Originally posted by Naija boy
When he finally began realizing his full powers, he was able to out-molecular manip the molecule man who is a molecular manipulator several several degress higher than Surfer (and molecular manip is usually surfers thing) causing him to disintegrate and then was able to easily do the same thing to Loki with the norn stones amping him (Loki who himself has high level matter manipulation). plus his casual handling of thor and the rest of the avengers.Im one of surfers biggest supporters on this forum but i know that he definitely hasnt shown to be able to match someone like molecule man matter manip wise let alone overcome him. Similarly he cant casually disperse a being as powerful as Loki let alone while he is amped.
You have SS in your sig and you're a SS fan, which makes me regret destroying your argument. We could have been friends.
😄
People are funny when they cite the Sentry's feats. It's like they mystically forget the entire context of the feat, and they leave out all the relevant information.
Feat: the Void beats MM and sends him away.
What everyone forgets:
A) Owen Reece mentions that he 'tasted' Bob's molecules some time before the feat. Right after the feat Bob mentions how he just discovered that he can control his own molecules. Noting how the Void has no significant feats of molecular manipulation beyond someone associated with his own molecules, we can conclude that he can control his molecular structure but not necessarily control that of others. He most likely beat Reece by manipulating his own molecules within him.
Also, the feat in itself is not proof of "higher degrees" of anything. Beyond blowing MM up and sending him away, the Void hasn't demonstrated precision control of his powers. Surfer has transmuted things and created structures from thin air with his powers, broken matter down into energy and back to matter. The Void has done nothing similar beyond affecting himself.
B) "Defeating Loki" is a feat that we cannot judge straightaway. The phrase itself means nothing to prove someone's power. Thor has beaten Loki by tapping his arm with Mjolnir, and in other times had to work hard for it. Suspicious how Loki bargained with Mephisto and Hela to make himself essentially immortal right before he was "killed". It may be that he faked his own death.
If you think the Void's feats are better than the Surfer's, you're not a big enough Surfer fan. I've already mentioned his feats in other threads: exploding a planet to prove a point to Ravenous, accelerating the evolution of an entire planet, reconstructing Earth when weakened, beating Uni-Lord, etc.
Originally posted by bbrem123
doesnt mean he was weaker tho...he doesnt need to shake the universe everytime he fights
It means it was very low showing for Molecule Man while at the same being a very high showing for Sentry/Void. If you want to go High for High End Feats, Surfer completely stomps Void. As would Thor, Superman, and lots of High Heralds.
As is, we don't simply use "BEST FEATS EVER FTW" debating. Or we shouldn't, anyway.
Originally posted by Johnny Sorrow
You have SS in your sig and you're a SS fan, which makes me regret destroying your argument. We could have been friends.
😄People are funny when they cite the Sentry's feats. It's like they mystically forget the entire context of the feat, and they leave out all the relevant information.
Feat: the Void beats MM and sends him away.
What everyone forgets:
A) Owen Reece mentions that he 'tasted' Bob's molecules some time before the feat. Right after the feat Bob mentions how he just discovered that he can control his own molecules. Noting how the Void has no significant feats of molecular manipulation beyond someone associated with his own molecules, we can conclude that he can control his molecular structure but not necessarily control that of others. He most likely beat Reece by manipulating his own molecules within him.Also, the feat in itself is not proof of "higher degrees" of anything. Beyond blowing MM up and sending him away, the Void hasn't demonstrated precision control of his powers. Surfer has transmuted things and created structures from thin air with his powers, broken matter down into energy and back to matter. The Void has done nothing similar beyond affecting himself.
B) "Defeating Loki" is a feat that we cannot judge straightaway. The phrase itself means nothing to prove someone's power. Thor has beaten Loki by tapping his arm with Mjolnir, and in other times had to work hard for it. Suspicious how Loki bargained with Mephisto and Hela to make himself essentially immortal right before he was "killed". It may be that he faked his own death.
If you think the Void's feats are better than the Surfer's, you're not a big enough Surfer fan. I've already mentioned his feats in other threads: exploding a planet to prove a point to Ravenous, accelerating the evolution of an entire planet, reconstructing Earth when weakened, beating Uni-Lord, etc.
sentry says he can control the molecules of his world...not just his body..nice try tho!...he was also showing he can control molecules by making the little werewolf in his hand.(so he definitely has some control). say surfer has better molecule manipulation is just foolish
Originally posted by JakeTheBank
Anyone with common sense can tell Molecule Man per Dark Avengers was one of his lowest showings he's ever had.
I don't understand this....
He was as powerful as ever.
He was just depressed and had become a recluse. He didn't kill such powerful heroes because he just wanted to be left alone and killing heroes would've resulted in more trespassing onto his land. That's why he opened a diplomatic conversation with Osborne.
Who in turn told him that if he killed his Avengers people like Reed Richards would have created some kind of doomsday weapon to put him down.
MM tried to play nice in his own sick way and failed when Sentry evolved to his next level and crushed him.
Originally posted by the ninjak
I don't understand this....He was as powerful as ever.
He was just depressed and had become a recluse. He didn't kill such powerful heroes because he just wanted to be left alone and killing heroes would've resulted in more trespassing onto his land. That's why he opened a diplomatic conversation with Osborne.
Who in turn told him that if he killed his Avengers people like Reed Richards would have created some kind of doomsday weapon to put him down.
MM tried to play nice in his own sick way and failed when Sentry evolved to his next level and crushed him.
Right.
And it was a low showing for Molecule Man based on the numerous feats he has under his belt.
Originally posted by JakeTheBank
It means it was very low showing for Molecule Man while at the same being a very high showing for Sentry/Void. If you want to go High for High End Feats, Surfer completely stomps Void. As would Thor, Superman, and lots of High Heralds.As is, we don't simply use "BEST FEATS EVER FTW" debating. Or we shouldn't, anyway.
it is is power man...molecule manipulation is what he does. it doesnt make it a high showing for him and a low showing for MM. Void is just better at it then MM that is it. That is why they made the comic to show this. and no surfer feats dont.
Originally posted by bbrem123
it is is power man...molecule manipulation is what he does. it doesnt make it a high showing for him and a low showing for MM. Void is just better at it then MM that is it. That is why they made the comic to show this. and no surfer feats dont.
I fail to see what's hard to grasp about what I'm saying.
Void beating Molecule Man at his own game is a HUGE feat for him, correct? Probably his single best feat ever. Molecule Man being beaten by someone who just learned how to do the same gimmick he's been known for is likewise a LOW feat for him. That's really not up for debate.
And yes, Surfer's high end feats trump what Sentry did.
Originally posted by Johnny Sorrow
You have SS in your sig and you're a SS fan, which makes me regret destroying your argument. We could have been friends.
😄People are funny when they cite the Sentry's feats. It's like they mystically forget the entire context of the feat, and they leave out all the relevant information.
Feat: the Void beats MM and sends him away.
What everyone forgets:
A) Owen Reece mentions that he 'tasted' Bob's molecules some time before the feat. Right after the feat Bob mentions how he just discovered that he can control his own molecules. Noting how the Void has no significant feats of molecular manipulation beyond someone associated with his own molecules, we can conclude that he can control his molecular structure but not necessarily control that of others. He most likely beat Reece by manipulating his own molecules within him.Also, the feat in itself is not proof of "higher degrees" of anything. Beyond blowing MM up and sending him away, the Void hasn't demonstrated precision control of his powers. Surfer has transmuted things and created structures from thin air with his powers, broken matter down into energy and back to matter. The Void has done nothing similar beyond affecting himself.
B) "Defeating Loki" is a feat that we cannot judge straightaway. The phrase itself means nothing to prove someone's power. Thor has beaten Loki by tapping his arm with Mjolnir, and in other times had to work hard for it. Suspicious how Loki bargained with Mephisto and Hela to make himself essentially immortal right before he was "killed". It may be that he faked his own death.
If you think the Void's feats are better than the Surfer's, you're not a big enough Surfer fan. I've already mentioned his feats in other threads: exploding a planet to prove a point to Ravenous, accelerating the evolution of an entire planet, reconstructing Earth when weakened, beating Uni-Lord, etc.
He explictly states his powers actually work by manipulating the world arround him, molecules specifically; he desintegrates molecule man who screams: "I control the molecules of the world! I do!" expressing shock and implying sentry is wrestling control over his molecules from him; he clearly says he can do anything the molecule man can but lacks the experience and sophistication to do it; he makes a werewolf in the palm of his hand out of thin air; he warps the city of new york, his tower in particular; he desintegrates loki - art makes it clear enough that he is being desintegrated.
More importantly, the MM did not actually eat parts of the sentry, he had no sentry molecules within him for sentry to manipulate, this is absurd. He says 'taste' to represent that he experienced the sentry's molecule with his powers, he took nothing of sentry within himself. He made similar remarks when he desintegrated SS board, mjolnir and CA shield. He obviously has beyond-human senses that let him perceive the properties of matter without contact.
Originally posted by JakeTheBank
I fail to see what's hard to grasp about what I'm saying.Void beating Molecule Man at his own game is a HUGE feat for him, correct? Probably his single best feat ever. Molecule Man being beaten by someone who just learned how to do the same gimmick he's been known for is likewise a LOW feat for him. That's really not up for debate.
I agree.
I just don't agree when people say MM's powerset was dampened. It wasn't, just his urge to fight.
And I reckon Sentry beating MM wasn't in the end fair.
Sentry attacked him from behind and got a good lock on him before MM could get equal footing.
Sentry fought dirty and rightly so! If the fight was fair with both combatants staring at each other from across a field then the fight would probably gone in favour of MM.
Originally posted by quanchi112
When? We saw Henshaw crush him. What line and what did we see?That's due to his magical powers not outside help for the fight. Superman needed outside help to deal with him and if a character can cut off his power source then it sucks to be Superman. If Surfer drains the gamma it sucks to be Hulk not that he has outside help.
Superman's never gotten to the point of raping the gl corps or stomping apokolips with Darkseid included.
at the end of the fight, henshaw was on the ground. kal wasn't. fights happen off panel all the time.
Atlas had outside help. To say he didn't when he obviously did is border-line trolling.
He has higher feats than Doomsday. Don't even TRY to go there.
Originally posted by bbrem123
molecule man was fight the same sentry as they were in siege so it really doesnt matter... and thor must have a a big amp...one stone made cap capable of hurting void so one can only image how power thor got. then you have loki with all of them get stomped with the slighted of ease
read my original post again, please.
Originally posted by -Pr-
at the end of the fight, henshaw was on the ground. kal wasn't. fights happen off panel all the time.Atlas had outside help. To say he didn't when he obviously did is border-line trolling.
He has higher feats than Doomsday. Don't even TRY to go there.
read my original post again, please.
Where did you get the image for your sig, PR?