Originally posted by Branlor Swift
That was an Imperiex Probe Brainiac was fighting.
Waverider stated an Imperiex Probe tracked their "temporal wake," but we see a smaller, different colored Probe around the classic Imperiex Prime design. And what B13 fights is far bigger than an Imperiex Probe. I don't recall the Probes getting larger.
Originally posted by Delta1938
Waverider stated an Imperiex Probe tracked their "temporal wake," but we see a smaller, different colored Probe around the classic Imperiex Prime design. And what B13 fights is far bigger than an Imperiex Probe. I don't recall the Probes getting larger.
You can see the Probe growing in the same page. 😬
And his design "changed" even after he was big. Big Penises protruded out of him, and then they didn't.
Also, Superboy one shotted a Brainiac in that comic too...
Originally posted by Branlor Swift
You can see the Probe growing in the same page. 😬And his design "changed" even after he was big. Big Penises protruded out of him, and then they didn't.
I was referring to in other comics, coupled with we see two different Imperiex designs in the background when Waverider states a Probe(just "Probe," not "Probes"😉 has tracked them, one smaller than the other(although we can't tell the distance they're from each other).
Originally posted by Branlor Swift
Also, Superboy one shotted a Brainiac in that comic too...
He one-shotted a Brainiac-13, like an equivalent to a Probe. Waverider states how B13 "downloaded" himself through the time stream, and "--spreading his consciousness across a THOUSAND million vectors to engage the OMNI-TEMPORAL assaults of his rival Imperiex." The B13 Superboy one-shot was in ancient times and completely mechanical(I even saw what looked like a vacuum tube!!), where B13 was made-up of nanobots in the Y2K storyline.
Originally posted by Delta1938And that other Probe only appeared in the background in one panel.
I was referring to in other comics, coupled with we see two different Imperiex designs in the background when Waverider states a Probe(just "Probe," not "Probes"😉 has tracked them, one smaller than the other(although we can't tell the distance they're from each other).He one-shotted a Brainiac-13, like an equivalent to a Probe. Waverider states how B13 "downloaded" himself through the time stream, and "--spreading his consciousness across a THOUSAND million vectors to engage the OMNI-TEMPORAL assaults of his rival Imperiex." The B13 Superboy one-shot was in ancient times and completely mechanical(I even saw what looked like a vacuum tube!!), where B13 was made-up of nanobots in the Y2K storyline.
So why are you comparing that Brainiac to the main Brainiac that was stuffed with Warworld then, even if it wasn't a Probe? One was an appendage on Warworld while many others existed, and one was shown to be the only Brainiac in that universe that laid dormant while he did Brainiac stuff.
And that's another thing, that useless appendage Brainiac on Warworld (where there were a crazy amount of them) only seemed about what he was in the Y2K storyline. Not Imperiex level.
Originally posted by Branlor Swift
And that other Probe only appeared in the background in one panel.
And what's to say that wasn't the scout? Why would two Probes be present when Wavrider only mentions one tracking?
Originally posted by Branlor Swift
The small Probe looked exactly like the giant Probe that he was shown growing into. That's probably the most important part. It was either a Probe, or Imperiex grew out of a Probe...
Could be. Could be Imperiex himself/itself changes size.
Originally posted by Branlor Swift
So why are you comparing that Brainiac to the main Brainiac that was stuffed with Warworld then, even if it wasn't a Probe? One was an appendage on Warworld while many others existed, and one was shown to be the only Brainiac in that universe that laid dormant while he did Brainiac stuff.
Maybe I'm over-thinking it, but it seems like Brainiac-13 in the present day of OWAW stopped all that stuff in YJ: OWAW when he took Imperiex Prime's power. So that was the "real" Brainiac-13.
Originally posted by Branlor Swift
And that's another thing, that useless appendage Brainiac on Warworld (where there were a crazy amount of them) only seemed about what he was in the Y2K storyline. Not Imperiex level.
er Superman looked to be physically stronger than B13 in the one time I can recall them actually engaging during Y2K, and then he's matching Superman. B13 was amped by Warworld, the Imperiex energy and connection to Apokolips. He talked about Imperiex's power was now his. Unless you're arguing B13 looked just as powerful in OWAW as in Y2K because of Superman being the only one to be compared to when he performed better in a relative strength showing against a more powerful Superman? Or is there anything else you're referring to that I can't recall?
Originally posted by Delta1938Hell, it's not even confirmed it's two (especially if you're so into the wording). It could have just been showing it was flying and then it landed.
And what's to say that wasn't the scout? Why would two Probes be present when Wavrider only mentions one tracking?
Though I fail to see what two could mean seeing as it doesn't point to Imperiex Prime in any way.
Originally posted by Delta1938
Could be. Could be Imperiex himself/itself changes size.
Originally posted by Delta1938That doesn't even make sense.
Maybe I'm over-thinking it, but it seems like Brainiac-13 in the present day of OWAW stopped all that stuff in YJ: OWAW when he took Imperiex Prime's power. So that was the "real" Brainiac-13.
Originally posted by Delta1938Y2K Brainiac was way above him in AC 723, though that's understandable. In Superman 154 he knocked him a good distance into Metallo. Energy Superman going all out got toyed with by Brainiac and then killed in AoS 576. Brainiac had Superman completely at his mercy until Eradicator saved him and Brainiac teleported away because he had no data on Eradicator in MoS 98.
er Superman looked to be physically stronger than B13 in the one time I can recall them actually engaging during Y2K, and then he's matching Superman. B13 was amped by Warworld, the Imperiex energy and connection to Apokolips. He talked about Imperiex's power was now his. Unless you're arguing B13 looked just as powerful in OWAW as in Y2K because of Superman being the only one to be compared to when he performed better in a relative strength showing against a more powerful Superman? Or is there anything else you're referring to that I can't recall?
Y2K level sounds about right. He was just a Brainiac drone at that point when he was on Warworld. Had he transformed into a giant Brainiac that would have been another story.
The real feat comes from that Brainiac drone being about Superman level, and then Sundipped Superman effortlessly ripping him apart (though with a big surprise attack). Not Superman matching two Imperiex Prime level beings stacked on top of each other...
Jesus Christ. The guy got his arm broken by a Probe even after the Doomsday fiasco. There's no way he jumps up that much with no other powerups.
Originally posted by Branlor Swift
Hell, it's not even confirmed it's two (especially if you're so into the wording). It could have just been showing it was flying and then it landed.
Though I fail to see what two could mean seeing as it doesn't point to Imperiex Prime in any way.
Or it could be a Probe, like absolutely everything points to.[/B][/QUOTE]
We see two beings in the background. Waverider states an Imperiex Probe. That it tracked their temporal wake. The war was through-out the time stream. Looking at it, it seems there was nothing at the point in time B13 was at BUT Brainiac-13 when YJ enters. What I'm saying is the Probe mentioned was the scout.
Originally posted by Branlor Swift
That doesn't even make sense.
When Imperiex Prime was punctured and B13 took his energy, that was just the start of what would be Superman causing the Big Bang by pushing Warworld to the beginning of time and Imperiex's energy became the universe. If Imperiex Prime wasn't around after that, how could he/it be in the future fighting B13?
Originally posted by Branlor Swift
Y2K Brainiac was way above him in AC 723, though that's understandable.
You mean #763(oddly enough, Brainiac does appear in an apparent flashback in #723)? Not sure how knocking him through a building with an apparent energy blast and nanobots not bruising proves superior strength.
Originally posted by Branlor Swift
In Superman 154 he knocked him a good distance into Metallo.
Knocking someone back doesn't prove superiority, as it often happens in fights between Top-Tiers. If he'd done it with a slap, that'd be one thing. But it looks like he did it as a double fisted attack. This was right after Superman caught B13's punch.
Originally posted by Branlor Swift
Energy Superman going all out got toyed with by Brainiac and then killed in AoS 576.
That's nice and all, but irrelevant because I was referring to pure strength. Hence the punch catch Superman did that I pointed to.
Originally posted by Branlor Swift
Brainiac had Superman completely at his mercy until Eradicator saved him and Brainiac teleported away because he had no data on Eradicator in MoS 98.
Sucker punch to the back of the head had him messed-up, then B13 used tentacles to restrain him briefly while his head was still foggy before Eradicator jumped in. It wasn't exactly like he was held a lengthy amount of time.
Originally posted by Branlor Swift
Y2K level sounds about right. He was just a Brainiac drone at that point when he was on Warworld. Had he transformed into a giant Brainiac that would have been another story.Your examples didn't really fit the example I showed. Blasting, fighting energy Supes, knocking him back, and sucker punching him before the tentacles aren't the comparisons for strength locking I was referring to. And I also was asking for examples from OWAW. The only thing I remember for B13 to compare after Imperiex Prime was the strength lock while B13 talks about how Imperiex's power is now his.
[QUOTE=14599789]Originally posted by Branlor Swift
[B]The real feat comes from that Brainiac drone being about Superman level, and then Sundipped Superman effortlessly ripping him apart (though with a big surprise attack). Not Superman matching two Imperiex Prime level beings stacked on top of each other...Jesus Christ. The guy got his arm broken by a Probe even after the Doomsday fiasco. There's no way he jumps up that much with no other powerups.
You do realize Superman went from not being able to do much to the Imperiex Probes with his punches and having to combine heat vision and freeze breathe to cause crack in them, to casually one-shotting them with punches and heat vision(bursting right through them, not just cracking them)? There's a whole bunch of narration in one page of AOS #584(I think it was) about how now in his mindset they're so easy. Hell, you don't even want to get into what the author said about Superman in that state of mind.
And it doesn't help your argument about a Probe breaking his arm that it happened off-panel.
Originally posted by Delta1938Like I said it could have just been the Probe flying. Indicated by the other Probe never being seen again. Indicated by the words backing up their only being one Probe.
We see two beings in the background. Waverider states an Imperiex Probe. That it tracked their temporal wake. The war was through-out the time stream. Looking at it, it seems there was nothing at the point in time B13 was at BUT Brainiac-13 when YJ enters. What I'm saying is the Probe mentioned was the scout.
I still fail to see how that indicates Imperiex Prime grew out of the Probe though. There could have been hundreds of Probes, that's utterly meaningless if you can't prove Imperiex was actually there.
Originally posted by Delta1938
When Imperiex Prime was punctured and B13 took his energy, that was just the start of what would be Superman causing the Big Bang by pushing Warworld to the beginning of time and Imperiex's energy became the universe. If Imperiex Prime wasn't around after that, how could he/it be in the future fighting B13?
Originally posted by Delta1938
You mean #763(oddly enough, Brainiac does appear in an apparent flashback in #723)? Not sure how knocking him through a building with an apparent energy blast and nanobots not bruising proves superior strength.
Either way:
If he'd done it with a slap, that'd be one thing.
- Delta1938
http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o106/bigbran1/Superman/ActionComics763p04.jpg
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Originally posted by Delta1938Superman caught a punch at like the end of Brainiac's punch that came nowhere near his face. And then he got knocked away at the end of it. End fight. How that proves Superman was stronger is anyone's guess.
Knocking someone back doesn't prove superiority, as it often happens in fights between Top-Tiers. If he'd done it with a slap, that'd be one thing. But it looks like he did it as a double fisted attack. This was right after Superman caught B13's punch.That's nice and all, but irrelevant because I was referring to pure strength. Hence the punch catch Superman did that I pointed to.
Sucker punch to the back of the head had him messed-up, then B13 used tentacles to restrain him briefly while his head was still foggy before Eradicator jumped in. It wasn't exactly like he was held a lengthy amount of time.
That's nice and all, but I'm just trying to pin down what you could have possibly been talking about since Superman didn't look better than Brainiac in any of their fights in that arc.
I know it was a sucker punch, but that fight again didn't show Superman being stronger.
Basically, you want to use one panel of Superman catching a punch that ended in him getting smacked away to try and paint a picture of how superior Superman was.
I bet if Superman would have landed a shot that knocked Brainiac away he would have been heralded as way stronger.
In four fights where Superman doesn't look so hot in any of them, one panel is the deciding factor apparently.
Originally posted by Delta1938I literally just said that.
You do realize Superman went from not being able to do much to the Imperiex Probes with his punches and having to combine heat vision and freeze breathe to cause crack in them, to casually one-shotting them with punches and heat vision(bursting right through them, not just cracking them)? There's a whole bunch of narration in one page of AOS #584(I think it was) about how now in his mindset they're so easy. Hell, you don't even want to get into what the author said about Superman in that state of mind.And it doesn't help your argument about a Probe breaking his arm that it happened off-panel.
But Superman was not in that state of mind when he encountered Brainiac, or all throughout the series. As indicated by even after the Doomsday teamup he got his arm broken by a Probe. That was a one issue mindset.
It doesn't help your argument that it happened by Superman's own words. Unless you think the fight that was purely physical had the Probe bust out an arm breaking beam.
But yes, go on and tell me how two Probes means Imperiex was there. And how Superman beating up Probes easier in one issue means he could match Imperiex + Brainiac's power. Among other things that I'm seeing huge leaps in logic in
Basically, imagine you are right in your assertions. Now actually tie that together in why that means why you think it does. Why would Superman crushing Probes mean he could stalemate Imperiex plus for example.
Originally posted by carver9facepalm
Uummmm, where is the matching? I'm seeing Superman and Brainiac holding each other while talking but I'm not seeing anyone matching each other.Now THIS is matching AND overpowering. You see this handsome old guy right here. Well, he is the Elder of the freaking Universe. Not only does he match his strength, Hulk overpowers him. Then he grab the gem and throws it to the core of the planet.
http://s388.photobucket.com/user/OneDumbG0/media/Hulk%20Strength/SavageHulkPressing10248.jpg.html
That's overpowering...not what you showed me. Again, no one is saying that Superman is weak because he isn't and the rest, I'm not even going to respond to it but I do know one thing, Savage Hulk has fts that match Superman strength fts and he is one of the weaker Hulks, weaker than majority on that list. Anyone above him should steam roll Superman, especially WWH and WBH but again, that's my opinion.
Originally posted by carver9
I understand that but I'm not seeing struggle between either and this doesn't include both of them being connected via the tubes. There is obviously more going on during that scene other than two people trying to overpower the other.
You'll really use any excuse you can, won't you.
Sundipped Superman overpowered the full trust of the war world engines, which at the time were powered by Braniac 13 and Imperex Prime as both were basically the planet.
Not sure if this is what it is been discussed here, but it was stated on the comic. Superman, sundipped did overpower the stacked power of B13 and IP.
Sundipped Superman will for sure clear the second round
Originally posted by LordofBrooklynIt is vastly overrated IMO. Hulk at his best is superior to Superman both in strength, ferocity, healing ability, and portrayal wise IMO.
[B]NO!You WILL acknowledge the Warworld feat as one of the greatest events in the history of fiction! [/B]
Hulk unleashed in HOTM would put Superman in a body bag.
Originally posted by quanchi112
It is vastly overrated IMO. Hulk at his best is superior to Superman both in strength, ferocity, healing ability, and portrayal wise IMO.Hulk unleashed in HOTM would put Superman in a body bag.
Strength - Superman is stronger at default and with a Sundip he will massacre any version of the Hulk.
Ferocity - A snarling beast doesn't compare to saving the cosmos constantly the way Superman does.
Healing ability - When you're as powerful as Superman you don't get hurt often enough to display your healing ability.
Originally posted by LordofBrooklynBased on what strength feats ?
[B]Strength - Superman is stronger at default and with a Sundip he will massacre any version of the Hulk.Ferocity - A snarling beast doesn't compare to saving the cosmos constantly the way Superman does.
Healing ability - When you're as powerful as Superman you don't get hurt often enough to display your healing ability. [/B]
You don't understand what ferocity means. You are ignoring the definition and trying to change what it is I said with something irrelevant to the word.
He gets hurt all the time. Thing is when he does he can't heal like the Hulk can. Greater healing properties. Another massive advantage for the Hulk.
