Originally posted by Endless Mike
That's a retarded argument.Using that logic, prove my dick isn't omnipotent, it has just locked away most of its power. 😆
Are you dense, stupid, retarded?
I made a comment regarding the limitations of omnipotence. It was not trying to back up a particular character, that's you projecting your idiocy into my posts.
It's sad, because it's not like you don't understand what transpired between Batman and Mandrakk, you just reject it. Your brain seems to be rejecting what actually happened. It's just like you should by all rights understand, but for some reason you just refuse to. Morrison has laid down the law and told it like it is. You're refusing to accept this, claiming that because something which Morrison made happen, should not be possible if Mandrakk was omnipotent. Better yet, you managed to get tangled up in a debate here about the limits of omnipotence and selective omniscience. Where regardless of what you subscribe to, the comics has already provided their stance on the matter.
So simply put, shut the faluggle up and accept it. If you can't do that, go back to narutof..Stop, ignoretime.
Originally posted by Endless Mikethe primal monitor was not 'shocked' about anything, nor did it create dax novu [the first monitor] to 'protect' itself. primal monitor knew of the 'microscopic' multiverse, so it created dax to further investigate it's intricacies. nothing more, nothing less.
A truly omnipotent being would not be shocked by anything, nor would it need to create other beings to protect itself. No one here seems to grasp the actual concept of omnipotence.
as stated before, the primal monitor gathering information through it's 'probe' is a case of inherent omniscience. afterall, why would the PM care enough to use it's "infinite intelligence" on something so utterly insignificant? why would the PM care about something that hardly even bleeped on it's radar? why would the PM care when the probe's information got back to it? i mean, i don't care what one of my cells is doing at any given moment...
the fact is, EVERY other 'infinite' power throughout DC [be it mandrakk, CA superman, anti-monitor, mxy, spectre.... the whole damn DCU combined] are utterly insignificant in the face of the primal monitor. real world logic aside, how can you claim that the primal monitor is anything less than omnipotent [in the truest sense] when all the characters in DC comics are beneath it's notice, and microbial in comparison?
The Primal Monitor is beyond concepts such as in-story Omnipotence since the very concept of story itself (of which Cosmic Armor Superman and Mandrakk are the extremes of) is contained within himself, and even when characters incredibly powerfull characters such as Mandrakk come into direct contact with him they are effectivly erased from existence, until even the ideea of him is lost.
Like Grant Morrison described it (and Kevdude pointed out), he is the abstract, infinite intelligence inside which the infinitley smaller concept of 'story' is developed. (story which contains the like of Spectre, Lucifer, Michael etc.) No in-story scale actually applies to him, since the story itself and all its characters are infinitesimal compared to itself.
According to the nerds over at Comic Vine:
http://www.comicvine.com/dc-power-rankings/12-42222/
Looks like Mandrakk might have some problems! Ultimator ain't such a pussy afterall...
Originally posted by theICONiac
According to the nerds over at Comic Vine:http://www.comicvine.com/dc-power-rankings/12-42222/
Looks like Mandrakk might have some problems! Ultimator ain't such a pussy afterall...
Rama Kushna & Meshta is purely speculation.. they may or may not be an aspect of The Presence.
Destiny of The Endless
Archangel Gabriel
The Word (major lulz @ Tier 9?!)
Monsieur Stigmonus
Krona
are ranked too low.
Parallax is ranked waaaayyy too high in Tier 5. Srsly 😬
"Superman-Prime (with the Monitor/Cosmic Armor)"?? 🤨
They forgot to add The Basanos, which should be somewhere in Tier 5.
And God Swamp Thing, who at least should be in Tier 3.
Originally posted by theICONiacNot an accurate list.
According to the nerds over at Comic Vine:http://www.comicvine.com/dc-power-rankings/12-42222/
Looks like Mandrakk might have some problems! Ultimator ain't such a pussy afterall...
Mandrakk is the darkness of the story. He should be in the top with Superman. The same place where it says Ultimate Darkness/ Ultimate Light
Why? Because Superman and Mandrakk represent that
DOn't even let me get started with there list from other tiers. Look where they put Spectre, Superman 1 Million, Mxy, Maggedon....etc
Sorry very wrong
Originally posted by xJLxKing
Not an accurate list.Mandrakk is the darkness of the story. He should be in the top with Superman. The same place where it says Ultimate Darkness/ Ultimate Light
Why? Because Superman and Mandrakk represent that
DOn't even let me get started with there list from other tiers. Look where they put Spectre, Superman 1 Million, Mxy, Maggedon....etc
Sorry very wrong
Sorry, but your wankin' love-affair jwank with a sh!tty character from an even sh!ttier storyline can't deny what my handy-dandy Superman Encyclopedia says about the Ultimator:
*ahem*
"The joke was on Mxyzptlk when a 10 dimensional creature invaded Zrfff...the Ultimator, a 10-D nightmare who had already consumed four other dimensional realities and their lifeforms."
FOUR OTHER DIMENSIONAL REALITIES??? Pffft...you're right...Ultimator is chump change drylaugh
Originally posted by theICONiac
Sorry, but your wankin' love-affair jwank with a sh!tty character from an even sh!ttier storyline can't deny what my handy-dandy Superman Encyclopedia says about the Ultimator:*ahem*
"The joke was on Mxyzptlk when a 10 dimensional creature invaded Zrfff...the Ultimator, a 10-D nightmare who had already consumed four other dimensional realities and their lifeforms."
FOUR OTHER DIMENSIONAL REALITIES??? Pffft...you're right...Ultimator is chump change drylaugh
Why? Because I said so!
Originally posted by Galan007
the primal monitor was not 'shocked' about anything, nor did it create dax novu [the first monitor] to 'protect' itself. primal monitor knew of the 'microscopic' multiverse, so it created dax to further investigate it's intricacies. nothing more, nothing less.as stated before, the primal monitor gathering information through it's 'probe' is a case of inherent omniscience. afterall, why would the PM care enough to use it's "infinite intelligence" on something so utterly insignificant?
There is nothing so insignificant that it would not be worth investigating if doing so took literally zero effort, as it would for an omnipotent.
why would the PM care about something that hardly even bleeped on it's radar? why would the PM care when the probe's information got back to it? i mean, i don't care what one of my cells is doing at any given moment...the fact is, EVERY other 'infinite' power throughout DC [be it mandrakk, CA superman, anti-monitor, mxy, spectre.... the whole damn DCU combined] are utterly insignificant in the face of the primal monitor. real world logic aside, how can you claim that the primal monitor is anything less than omnipotent [in the truest sense] when all the characters in DC comics are beneath it's notice, and microbial in comparison?
Because an omnipotent being has literally no limits, and can do literally anything with no effort whatsoever.
In my opinion I have never seen a really true omnipotent being in any work of fiction. A true omnipotent being would only ever have to act once, since everything would be under its control and nothing would ever happen that it didn't directly and completely control, and would also know every possible piece of information. So after one act everything would be exactly the way it wanted it to be with no possibility of anything different or unexpected ever happening.
It's impossible to prove omnipotence, but it's very possible to disprove it. If a character has any limits at all, or ever exerts any visible effort to do anything, they are not omnipotent.
You can't just say they are willingly limiting themselves unless that is directly stated. Why? Because that same logic can be applied to any other character. For example, I can say that Catwoman is really omnipotent, but she just isn't using her omnipotent powers. Prove me wrong.
As for "applying real world logic to comic books", don't give me that shit, since this whole forum is based on that. You only don't like it when it's not convenient for you, that's hypocrisy.
Example: Let's say we have a character who destroys a planet. If we can't apply "real world logic", then how do we know what that means? The planets in that comic could really be the size of marbles, or they could be made of material that instantly explodes when you punch it. If someone dodges a bullet, how do you know how fast that bullet was? By comparing the speed of bullets in real life. It's impossible to hold a vs. debate without applying "real world logic", because otherwise you can just say whatever the hell you want even if it makes no sense and you couldn't prove or disprove it.
Because an omnipotent being has literally no limits, and can do literally anything with no effort whatsoever.
In my opinion I have never seen a really true omnipotent being in any work of fiction. A true omnipotent being would only ever have to act once, since everything would be under its control and nothing would ever happen that it didn't directly and completely control, and would also know every possible piece of information. So after one act everything would be exactly the way it wanted it to be with no possibility of anything different or unexpected ever happening.
It's impossible to prove omnipotence, but it's very possible to disprove it. If a character has any limits at all, or ever exerts any visible effort to do anything, they are not omnipotent.
You can't just say they are willingly limiting themselves unless that is directly stated. Why? Because that same logic can be applied to any other character. For example, I can say that Catwoman is really omnipotent, but she just isn't using her omnipotent powers. Prove me wrong.
As for "applying real world logic to comic books", don't give me that shit, since this whole forum is based on that. You only don't like it when it's not convenient for you, that's hypocrisy.
The point is, it's comics!!
So to your argument, I not only give you a falcepalm, but
Just remember folks, the Judeo-Christian 'God' embodies 3 very specific points that make Him all-powerful:
1. Omnipotence - the word-of-the-day around here. It means having an absolute control over reality
2. Omniscience - knowing all things...before/during/after they happen.
3. Omnipresence - being everywhere at once.
Hopefully the ICON's little aside here helps clear up the term 'Omnipotence' as it really only accounts for a third of what a supreme being would be...omnipotence does NOT cover the other 2 facets...
Originally posted by theICONiac
Just remember folks, the Judeo-Christian 'God' embodies 3 very specific points that make Him all-powerful:
1. Omnipotence - the word-of-the-day around here. It means having an absolute control over reality2. Omniscience - knowing all things...before/during/after they happen.
3. Omnipresence - being everywhere at once.
Hopefully the ICON's little aside here helps clear up the term 'Omnipotence' as it really only accounts for a third of what a supreme being would be...omnipotence does NOT cover the other 2 facets...
Originally posted by Philosophía👆 👆
The Primal Monitor is beyond concepts such as in-story Omnipotence since the very concept of story itself (of which Cosmic Armor Superman and Mandrakk are the extremes of) is contained within himself, and even when characters incredibly powerfull characters such as Mandrakk come into direct contact with him they are effectivly erased from existence, until even the ideea of him is lost.Like Grant Morrison described it (and Kevdude pointed out), he is the abstract, infinite intelligence inside which the infinitley smaller concept of 'story' is developed. (story which contains the like of Spectre, Lucifer, Michael etc.) No in-story scale actually applies to him, since the story itself and all its characters are infinitesimal compared to itself.
pretty sure everyone partaking in this thread has come to grasp that by now.... except mike.
Originally posted by theICONiacmxy.... in tier 8.... 😂.
According to the nerds over at Comic Vine:http://www.comicvine.com/dc-power-rankings/12-42222/
Looks like Mandrakk might have some problems! Ultimator ain't such a pussy afterall...