HOM Wanda vs. Thanos w/ IG

Originally posted by quanchi112
But like you admit it can erase a being's past actions reseting the multiverse when it takes out abraxas which makes perfect sense that it can't reset the multi but by erasing someone's actions which affected the multi in that way.

I am free to change my mind as many times as I want. It's not spelled out in black and white anyways and imo had to do with Abraxas.

You're free to compound how wrong you are. And I'm free to point out how your desperate waffling underscores how inept your logic is. You literally switched your position to the direct opposite THREE TIMES. You admitted you were previously wrong TWICE. All on the SAME ISSUE. And UN can destroy a Multiverse isn't spelled out? Are you blind?

Originally posted by quanchi112
I also was forgetting the fact it can erase someone' past actions which it did therefore resetting the multi. Well, without the reality gem that means it's can incomplete ig and can still destroy it easily in combat.

5 cc's pale in comparison to the ig while the un does as well. I guess 5 cc's also render a un user impotent as well which also hurts your case. Laughs.

It didn't destroy the multi it destroyed abraxas thereby resetting the multi.

A writer's oversight which happens all the time and he's a writer who has rulk ko watchers yet struggle with wolverine. He's not that great of a writer but to me it was clear he nullified abraxas thereby recreating the multi.

The ig isn't a weapon either you ignoramus.

IG pales in comparison to the UN. 5 CCU's preventing the firing of the UN doesn't hurt my case. Because not even you could pretend that 5 CCU's are powerful enough to destroy/recreate the Multiverse instantly. And do you know where that agreement between us takes us? To the conclusion that you don't have to be as powerful as the UN in order to muck around with it's user. So IG screwing with Quasar's tiny marble-sized sphere is NO PROOF of its superior power. You seriously didn't foresee where I was leading you with this? You know that hurt feeling on your nose and in your butt? That's me grabbing your nose to the truth and the truth ramming itself home up your a$$.

Couldn't care less that you idiotically switched your position a third time. It's all on-panel. You've been reduced to a quivering pile of, "Nuh uh." and "I switch my position, which I switched before, which I switched before." And you're genuinely trying to act like you have a leg to stand on?

Don't blame the fact that a comic blatantly proves you wrong on the writer. It isn't the writer's fault you're proven wrong. It's your's. Five separate on-panel reasons that prove Abraxas' past actions weren't completely nullified.

You're a joke. Nuff said.

Originally posted by OneDumbG0
It has been described on-panel of being capable of erasing the past actions of its target. So although it never did, I won't argue that it can't. Just that it hasn't. The bottom-line is, it didn't wipe out Abraxas' past actions on-panel. I proved that already.

You're free to compound how wrong you are. And I'm free to point out how your desperate waffling underscores how inept your logic is. You literally switched your position to the direct opposite THREE TIMES. You admitted you were previously wrong TWICE. All on the SAME ISSUE. And UN can destroy a Multiverse isn't spelled out? Are you blind?

Too bad it didn't erase the past actions of Abraxas. On-panel. And too bad it never has done so in 616. Yes, IG + Reality Gem can destroy Quasar shooting a tiny marble-sized sphere. Make a thread where Quasar is purposefully limiting the UN, isn't aware that Magus has an IG and shoots a tiny marble-sized sphere and I assure you, Magus w/ IG would win. Too bad that isn't the argument we're having.

IG pales in comparison to the UN. 5 CCU's preventing the firing of the UN doesn't hurt my case. Because not even you could pretend that 5 CCU's are powerful enough to destroy/recreate the Multiverse instantly. And do you know where that agreement between us takes us? To the conclusion that you don't have to be as powerful as the UN in order to muck around with it's user. So IG screwing with Quasar's tiny marble-sized sphere is NO PROOF of its superior power. You seriously didn't foresee where I was leading you with this? You know that hurt feeling on your nose and in your butt? That's me grabbing your nose to the truth and the truth ramming itself home up your a$$.

Couldn't care less that you idiotically switched your position a third time. It's all on-panel. You've been reduced to a quivering pile of, "Nuh uh." and "I switch my position, which I switched before, which I switched before." And you're genuinely trying to act like you have a leg to stand on?

Don't blame the fact that a comic blatantly proves you wrong on the writer. It isn't the writer's fault you're proven wrong. It's your's. Five separate on-panel reasons that prove Abraxas' past actions weren't completely nullified.

You're a joke. Nuff said.

It took out abraxas and reset the multiverse in order to do so. It's clear.

We saw it do so in the ff arc. The ig can defeat and manipulate the un energies with a thought minus the reality gem. It can manipulte it's energies no matter the size.

The un destroyed abraxas which set the multi back on the right path. Huge difference.

No, I haven't you have nothing to support your arguments other than odg propaganda and wishful thinking.

Ig is absolute power out of the mouth of eternity.

You're the most bitter poster I have ever seen. You take pride in that which is amusing.

Originally posted by quanchi112
It says Abraxas can do so with the un not reed.

It took out abraxas and reset the multiverse in order to do so. It's clear.

It's clear that it nullified Multi-Eternity. On-panel:

Originally posted by quanchi112
We saw it do so in the ff arc. The ig can defeat and manipulate the un energies with a thought minus the reality gem. It can manipulte it's energies no matter the size.

Originally posted by quanchi112
The un destroyed abraxas which set the multi back on the right path. Huge difference.

Originally posted by quanchi112
No, I haven't you have nothing to support your arguments other than odg propaganda and wishful thinking.

Ig is absolute power out of the mouth of eternity.

Absolute power except when it can't even affect Maelstrom, can't even read Grandmaster's mind, can't even deal with Warlock inside the Soul Gem. UN is "The most powerful weapon ever known." On-panel:

Originally posted by quanchi112
You're the most bitter poster I have ever seen. You take pride in that which is amusing.

How many pages has this debate been going on?

Originally posted by OneDumbG0
Reed is describing the UN, troll. English, motherf@cker, do you speak it? sam

It's clear that it nullified Multi-Eternity. On-panel:

Stop trolling. Stop using no limit fallacies. We specifically saw that all of Abraxas' past actions were not erased. On-panel:

Except you're wrong that it was aimed at Abraxas specifically. Reed destroyed "all that was." Abraxas =/= "all that was." Multi-Eternity = "all that was." Read the scan. This is all on-panel:

You haven't? You haven't switched your positions three times? Are you seriously going to try to lie about not switching your positions? You already admitted to waffling three times over.

Absolute power except when it can't even affect Maelstrom, can't even read Grandmaster's mind, can't even deal with Warlock inside the Soul Gem. UN is "[b]The most powerful weapon ever known." On-panel:

Bitter? Don't project your own petty feelings over how your delusions were shattered. I'm not bitter. No, I'm entertained. You're a joke. But even I can laugh at bad jokes. laughcry [/B]

I see it plain as day onebitterposter.

Who is saying no limits I am saying we have seen the ig minus the reality gem pwn the un's energies with nothing more than a thought. To ignore this is to invite insanity and illogical debating techniques.

Yes, and through abraxas's actions Eternity is all space which was ended and then realigned. You misinterpreted it incorrectly.

I have changed my mind. Please calm down.

You went nuts on mr. m as well for changing his mind it happens all the time now if you have never changed your mind you can talk but if you have you are a hypocrite.

You seem to get riled up and let this affect you personally. Ig is absolute power. Do you know what absolute means?

Originally posted by OneDumbG0
Power level was altered. Marble vs. Marvel Multiverse. Feign ignorance. You've been forced to concede that nullifying a marble is as powerful a feat as nullifying AND RECREATING the Marvel Multiverse. Do you have any idea how dumb that makes you look?

It has the potential power. Always. But then you limit it. For example, Quasar limited it to nullifying a marble. This isn't hard to determine unless you are quanchi112 with all your wold theories.

This is your logic, nimrod. It makes no sense because it's your logic, nimrod. Did you just make fun of me for repeating your arguments again? By your logic, being immune to single hand-blast = being immune to full power of IG, just like manipulating a marble-sized sphere = manipulating a Multiverse-wide destroying/recreating blast. Christ. That's called winning over a marble-sized sphere. And if this argument were about IG vs. marble-sized sphere nullification sphere. You'd have a point. But it's not. So you don't.

How isn't anything you've attempted here [b]not wrong? Example: you said the UN's power is to nullify its target and since it can't change that it simply nullifies, its power doesn't change no matter the scope involved. Setting aside how retarded "nullifying marble = nullifying Multiverse" is, you forgot that the UN can nullify its target's past actions completely. So its power against its target can change. You also forgot that it can recreate said target. So its power against its target can change. You were wrong. On several levels on top of your power/potency/scope semantics. Good job.

IG was limited against poewrs in this reality, e.g., Maelstrom, Grandmaster, and Adam Warlock within the Soul Gem. Poor quaneuver. You keep rattling off outdated and completely unproven flowery purple prose to support your argument. And you can keep ignoring it but my flowery purple prose still beats your's since Reed stated about the UN: "The most powerful weapon ever known." Reed experienced and knew the power of the IG. Sorry, but this is an on-panel comparison that is updated.

And that's in addition to the UN performing an exponentially more powerful feat, i.e., nullifying AND RECREATING the entire Marvel Multiverse instantly. Which is in addition to your double-standards over Maelstrom not being superior to the IG by your own logic. Do you like having your fantasies shattered? Blame it on yourself. I never forced you to make ham-fisted arguments like "nullifying a marble = to nullifying/RECREATING the Marvel Multiverse."

You don't have a single viable argument. There's a reason I took this position. Several, in fact. Time to get over it, kid. [/B]

Question… If you're saying that it couldn't have just been aimed at Abraxas because the FF4 remembers etc etc… Then how is it then possible to remake the entire multiverse and people still remember what transpired? In either scenerio people remembered when they shouldn't have under your theory

^ Destroying and realigning the Multiverse with the UN doesn't necessarily erase your memory. I don't recall ever positing that theory. I only argued that, to the extent you want to argue that only Abraxas was nullified, then the only way the Multiverse could have been realigned (which is clearly the result), is if the UN was set to also completely wiped out Abraxas' past actions and not just his physical form. And that cannot be true because there exist at least five dispositive factors which show Abraxas' past actions weren't completely wiped out.

Originally posted by Black bolt z
Reed said it was the most powerful weapon ever known.Thanos said that IG makes you the supreme power in that reality.One contridicts the other.Also Reed never acctually experienced UN's power.None of the FF were alive during IG saga and full IG was never together in infinity war.It's not a good argument if it's not true.

That statement is also true because the IG is more than a weapon. Though it's a weapon in the wrong hands. The UN will never be anything more than such.

Originally posted by quanchi112
It clearly took out abraxas which in turn remade space because of this in the multiverse.

I see it plain as day onebitterposter.

Who is saying no limits I am saying we have seen the ig minus the reality gem pwn the un's energies with nothing more than a thought. To ignore this is to invite insanity and illogical debating techniques.

If you see that Abraxas' past actions were not completely wiped out, then your theory is D.O.A. doped

You're saying that when you manipulate a small marble-sized sphere, there's no reason to doubt it could manipulate a Multiverse-wide blast. No limit fallacy. Also, double-standard. Since you wont' admit that Maelstrom being immune to single IG hand blast means he would immune to its full power. Justifying your ignorance with no limit fallacies and double-standards doesn't wash. I fully embrace that Thanos could beat a UN-user who makes a marble-sized sphere and isn't aware of an activated IG. I also understand that feat is irrelevant when you compare their respective power. UN > IG.

Originally posted by quanchi112
Yes, and through abraxas's actions Eternity is all space which was ended and then realigned. You misinterpreted it incorrectly.

I have changed my mind. Please calm down.

You went nuts on mr. m as well for changing his mind it happens all the time now if you have never changed your mind you can talk but if you have you are a hypocrite.

You seem to get riled up and let this affect you personally. Ig is absolute power. Do you know what absolute means?

Correction: You've changed your mind three times on the exact same issue. This deserves a new term. Quaneuver is when you try to pretend you didn't just say something stupid that undermines your current position. But since you acknowledge flip-flopping here, a new term must be coined. I deem this: quanchiwaffling. Catchy.

Nope. I asked him to prove his genuity when he changed his mind once. Which he proved. I went off on you for changing your mind three times. Because one of those times, I had to waste my time explaining it to you and you conceded. Now months later, having been cornered by the looming truth, you decide to reverse your position back. Again. I have never changed my mind three times on the same issue with the same poster and acted like I'm being rationale and consistent. Hence, I am not a hypocrite here.

Don't project your deficient rationales and butt-hurt feelings onto me. Frankly, relying on flowery purple prose words like "absolute power" when the Cosmic Cube was described thusly before then, and THOTU and LT have been described afterwards is idiotic. UN destroying/recreating Marvel Multiverse instantly >>>>>>>>>>>> taking over single 616 universe. I don't ignore comics. You can continue to do so.

Originally posted by OneDumbG0

You've changed your mind three times on the exact same issue. This deserves a new term. Quaneuver is when you try to pretend you didn't just say something stupid that undermines your current position. But since you acknowledge flip-flopping here, a new term must be coined. I deem this: quanchiwaffling. Catchy.

ODG 😂

Originally posted by OneDumbG0
^ Destroying and realigning the Multiverse with the UN doesn't necessarily erase your memory. I don't recall ever positing that theory. I only argued that, to the extent you want to argue that only Abraxas was nullified, then the only way the Multiverse could have been realigned (which is clearly the result), is if the UN was set to also completely wiped out Abraxas' past actions and not just his physical form. And that cannot be true because there exist at least five dispositive factors which show Abraxas' past actions weren't completely wiped out. Reed knows the power of the Infinity Gauntlet. Refer to Infinity War and New Avengers: Illuminati and Pet Avengers.

Okay…. so you're saying that they obviously just didn't nullify abraxas because of the FF4 still remembering things. Because they did, thus it wasn't him and his past actions wiped out. So… I'm still curious how if the multiverse was reset… Abraxas would still need to be wiped out and all his past actions in the reset… yet then how do they still remember things? That contradicts what you're arguing. In either case they should've be remembering anything. Correct?

Originally posted by OneDumbG0
Reed knows the power of the Infinity Gauntlet. Refer to Infinity War and New Avengers: Illuminati and Pet Avengers.

^ Reed understood the Infinity Gems' power. Quasar not using an instantaneous Multiverse-destroying/recreating blast doesn't change what an IG-user would have to deal with? Quasar nullifying all the past actions of Warlock, thus erasing Magus from ever existing and the entire adventure wouldn't change what an IG-user would have to deal with? You're reaching.

Originally posted by KuRuPT Thanosi
Okay…. so you're saying that they obviously just didn't nullify abraxas because of the FF4 still remembering things. Because they did, thus it wasn't him and his past actions wiped out. So… I'm still curious how if the multiverse was reset… Abraxas would still need to be wiped out and all his past actions in the reset… yet then how do they still remember things? That contradicts what you're arguing. In either case they should've be remembering anything. Correct?

Originally posted by OneDumbG0
^ Reed understood the Infinity Gems' power. Quasar not using an instantaneous Multiverse-destroying/recreating blast doesn't change what an IG-user would have to deal with? Quasar nullifying all the past actions of Warlock, thus erasing Magus from ever existing and the entire adventure wouldn't change what an IG-user would have to deal with? You're reaching. Abraxas needed to be wiped out otherwise he'd be running around threatening the Multiverse again. All the damage wrought, was realigned by Reed. Neither requires erasing memories. And memories is just one gaping hole in your idea.

Huh that made no sense... Explain how it's proof abraxas wasn't just erased because people remembered things... yet your claim is the multiverse had to be wiped out (thus erasing abraxas) yet they still remembered things. You're not answering the contradiction in your theory. By the way... I never said abraxas was only nullified.. I believe the multiverse was reset... however memories either way aren't proof of either.

Originally posted by OneDumbG0
^ Reed understood the Infinity Gems' power. Quasar not using an instantaneous Multiverse-destroying/recreating blast doesn't change what an IG-user would have to deal with? Quasar nullifying all the past actions of Warlock, thus erasing Magus from ever existing and the entire adventure wouldn't change what an IG-user would have to deal with? You're reaching.

^ So if Quasar let loose an instantaneous Multiverse destroying/recreatign blast, that would be no different to him letting loose a slowly expanding tiny marble-sized sphere? Drop the pretense. You're not that dumb. As for the Warlock hypothetical, he could easily just have nullified Warlock and all his past actions instantly... which would cause Magus never to have existed in the first place. Which would mean that Magus never got the IG and that's that. I'm sorry you feel compelled to defend the notion that the UN's end-result can never change. But you and I both recognize that (i) the UN can nullify its target, (ii) the UN can nullify its target AND all its past actions, (iii) the UN can RECREATE its target entirely, and (iv) it can nullify/RECREATE its target physically or the target and all its past actions both gradually or instantly.

You do realize that this holds true even if you choose to think that nullifying a marble = nullifying a Multiverse? Even setting aside your pathetic argument that end-result = scope = power, you're utterly wrong because the end-result isn't the same.

kinda

Originally posted by KuRuPT Thanosi
Huh that made no sense... Explain how it's proof abraxas wasn't just erased because people remembered things... yet your claim is the multiverse had to be wiped out (thus erasing abraxas) yet they still remembered things. You're not answering the contradiction in your theory. By the way... I never said abraxas was only nullified.. I believe the multiverse was reset... however memories either way aren't proof of either.

Now in the alternative, if Reed nullified and then recreated the entire Multiverse (just without Abraxas in it), he could. And as Reed alluded to earlier on, and as Abraxas himself threatened, that's exactly what Reed did:

Destroying and then recreating the Multiverse without Abraxas in it did not require the erasure of FF's and Watcher's memories, or reversal of Galactus' transformation into a star or Valeria's tutelage under Roma. I've said this now, three times. Continue to ignore that at your peril.

Originally posted by OneDumbG0
^ So if Quasar let loose an instantaneous Multiverse destroying/recreatign blast, that would be no different to him letting loose a slowly expanding tiny marble-sized sphere? Drop the pretense. You're not that dumb. As for the Warlock hypothetical, he could easily just have nullified Warlock and all his past actions instantly... which would cause Magus never to have existed in the first place. Which would mean that Magus never got the IG and that's that. I'm sorry you feel compelled to defend the notion that the UN's end-result can never change. But you and I both recognize that [b](i) the UN can nullify its target, (ii) the UN can nullify its target AND all its past actions, (iii) the UN can RECREATE its target entirely, and (iv) it can nullify/RECREATE its target physically or the target and all its past actions both gradually or instantly.

You do realize that this holds true even if you choose to think that nullifying a marble = nullifying a Multiverse? Even setting aside your pathetic argument that end-result = scope = power, you're utterly wrong because the end-result isn't the same.

kinda Because in order for the Multiverse to be completely realigned via Abraxas only being the target... then his past actions had to have been completely nullified from existence. In theory, such a result would cause the Multiverse to realign itself. BUT, they weren't. As absolutely shown on-panel.

Now in the alternative, if Reed nullified and then recreated the entire Multiverse (just without Abraxas in it), he could. And as Reed alluded to earlier on, and as Abraxas himself threatened, that's exactly what Reed did:

Destroying and then recreating the Multiverse without Abraxas in it did not require the erasure of FF's and Watcher's memories, or reversal of Galactus' transformation into a star or Valeria's tutelage under Roma. I've said this now, three times. Continue to ignore that at your peril. [/B]

Still not explaining the contradiction there... In EITHER CASE abraxas is erased from even existing. In one case you're saying well he wasn't just nullified because the FF4 remembered things... then you say it was the multiverse that was nullified just without him in it. You have ZERO proof that in that scenerio whether all the memories, past actions or what exactly was done specificially during the reset. You claim it's okay for the ff4 to remember stuff if the multiverse is reset.. how is this possible... It was reset and under your theory Abraxas never existed.. then how could they remember things? Contradiction.

Originally posted by OneDumbG0
^ So if Quasar let loose an instantaneous Multiverse destroying/recreatign blast, that would be no different to him letting loose a slowly expanding tiny marble-sized sphere? Drop the pretense. You're not that dumb. As for the Warlock hypothetical, he could easily just have nullified Warlock and all his past actions instantly... which would cause Magus never to have existed in the first place. Which would mean that Magus never got the IG and that's that. I'm sorry you feel compelled to defend the notion that the UN's end-result can never change. But you and I both recognize that [b](i) the UN can nullify its target, (ii) the UN can nullify its target AND all its past actions, (iii) the UN can RECREATE its target entirely, and (iv) it can nullify/RECREATE its target physically or the target and all its past actions both gradually or instantly.

You do realize that this holds true even if you choose to think that nullifying a marble = nullifying a Multiverse? Even setting aside your pathetic argument that end-result = scope = power, you're utterly wrong because the end-result isn't the same.
[/B]

The warlock analogy still wouldn't make sense because if warlock's past actions were nullified thanos would still have IG.He would know that and wouldn't do it.Just drop that notion.

I never said it's end result can never changed.Stop putting words in other peoples mouths.You gave valid reasons as to how it is differnent.That is true and you are right on that.I never questioned it.

I never said end-result=scope=power.Once again your putting words in my mouth.End result is what the UN user wants to use the UN for(of it's different functions).Scope=power because naturally it takes more power to increase the size.No more energy yet bigger size is just a silliy notion.Yet it still doesn't increase the extent to which the targeted object is nullified.