Silver Surfer vs Sentry WITH Void.

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
Lol. Are you still going on about this? I'm not even going to bother however.

He did just fine. You seem determined for him to have had the full measure of his Odin Force portion to be present for some damn reason.

You mean when she tosses her hammer? Why the hell would Thor have to be amped to take that unharmed? His taken worse, and has come out fine.

facepalm

I don't think I can do this anymore. At least herochat I wouldn't get banned for what I'd like to say to you.

Are you actually trying to argue that Thor stating "Odin grant me strength." is prove that he was tapping into Odin Force? Do I really have to explain to you how...how silly that is? I've read Thor praying to Odin on multiple occasions. It was just a figure of speech. When Thor yelled, about Void feeling the power of his father and his father's father wasn't him reaching King Thor levels.

Nowhere was it ever mentioned that Thor needed the Odin Force to make Asgard rise and fall.

facepalm

Aperson as big of a Thor buff as you Show know better then to comapre BRB to Thor iwth the Odinpower be it all the odin force or just a small weak part. You even trying to argue this point is just plain stupid that you can't even admit it Prove that Thor was without the Odinpower you can't and it is common knowledge.

Originally posted by DarkOdin
Thor taking an amped hammer blow to the chest un harmed please show proof leesser blow have hurt him let alone a amp hit from storm breaker this thor is no we near king thor level IS a small bit of odin power is still an amp him using a power not in his power set to make Asgard fall is the Odinpower no where else can this power come from. Thor and BRB durability are equal granted by the hammers from Odin himself IF Thor tanked a blast so can BRB you are the one who brings up a number of point however NO EVER in the comic mini or the main story was Thor weak your have 0 proof

Can you please use spell check or something next time? I feel as if I'm trying to decode an encrypted message.

It was one charged hammer throw.

During Blood and Thunder, Thor took multiple shots from Stormbreaker repeatedly to the head, and was only downed with a bit of blood to show for it. Him taking a single amped hammer shot to the chest without any serious damage surprises you? Thor also took a hammer throw from Thor Girl to the chest unharmed (She still had the power of Tarene here.). Gladiator took a similar attack and didn't fair so good. Albeit she hit him in the face instead of the chest.

Him doing what he did is nothing beyond normal Thor. Why am I even bothering discussing this?

BANLOL!

Yes, because Thor has a defined power like say Gladiator and him pulling powers out of his ass is something that he has never done before....

What makes you think Thor can't make Asgard rise and fall without being amped? It was never stated he needed the Odin Power to do that and it wouldn't be the first time Thor manipulated gravity. Coming to the conclusion that he cannot based on the fact that he did so only when he had the Odin Force is wrong. Especially since we are discussing about a character with such an open ended power set. Thor could suddenly gain the ability to turn people into butterflies and I wouldn't give two shits. People claimed Thor couldn't resurrect Asgardians without the Odin Force. Guess what? When Thor lost it, he want and resurrected Sif.

Nah, they aren't equal in durability. Loki himself proved that when he put Bill down so easily. And so did the recent Super Skrull fight.

Proof of what? That Thor was weakened? Fraction comes out and states himself that Thor is weakened for this battle because he just recently resurrected the Asgardians.

Originally posted by DarkOdin
Aperson as big of a Thor buff as you Show know better then to comapre BRB to Thor iwth the Odinpower be it all the odin force or just a small weak part. You even trying to argue this point is just plain stupid that you can't even admit it Prove that Thor was without the Odinpower you can't and it is common knowledge.

I do know better. Hence why I didn't start comparing the two until I came across two of Fraction's statements.

I honestly don't know why I'm debating this. I dug and I found the first interview Fraction gave.

http://www.comicbookresources.com/?page=article&id=16090

"Thor isn’t at full power. In recent issues of "Thor," the Thunder God expended much of the Odin Power in order to revive the Asgardians who were "sleeping" on earth, hidden in mortal bodies. "His batteries are a little worn down," Fraction said. "Thor’s very much a god and very much reconnected to his greatness and the power of Asgard. But at the beginning of this story he’s not at the top of his game and he’s crucially aware of it. Now when he needs to be at full capacity, he’s not. So it puts him at a real disadvantage."

I can't find the second one where he confirms that Thor was at his regular levels.

Anyways like I said. This happened right after Thor drained himself to the point he could barely walk and needed the Odin Sleep to recharge himself.

Blood and Thunder eh?

You mean the Thor that needed the Power Gem to contend with Thanos?

Nice.

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus

http://www.comicbookresources.com/?page=article&id=16090

"[i]Thor isn’t at full power. In recent issues of "Thor," the Thunder God expended much of the Odin Power in order to revive the Asgardians who were "sleeping" on earth, hidden in mortal bodies. "His batteries are a little worn down,[/ii]"

I can't find the second one where he confirms that Thor was at his regular levels.

This confirms he still has it "be it just a little" as does following issues.

Him using up most of the Odinpower shows he still has some of it.

With the little he had left he was able to take a blow from Bor that would of killed him"classic level". This is all done with just the little bit Odnpower he had left Which still throws his power level far above his classic/current level.

Depends.

All I can say is, Silver Surfer is no Thor, and Thor is superior in every way sans speed.

Originally posted by DarkOdin
This confirms he still has it "be it just a little" as does following issues.

Him using up most of the Odinpower shows he still has some of it.

With the little he had left he was able to take a blow from Bor that would of killed him"classic level". This is all done with just the little bit Odnpower he had left Which still throws his power level far above his classic/current level.

As Thor told Doctor Strange, some of the Odin Force still lived within him. When he fought Bor, that portion was in full effect as he had recharged his reserves with the Odin Sleep after reviving the Asgardians. Whatever portion that Thor did have though, had been even further drained by reviving the Asgardians. There was a reason as to why Thor could barely stand after the effort. He was weakened pretty damn badly. That was the Thor that fought the Skrulls and not the Thor that fought Bor who had his portion of the Odin Force restored.

I need to find the second interview so you can shut the hell up as this shit is getting tedious and I'm losing my patience. He states that Thor was not amped.

Originally posted by quanchi112
BrB only got the upper hand briefly due to the Surfer distracting him. The reason he was temporarily beaten was due to the fact he wasn't amped and can be downed in the same manner as before but it's not likely to happen because Thor is out for the kill right out of the gate.

He said he wasn't going to hold back so I took him at his word. Why would he say that and the reader assume he lied?

Yes but rarely fallow's it, its not in his character. I mean look at his fight with Thanos in Dr. Strange realm or his bout with Morg after the herald ordeal Arc, he never crosses that line unlike say when Thor/Glad/BRB they go for the kill..

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
?
Beta Ray Bill used Thor's own blood lusted nature against him. He stopped trying to subdue Thor with power and used his superior skill (Thor was like a raging animal.)

I honestly don't see what's the problem here. Thor's always been shown to overcome his limits when his angry. Him doing so when his insane doesn't surprise me at all.

If a pissed off Thor can own the utter shit out of an Ulik who was thousands of times more powerful than before after Ulik had just finished smashing both him and Hercules, killing both the Hulk and the Thing in battle, destroy the Visor of the freaking Destroyer after he was enraged, take on the Fourth Host when mad, among other shit, I have absolutely no problem with what he did in Blood and Thunder.

What im sayin is if he was extremely powerful in his insane mode why fall to Bill? Why couldn't he feel Surfer in one blow before the mention of the amp? heck Surfer was hit by a hammer throw, a few hammer hit in the head and still able to talk to him while later after the mention of the amp Thor was one shoting him..

Ill finish later kinda late..lol

Originally posted by Ambient
There was no distraction, it was a one on one match. Nah his withstood a few combined assault from both Surfer and Warlock like it was nothing and tank blows from both Maxam and Drax w/PG, thats a few level above his durability when downed by BRB.. Insanity is Insanity from his first encounter with Bill till he meet with Odin, " he kills right out of the gate.."

Yes but rarely fallow's it, its not in his character. I mean look at his fight with Thanos in Dr. Strange realm or his bout with Morg after the herald ordeal Arc, he never crosses that line unlike say when Thor/Glad/BRB they go for the kill..

Right and 3 blows downed him paired that to say a few combined assault from Surfer/Warlock or Maxam/Pg Drax who he was able to tank it like it was nothing.. See where im getting at, thats an extreme change > durability to his former self.. Yes it was not but it was closed enough that Odin was nearly fooled by it till closed exam. and found out that it was his doing that made it but he dif. compared it to WM.

What im sayin is if he was extremely powerful in his insane mode why fall to Bill? Why couldn't he feel Surfer in one blow before the mention of the amp? heck Surfer was hit by a hammer throw, a few hammer hit in the head and still able to talk to him while later after the mention of the amp Thor was one shoting him..

Ill finish later kinda late..lol

Bill's hammer against his head did far more damage than warlock and the surfer's weak blows. That much is obvious.

The writer had that line to show Surfer taking off the kiddie gloves yet it didn't matter.

Wasn't it three head shots from a brutal powerful hammer as opposed to the warlock and Surfer's attacks? Really?

He fell to bill because of the attacks against his head and would have fallen had it occurred again but the attacks from the surfer and warlock were nowhere near as brutal.

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
As Thor told Doctor Strange, some of the Odin Force still lived within him. When he fought Bor, that portion was in full effect as he had recharged his reserves with the Odin Sleep after reviving the Asgardians. Whatever portion that Thor did have though, had been even further drained by reviving the Asgardians. There was a reason as to why Thor could barely stand after the effort. He was weakened pretty damn badly. That was the Thor that fought the Skrulls and not the Thor that fought Bor who had his portion of the Odin Force restored.

I need to find the second interview so you can shut the hell up as this shit is getting tedious and I'm losing my patience. He states that Thor was not amped.

Not even close your little quote acknowledges the prior issues of Thor in which Thor fell from orbit and his people put him right into Odin's Coffin for the Odin sleep Thor couldn't move after he brought back the asgardians and they put him right into the Odin sleep. So please get the 2nd one or just give up.

Originally posted by Ambient
Right and 3 blows downed him paired that to say a few combined assault from Surfer/Warlock or Maxam/Pg Drax who he was able to tank it like it was nothing.. See where im getting at, thats an extreme change > durability to his former self.. Yes it was not but it was closed enough that Odin was nearly fooled by it till closed exam. and found out that it was his doing that made it but he dif. compared it to WM.

What im sayin is if he was extremely powerful in his insane mode why fall to Bill? Why couldn't he feel Surfer in one blow before the mention of the amp? heck Surfer was hit by a hammer throw, a few hammer hit in the head and still able to talk to him while later after the mention of the amp Thor was one shoting him..

Ill finish later kinda late..lol

Taking 4 consecutive hits from Stormbreaker to the head only a page after taking a full double handed swing from a charging Bill to the back of the neck when he was busy with the Silver Surfer resulting in him only being knocked off his feet and then later going on to tank a double hit from Maxam and Power Gem Drax and staying on his feet does not indicate a sudden rise in durability. This is further backed up by the fact that even before he descended into the depth of the madness, Thor took a double hit from both Power Gem Drax and the Hulk himself and wasn't even bothered by it.

http://i779.photobucket.com/albums/yy73/R-O-G/Thor/ThorvsDrax2.jpg
http://i779.photobucket.com/albums/yy73/R-O-G/Thor/ThorvsDrax3.jpg

So again, I don't see the sudden rise in durability that your claiming. To me, the damage he tanked from Bill is more impressive than what he did with Drax and Maxam.

The combined assault of Adam Warlock and the Silver Surfer? Adam Warlock's attacks were useless as a result of Thor's fortified immortal soul and Thor has tanked far worse than the Silver Surfer's energy blasts unharmed. So again, I don't see where the claim that Thor had a sudden rise in durability is coming from.

Why fall to Bill? Because he was a raging animal and Bill resorted to using his superior skill instead of trying to overpower him. There is a gap between the two, but the gap is not that large that a calm head and outmaneuvering along with consecutive blows won't trump it. This might shock you, but damage adds up. Being crazy doesn't mean his invulnerable or immune to pain. Oh, and Thor has put Bill down with a single hit after Warrior Madness.

This might shock you, but Thor didn't beat Bill in one hit either. That was a nice feat for Surfer, staying conscious while being smacked around like that. Norrin later being knocked out in one hammer blow does not indicate a sudden increase in strength from Thor. It might be that he just couldn't handle any more attacks. Maybe the damage added up. *Gasp* Shocking right? And the fact that Thor even got further pissed, saying enough of their game of back and forth might also be the reason why his swing backed some more power. He might have just kicked it up a notch.

Honestly, going by your logic every time Thor out does himself or goes on to defeat an opponent he couldn't before or was losing to, he was being amped.

Again, this claims of a sudden increase in strength and power are baseless. Hell, where would these increases come from? The Valkyrie was nothing more than a manifestation of his mind. If he was able to draw on any power, it would be his own. It doesn't make any sense.

I know the idea that Thor is above Norrin troubles you but that shit was evident as far back as Stan Lee's days.

I have to go to bed now, it's late. We will finish this tomorrow.

Originally posted by Ambient
You've got Insane Thor @ 100% max potential; unfettered bloodlust.. lost to BRB on the ground lying w/ Surfer watching, a power amp is mentioned, Thor got up and proceeded to stomp both, then Warlock comes, he got stomp too along with Surfer. All this high heralds got beaten so easyly. That right there is quite clear, that Insane Thor went from 100% max to way above potential. He is no Hulk, course unless he drew strength from the Insanity...

Originally posted by kgkg
This was not just a Thor who was mad he was insane. Surfer says he was holding back when he starts to fight Thor with PG.

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
"This time" would suggest that in a previous encounter with the mad Thor, he was holding back to at least some extent, correct? That I agree with. When he first encountered Thor with Bill, he was holding back. However, he went on to cut loose after he realized that reasoning with Thor would fail. Both statements can fit into the series of events without contradicting each other.

And this:

Originally posted by quanchi112
You are taking this out of context with this scene and applying it to another one.

In the end, just refer to the below scan links for the chronological ordering of the fights in question (particularly the 13th link down on the idea that Surfer was holding back):

Originally posted by OneDumbG0
Thor (bloodlusted) vs Beta Ray Bill rematch, from Thor #468:
http://i388.photobucket.com/albums/oo326/OneDumbG0/Thor%20Fights/ThorvsBetaRayBill11Thor468.jpg
http://i388.photobucket.com/albums/oo326/OneDumbG0/Thor%20Fights/ThorvsBetaRayBill12.jpg
http://i388.photobucket.com/albums/oo326/OneDumbG0/Thor%20Fights/ThorvsBetaRayBill13.jpg
http://i388.photobucket.com/albums/oo326/OneDumbG0/Thor%20Fights/ThorvsBetaRayBill14.jpg
http://i388.photobucket.com/albums/oo326/OneDumbG0/Thor%20Fights/ThorvsBetaRayBill15.jpg

Thor (bloodlusted) vs Beta Ray Bill & Silver Surfer, from Silver Surfer vol. 3 #86:
http://i388.photobucket.com/albums/oo326/OneDumbG0/Thor%20Fights/ThorvsBetaRayBillSilverSurfer01SS86.jpg
http://i388.photobucket.com/albums/oo326/OneDumbG0/Thor%20Fights/ThorvsBetaRayBillSilverSurfer02.jpg
http://i388.photobucket.com/albums/oo326/OneDumbG0/Thor%20Fights/ThorvsBetaRayBillSilverSurfer03.jpg
http://i388.photobucket.com/albums/oo326/OneDumbG0/Thor%20Fights/ThorvsBetaRayBillSilverSurfer04.jpg
http://i388.photobucket.com/albums/oo326/OneDumbG0/Thor%20Fights/ThorvsBetaRayBillSilverSurfer05.jpg
http://i388.photobucket.com/albums/oo326/OneDumbG0/Thor%20Fights/ThorvsBetaRayBillSilverSurfer06.jpg

--------------------

Thor (bloodlusted) vs Silver Surfer (bloodlusted), from Silver Surfer vol. 3 #86:
http://i388.photobucket.com/albums/oo326/OneDumbG0/Thor%20Fights/ThorvsSilverSurfer06SS86.jpg
http://i388.photobucket.com/albums/oo326/OneDumbG0/Thor%20Fights/ThorvsSilverSurfer07.jpg <--------
http://i388.photobucket.com/albums/oo326/OneDumbG0/Thor%20Fights/ThorvsSilverSurfer08.jpg

Thor (bloodlusted) vs Silver Surfer & Adam Warlock, from Infinity Watch #23:
http://i388.photobucket.com/albums/oo326/OneDumbG0/Thor%20Fights/ThorvsSilverSurferAdamWarlock01Infi.jpg
http://i388.photobucket.com/albums/oo326/OneDumbG0/Thor%20Fights/ThorvsSilverSurferAdamWarlock02.jpg
http://i388.photobucket.com/albums/oo326/OneDumbG0/Thor%20Fights/ThorvsSilverSurferAdamWarlock03.jpg
http://i388.photobucket.com/albums/oo326/OneDumbG0/Thor%20Fights/ThorvsSilverSurferAdamWarlock04.jpg
http://i388.photobucket.com/albums/oo326/OneDumbG0/Thor%20Fights/ThorvsSilverSurferAdamWarlock05.jpg
http://i388.photobucket.com/albums/oo326/OneDumbG0/Thor%20Fights/ThorvsSilverSurferAdamWarlock06.jpg
http://i388.photobucket.com/albums/oo326/OneDumbG0/Thor%20Fights/ThorvsSilverSurferAdamWarlock07.jpg

Originally posted by OneDumbG0
That wasn't a "power amp." At all. Thor's ability to bounce back from taking a righteous beatdown has been demonstrated time and time again. This instance isn't even nearly his most impressive. Thor vs Mangog, then Mangog again, then amped-Thanosi BEFORE he was given Odinpowered armor was far more impressive. It just came at the expense of less popular characters. This: 👆

And this: 👆

In the end, just refer to the below scan links for the chronological ordering of the fights in question (particularly the 13th link down on the idea that Surfer was holding back):

Thor has SS's number.

And he has never called.

Poor Surfer.

No broz, no hoz.

Surfer has been crushing on Thor since he saved his life from Molecule Man.

http://i38.photobucket.com/albums/e139/RageOfTheGod/Thor/FreesSurfer2.jpg

???????????????????????????????????????????

?

???

Originally posted by quanchi112
Surfer was interfering giving Bill the opening and he temporarily bested him because it was still Thor with no amp.

Bill's hammer against his head did far more damage than warlock and the surfer's weak blows. That much is obvious.

The writer had that line to show Surfer taking off the kiddie gloves yet it didn't matter.

One puny single blast from Surfer equal bloodlust?? Again we have not seen Surfer crosses the line..

Weak hardly, this are two powerful cosmic beings whose brute strength or projectile been measured/stated to toppled planets yet they're combined attack had but little effect (probably just tickled him). Then we've got PG Drax/Maxam brutal sneak attack in the back of the head with no effect and proceeded to mauled the Watch. A similar attack from the duo minus the pg from Drax and that brought down Bill whose supposedly equal or a little less than Thor.. See where im getting at.. That is a wide margin of > durability of Thor from the start of BT crossover..

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
again, I don't see the sudden rise in durability that your claiming. To me, the damage he tanked from Bill is more impressive than what he did with Drax and Maxam.

Honestly, going by your logic every time Thor out does himself or goes on to defeat an opponent he couldn't before or was losing to, he was being amped.

Again, this claims of a sudden increase in strength and power are baseless. Hell, where would these increases come from? The Valkyrie was nothing more than a manifestation of his mind. If he was able to draw on any power, it would be his own. It doesn't make any sense.

I know the idea that Thor is above Norrin troubles you but that shit was evident as far back as Stan Lee's days.

I have to go to bed now, it's late. We will finish this tomorrow.

Its just that in this arc he was supposedly going full throttle at start unlike say his other showings where he gradually > in strength due to him holding down.. he should have showed consistency in his feat in this arc as oppose to the latter..

Very little was explain about this madness other than its similarities to True WM, maybe it was tapping to same forces as True WM..

Not really.. 🙄

Originally posted by OneDumbG0
That wasn't a "power amp." At all. Thor's ability to bounce back from taking a righteous beatdown has been demonstrated time and time again. This instance isn't even nearly his most impressive. Thor vs Mangog, then Mangog again, then amped-Thanosi BEFORE he was given Odinpowered armor was far more impressive. It just came at the expense of less popular characters. This: 👆

Originally posted by Ambient
OneDumbGo posted the scan and it was even..

One puny single blast from Surfer equal bloodlust?? Again we have not seen Surfer crosses the line..

Weak hardly, this are two powerful cosmic beings whose brute strength or projectile been measured/stated to toppled planets yet they're combined attack had but little effect (probably just tickled him). Then we've got PG Drax/Maxam brutal sneak attack in the back of the head with no effect and proceeded to mauled the Watch. A similar attack from the duo minus the pg from Drax and that brought down Bill whose supposedly equal or a little less than Thor.. See where im getting at.. That is a wide margin of > durability of Thor from the start of BT crossover..

The fight with the inf. watch i think is far more impressive the the Crusade crossover scan showed, not only he was tanking this two but the whole watch attacks..

Its just that in this arc he was supposedly going full throttle at start unlike say his other showings where he gradually > in strength due to him holding down.. he should have showed consistency in his feat in this arc as oppose to the latter..

Very little was explain about this madness other than its similarities to True WM, maybe it was tapping to same forces as True WM..

Not really.. 🙄

I just think that what Bill said had some merit to it..