Batman vs Rhino

Originally posted by psycho gundam
nobody's saying batman can't win, it's just that rhino just needs to land one solid blow (or glancing for that matter) to start the shitball rolling down hill for batman.

rhino is quite quick, he's just entirely one dimensional. against the offensive power of batman though, the strength, speed, and durability of the rhino especially with his newer suit should spell a victory for him more times than not.

There are many moot arguments here. I'm pretty sure Rhino can win a few. With that being said the key thing in this fight is

Rhinos uncovered face vs. Batman's gadgets, skill, and agility.

Batman has smoke bombs (to prevent Rhino from seeing), knock out gas, highly powerful explosive bombs (which can be generously applied or thrown to Rhinos face), and a formidable batarang (which the corner of it can be applied to Rhinos eyes with a throw). Rhino is only quick linearly and after building up sufficient speed. He is never instant fast nor laterally fast.

Along with Batman's smarts, skills, etc. Rhino has enough dumbness for Batman to succeed more times than fail.

Originally posted by grimify
Your Batman hate is funny. 🙂

Originally posted by Raptor22
should a street leveler be able to ko or hurt bricks no. but they do. should people be able to fly, run ftl, turn invisable etc. no but they do. so to argue that even though bats or others do it consistantly it shouldnt count because it defys physics or something like that. should bats be able to hurt a high level brick no but he has so he has the powa to do so. should a person after being in a gamma explosion live and get super powers no. but it happend. it just is what it is, fictional stories where somethings dont make sense but thats how it is. serioulsy is bats sneaking up on supes much more unbelievable than a baby from another planet landing here, absorbing our sunlight and getting super powers?

eternalidol what are u arguing that its not a fictional universe or that anything cant happen. im not implying that because its fictional we can just make shit up. just that the things they have been shown to do on a consistant basis can be used here. it seems like ur saying that since bruce is a regular person he shouldnt be able to do the stuff he does. but the problem is hes not a regular person hes a made up character in a made up world and can do what ever the writers want him to. u might not like it but thats how it is.

i think some people get too hung up on the fact that these characters are regular humans. there not. they almost all can do things no real human can. if they limited them to a real humans powerset then almost all their feats would be disregarded. regular humans cant dodge bullets. batman is portrayed as a regular human but can dodge bullets. by your logic he couldnt in here because hes a human and dodging bullets isnt in a regular humans power set.

Originally posted by Phantom Zone
Prove it. You said that there are lots of examples that Cap isn't able to do this consistently enough. So feel free to list the examples of him not being able to stun and hurt bricks.

I can't be bothered to look for examples for either side of the argument, especially not now that I'm working overnight for the rest of the week. Maybe I'll look around later if nobody else has already posted a few by then.

Originally posted by Phantom Zone
Sorry mate you missed the point entirely. Bullseyes skills defies physics, so does Caps. You're basically picking and choosing what you like and contradicting yourself.

No, you simply ignored what I said earlier. Bullseye has dead-on accuracy and throws anything with a hell of a lot of force, enough so that you get these insane feats of breaking glass with a toothpick or knocking someone out with a paper airplane. That's his specified ability... that anything he throws is a weapon. Even still, there are limits as to how much damage his throws can do.

Cap, being a great fighter with some small degree of superhuman strength, can easily put a hurting on metas with lower-end durability. Of course, regardless of his skills, he'd be harder pressed to do so as his opponent's durability increases. His success against anyone with higher-end durability and strength is pretty farfetched, considering other characters who are nearly as skilled and almost as strong haven't had as much luck as he's had.

Originally posted by Phantom Zone
You think that maybe that some people are more skilled than others possibly?

Skills are not powers (excluding special cases like Karate Kid, Bullseye, Iron Fist, Mandarin, etc), but apparently popularity seems to grant all sorts of power.

Originally posted by Phantom Zone
Hey you quoted SMvFL not me, im simply showing you what it said. Anyway it was removed because they wanted the rules pruned not because it didn't apply.

Batman owes more to Superman's gullibility or indifference than to his own stealth for that.

Originally posted by Raptor22
eternalidol what are u arguing that its not a fictional universe or that anything cant happen. im not implying that because its fictional we can just make shit up. just that the things they have been shown to do on a consistant basis can be used here. it seems like ur saying that since bruce is a regular person he shouldnt be able to do the stuff he does. but the problem is hes not a regular person hes a made up character in a made up world and can do what ever the writers want him to. u might not like it but thats how it is.

Originally posted by Raptor22
i think some people get too hung up on the fact that these characters are regular humans. there not. they almost all can do things no real human can. if they limited them to a real humans powerset then almost all their feats would be disregarded. regular humans cant dodge bullets. batman is portrayed as a regular human but can dodge bullets. by your logic he couldnt in here because hes a human and dodging bullets isnt in a regular humans power set.

Originally posted by Eternal Idol
It's one thing do suspend disbelief for watching a human character kick a steel door down, or fight his or her way out of a mob..... but watching them put down a villain who is capable of slugging it out with a top-tier for a while or wrecking entire teams on their own, it's just too much to ask for. That's one reason for the PIS rule on this forum.

"Human" characters are capable of all sorts of things real humans would be hardpressed to accomplish... for example, Daredevil jumping across rooftops all night without really breaking a sweat. I understand that, but even with these abilities, they should have their limitations just as real people do. Just because they're comic characters doesn't negate the fact that they're still supposed to be human.

Originally posted by Eternal Idol
It's one thing do suspend disbelief for watching a human character kick a steel door down, or fight his or her way out of a mob..... but watching them put down a villain who is capable of slugging it out with a top-tier for a while or wrecking entire teams on their own, it's just too much to ask for. That's one reason for the PIS rule on this forum.

"Human" characters are capable of all sorts of things real humans would be hardpressed to accomplish... for example, Daredevil jumping across rooftops all night without really breaking a sweat. I understand that, but even with these abilities, they should have their limitations just as real people do. Just because they're comic characters doesn't negate the fact that they're still supposed to be human.

eternalidol i do see where ur coming from, but i respectfuly disagree. i see it as through training or whatever the writers use as a reason, that doing amazing things no human can is part of his powerset and he can do things no human can do too an extent. i think we disagree on to what extent that is.

Originally posted by Eternal Idol
It's one thing do suspend disbelief for watching a human character kick a steel door down, or fight his or her way out of a mob..... but watching them put down a villain who is capable of slugging it out with a top-tier for a while or wrecking entire teams on their own, it's just too much to ask for. That's one reason for the PIS rule on this forum.

"Human" characters are capable of all sorts of things real humans would be hardpressed to accomplish... for example, Daredevil jumping across rooftops all night without really breaking a sweat. I understand that, but even with these abilities, they should have their limitations just as real people do. Just because they're comic characters doesn't negate the fact that they're still supposed to be human.

Even though he does something all the time. It's PIS?

You'd suspend the disbelief about radioactivity giving powers instead of cancer, but not batman.

Dardevil can do things beyond a human's limits.. but not batman.

And we're not talking about this guy
YouTube video

Originally posted by Eternal Idol
I understand that, but even with these abilities, they should have their limitations just as real people do. Just because they're comic characters doesn't negate the fact that they're still supposed to be human.

Apparently you don't understand that. Being a comic book superhero is, by definition, being beyond what any human could even come close to doing.

Just because you don't like what a character can do doesn't make their consistent feats any less valid.

Originally posted by grimify
Apparently you don't understand that. Being a comic book superhero is, by definition, being beyond what any human could even come close to doing.

Just because you don't like what a character can do doesn't make their consistent feats any less valid.

but why is the Spiderman Firelord fight not counting then?

and Flash is considered to suffer to PIS in comics all the time

don't get me wrong I'm definately not hating Batman I just think too many people wank a bit too much on him

btw is there any definition what his standard equipment of his belt is?

Originally posted by Parmaniac

btw is there any definition what his standard equipment of his belt is?

Batman has everything in his belt. He is prepared for anything, he is batman afterall.

1. Batman always carries Kryptonite ring if Superman decides to attack him.
2. Explosives
...
165. Knockout gas and so on ...

i can't think of anything but knockout gas that would help

Originally posted by grimify

Just because you don't like what a character can do doesn't make their consistent feats any less valid.

Exactly its basically dictating what logic is in an illogical universe.

Originally posted by Eternal Idol
Reading comprehension beyond your grasp? I said that while Cap has all these feats, other skilled streets don't have that same record against bricks h2h. When they do win, it's usually due to plot device, and not because some technique of theirs somehow overcame the brick's durability.

What you said was that Cap had a jobber aura.

Originally posted by Eternal Idol
Karate Kid has "superkarate" from the future that can't be explained. He can also chi-amp, if I remember correctly. Cap has the Jobber aura.

I asked you to prove it. That in now way shows lack of reading comprehension.

Originally posted by Eternal Idol

I can't be bothered to look for examples for either side of the argument, especially not now that I'm working overnight for the rest of the week. Maybe I'll look around later if nobody else has already posted a few by then.

Your going to need to post more than a few, good luck.

Originally posted by Eternal Idol

No, you simply ignored what I said earlier. Bullseye has dead-on accuracy and throws anything with a hell of a lot of force, enough so that you get these insane feats of breaking glass with a toothpick or knocking someone out with a paper airplane. That's his specified ability... that anything he throws is a weapon. Even still, there are limits as to how much damage his throws can do.

No I didnt ignore anything, the bottom line is that you said it defied physics, this explanation of accuracy and speed is just and explanation as to why you think its acceptable. Anybody could provide an explanation as to why Cap is able to do what he does. Its the same thing just different examples.

Also when he throws paper eroplanes they are not thrown at high speed so speed and accuracy doesnt even begin to explain that.

Originally posted by Eternal Idol

Cap, being a great fighter with some small degree of superhuman strength, can easily put a hurting on metas with lower-end durability. Of course, regardless of his skills, he'd be harder pressed to do so as his opponent's durability increases. His success against anyone with higher-end durability and strength is pretty farfetched, considering other characters who are nearly as skilled and almost as strong haven't had as much luck as he's had.

They are not all nearly as skilled in the same things eg Shang is better at Chi, BP is more agile than Cap.

Originally posted by Eternal Idol
Not nearly enough to make a difference. Cap affecting bricks like the Hulk, while guys like Iron Fist and Karnak have miserably failed to phase him in the past is total bullshit any way you care to spin it.

Skills are not powers (excluding special cases like Karate Kid, Bullseye, Iron Fist, Mandarin, etc), but apparently popularity seems to grant all sorts of power.

Sorry mate just because Karnak and Iron fist failed to do it proves nothing. Caps shitloads of feats take precedence over Iron Fist and Karnak. Majority showings take priority over minority.

No Bullseyes skills is classifieds as a skill. Skills are not powers but they can clearly be a subsitute and just as effective as a power.

Originally posted by Eternal Idol

So then we're ignoring Superman's hearing much like the writers in the past did to work in Batman's favor? In spite of Superman later saying that it's been impossible for Batman to do so because he's always been able to hear him?

Batman owes more to Superman's gullibility or indifference than to his own stealth for that.

No im not all that proves is that Batman cant sneak up on Superman because its been retconned. That doesnt change the fact that SMvsFL allows for consistency of feats just not that particular one.

Another example is Wolverine, if you cut or even punch Wolverine he still gets cut and bruised. Logically when he gets punched by somebody with class 100 all his flesh should fly off his bones.

Also when a class 100 hundred person hits somebody of 200lbs they really should go off into orbit.

Theres lots of stuff that is illogical that people accept as logical but then want to split hairs. Im not completely against logic but since comics are pretty illogical scientifically I think the best option is to go for consistency of showings.

Originally posted by Phantom Zone

No im not all that proves is that Batman cant sneak up on Superman because its been retconned. That doesnt change the fact that SMvsFL allows for consistency of feats just not that particular one.

him being in the room with the JLA for an hour and no one noticing.
http://img106.imagevenue.com/img.php?loc=loc5&image=904_batstealth2.jpg
http://img41.imagevenue.com/img.php?image=36636_batstealth3_122_397lo.jpg#
Batman's gadgets allow him to hide from Superman.

Another cool thing to note from the scan - Superman can hear brain activity.

Dude, can't you use photobucket or something a bit more workfriendly?

You're bombarded with amateur teen sex webcam commercials as soon as click the images.

http://img240.imageshack.us/img240/9397/163up.jpg

"You're only a man dress dressed up in a bat costume."

"Wrong. He's Batman."

😉