Darth Nihilus vs. Palpatine, Yoda, Luke and Anakin Skywalker

Started by AncientSithLord5 pages
AncientSithLord Member

Darth Nihilus vs. Palpatine, Yoda, Luke and Anakin Skywalker

Darth Nihilus... because he could drain the life from anyone. His hunger and power was so great he could even destroy the populations of entire worlds. There is no defense against the mega drain, unless one is a wound in the Force like the Exile. Palpatine, Yoda, Luke and Anakin Skywalker aren't. There's no contest, Darth Nihilus wins.

Samurai100 9

no way sidious could solo easy

AncientSithLord Member

Please explain how he could accomplish this. Sidious walks towards Nihilus, Nihilus walks towards Sidious, Nihilus extends a hand, and drains the life from Sidious. Consumes his soul. Instant death.

Dr McBeefington Restricted

Except there are techniques for withdrawing from the force, and hiding one's force presence.

truejedi Senior Member
Originally posted by AncientSithLord
Please explain how he could accomplish this. Sidious walks towards Nihilus, Nihilus walks towards Sidious, Nihilus extends a hand, and drains the life from Sidious. Consumes his soul. Instant death.

Please explain the instaneous nature of the drain? I am shocked that you have the proof that it is an instaneous, duel styled force attack! never in all my years have i found any proof of this! Please inform us wherein we have erred! From whence came this proof?!?!

Red Nemesis The Blind Critic

ha sarcasm

AncientSithLord Member

Have you played KOTOR 2? The Jedi Exile walks onto the bridge of the Ravager and approaches Nihilus. Nihilus stuns her and her companions, the Exile dares Nihilus to feed on her, and Nihilus extends his hand and drains. Instantly. But the Exile is a wound in the Force, so Nihilus collapses. If the Exile wasn't, however, then she'd be dead. Then the weakened Nihilus draws his lightsaber and begins battle.

That's aside from a scene, ultimately cut due to time constraints, where Darth Sion confronts Nihilus. He ignites his lightsaber, and Nihilus spins around and uses some form of Force Drain combined with Force lightning, Force pull and Force crush on him. Again, instantly. And in that circumstance Nihilus was not trying to kill Sion; Sion gets up again and Nihilus simply trips him over, and sends Sion on his way.

Also Visas Marr says "My lord spoke, and every living thing on Katarr died."

The whole hiding in the Force thing doesn't work either; Nihilus simply wiped out Katarr with the mega drain, and even chose to spare one life. Other life is said to be beneath him and almost irrelevant, "dust motes caught in a storm" as Tobin put it.

Red Nemesis The Blind Critic

You seem articulate and at least marginally competent. I will provide you with an earnest response.

Have you played KOTOR 2?

Yes. The majority of us have. It is almost certainly not a good idea to imagine that you know more than the people here, especially during the introductory phase of your posts.

That said, Welcome! Prepare to lose hours and hours of your life. 😈

The Jedi Exile walks onto the bridge of the Ravager and approaches Nihilus. Nihilus stuns her and her companions, the Exile dares Nihilus to feed on her, and Nihilus extends his hand and drains. Instantly. But the Exile is a wound in the Force, so Nihilus collapses.

This is your interpretation of the events. It's nice, but your version of events is not considered canon. There are things that we do not know about the events. The most important one is how much preparation is needed for the Drain to kick in. Can N. spam it as easily as Kun can amulet blasts, or Sidious can lightning, or does it take a greater amount of concentration, along the lines of Zannah's dark tentacles of doom power? How do you know?

That's aside from a scene, ultimately cut due to time constraints

Cut content isn't considered canon, and so cannot be used to support a position. While it can be used to indicate the authors' intentions, it does not and can not fully replace actual events.

Also Visas Marr says "My lord spoke, and every living thing on Katarr died."

Visas was in awe of N. There is the possibility that she was using poetic license. Also, she isn't exactly in a position to know what level of preparation the act took, as she was on the surface while he was in space. There is no way to know if the planet-buster drain required prep-time (making it a ritual and largely useless in combat) or even if that drain was the same one attempted against the Exile.

The whole hiding in the Force thing doesn't work either; Nihilus simply wiped out Katarr with the mega drain, and even chose to spare one life. Other life is said to be beneath him and almost irrelevant, "dust motes caught in a storm" as Tobin put it.

This is a bit of a non-sequitur; your comment about Katarr doesn't have much to do with the efficacy of hiding oneself from the Force. Do you have reason to believe that there was anyone practicing the technique while they were being targeted by the planet drain? Do you have any evidence that the hiding technique was even known by the Jedi at that time? It is possible (some say likely) that they did not know of it, making Kreia's "no defense" line moot.

While it is certainly tempting to assume that we know about the mechanics of N.'s giga-drain, it can only serve to make an ass out of you and me.

truejedi Senior Member

uo

Originally posted by AncientSithLord
Have you played KOTOR 2?

Indeed I have.


The Jedi Exile walks onto the bridge of the Ravager and approaches Nihilus. Nihilus stuns her and her companions,

So obviously THAT wasn't the drain, or else they would be dead, according to your definition.

the Exile dares Nihilus to feed on her, and Nihilus extends his hand and drains.

Quotation please? Nihilus could have been doing any number of force attacks by merely extending his hand in such a manner, am i not right? Perhaps it was a failed choke, or failed lightning. Difficult to say from a mere cut-scene.

Instantly.

Obviously since it didn't work, you have no idea if it was going to be instant or not.


If the Exile wasn't, however, then she'd be dead.

Proof of that, please?


That's aside from a scene, ultimately cut due to time constraints,

Which, i hope your realize, makes it non-canon.

where Darth Sion confronts Nihilus. He ignites his lightsaber, and Nihilus spins around and uses some form of Force Drain combined with Force lightning, Force pull and Force crush on him.

What?!? Can you prove ANY of that? From a cut scene, you claim proof of a combination force attack, and then try to call it a drain as well?!? Obviously Nihilus was NOT using his drain in this instance, or he wouldn't have had the lightning, pull and crush... You are really reaching with that one.


Again, instantly. And in that circumstance Nihilus was not trying to kill Sion; Sion gets up again and Nihilus simply trips him over, and sends Sion on his way.

Again, you can't prove it was the drain, you can't prove Nihilus didn't want to kill him, and you can't prove, if it WAS the drain, that it would have been instantly fatal (considering it wasn't fatal at all.


Also Visas Marr says "My lord spoke, and every living thing on Katarr died."

She wasn't there when he spoke. She was presumably told this by the same man holding her captive... Definitly not a reliable witness. In-universe quotes are rarely proof.


The whole hiding in the Force thing doesn't work either; Nihilus simply wiped out Katarr with the mega drain, and even chose to spare one life. Other life is said to be beneath him and almost irrelevant, "dust motes caught in a storm" as Tobin put it.

Once again, Tobin has never seen what he is talking about, he is presumably taking the word of Nihilus.

Your move.

😄

truejedi Senior Member

but as Red said, welcome, you seem one of the more competent new members we have had in aeons.

Red Nemesis The Blind Critic

double whammy
😬

Slash_KMC Retired Helper

Yes, 'new' member.

Amazing Vrayo!! Disciple of Inglip

Sure, Nihilus tried to drain the exile, and maybe it would work against someone who wasn't a wound in the force, but he only was able to do it to one person (instantaneouly that is) and it is only logical that it would take more time for him to force drain multiple victims. Therefore, someone would attack him while he was trying to drain someone else, or, if he tried to drain them all at once, they would kill him while he was focusing the power to use it against multiple people. Its a catch 22 situation. The furious four take the win.

Red Nemesis The Blind Critic

no

N. still wins, he just doesn't do it by eating souls. That would be an evil action anyway. No, N. wins because he has some of the strongest and most impressive telekinesis found in the series.

He breaks Anakin's neck and then accelerates his body to relativistic speed, hitting the other three as it bounces around the room from the initial impact.

Shoes Senior Member

Originally posted by Red Nemesis
[b]no

N. still wins, he just doesn't do it by eating souls. That would be an evil action anyway. No, N. wins because he has some of the strongest and most impressive telekinesis found in the series.[/B]

When were we shown this?

Red Nemesis The Blind Critic

During the loading screen which says that N. "dragged his ship[s?] out of the mass shadow generator" at Malachor. Also, Tobin may also have referenced it? In any event, the canonicity of the loading screen is not in question and the numbers (in terms of Force, force, work, power and energy) are all testament to his astronomical powahs.

truejedi Senior Member

Originally posted by Red Nemesis

No, N. wins because he has some of the strongest and most impressive telekinesis found in the series.

He breaks Anakin's neck and then accelerates his body to relativistic speed, hitting the other three as it bounces around the room from the initial impact.

This is a bit of a stretch. he has some impressive telekinesis, no doubt, but is his TK greater than Sidious's? The Most Powerful Sith in History? Combined with Yoda's? Who stalemated him? Luke? Who arguably is more powerful than either one? Anakin is of course immaterial in this duel. If the 3 can't take N, anakin can't.

I like your theory, but his removal of ships from a gravity well doesn't make him untouchable. Dorsk 81 removed over EIGHTY star destroyers from a SOLAR SYSTEM in a single moment in Jedi Academy.

Size matters not. I don't see why any of the other 3 couldn't do the same thing in a crucial situation. (see Galen)

The thought being: If N is THAT powerful, sidious must be even more powerful. The other 2 have been shown to be in the same range as Sidious.

Red Nemesis The Blind Critic

Originally posted by truejedi

The thought being: If N is THAT powerful, sidious must be even more powerful.

Based on what, exactly? Throwing some pods at Yoda?

Spoiler:
weak

The other 2 have been shown to be in the same range as Sidious.

big. whoop.

(Whats this about dork92?)

Shoes Senior Member
Originally posted by Red Nemesis
During the loading screen which says that N. "dragged his ship[s?] out of the mass shadow generator" at Malachor. Also, Tobin may also have referenced it? In any event, the canonicity of the loading screen is not in question and the numbers (in terms of Force, force, work, power and energy) are all testament to his astronomical powahs.

This does not prove his TK is beyond that of Sidious. In fact, I would say it doesn't come close to what Sidious did with that Star Destroyer.

truejedi Senior Member

UO

Originally posted by Red Nemesis

Based on what, exactly? Throwing some pods at Yoda?

Spoiler:
weak

[/B]
Based on Sidious being the most powerful lord of the Sith. Obviously. I refuse to explain to you why he is. To a newbie, perhaps, to you, NO U!

big. whoop.

[/B]

It really kinda is. Luke has the best feat of TK in the mythos when he holds himself to the deck, and an out of universe quote is: "even the black hole that held the galaxy together could not have moved him."

If Sidious is more powerful (Greatest DLOTS)
And Luke is,
And Yoda is equivalent, or just below Sidious (based on Duel)
Then we have 3 beings more powerful than N.

It is a big whoop.


(Whats this about dork92?) [/B]

Dorsk 81 Red. C'mon now. This was written almost 20 years ago. He uses the force to remove Pellean's fleet of 80 star destroyers from the Jedi Academy. Thrusts them entirely out of the system. It kills him. But he does it. Size matters not.