with him it doesn't really get retaliated with logic. He tries to counteract such statement with another "handicaping" or unlogical statement. Pardon my typos. It's late. I have a paper to write, and I just got pulled over by the ****in police 15 minutes ago so im pissed.