Originally posted by MooCowofJusticeThey can implore their troops but they can't just overtake enemies because first off we don't even know if it would work and secondly eg can't just rez every character when they die and send them back out there.
How's that a cheap tactic? I could understand Ganondorf and elder god, but creating fields of Twilight? It's like a magic spell.
Originally posted by MooCowofJusticeWho did Zant just turn into a mindless shadow beast like that? he used powerful magic on his own people but he didn't just blink and turn everyone who opposed him into shadow beasts. When did he do it to anyone?
We don't know if it would work on someone from another universe. Really?How do we know if Kain's spells will work on people from other universes? Or the Soul Reaver? Avoid this logic.
And I don't see the comparison between "rezing" and Twilight.
4:41
"Remember that lady from the general store? Just one of those things attacked her, and a whole gang from town went to save her! And what happened? She was already gone, and there were TWO monsters waitin'!"
...You connectin' the dots? That means if we get attacked by them, then we'll be..."
And then 6:22.
"You are chosen by the gods, and only that keeps you from turning into a spirit, or worse, into a dark monster when you enter twilight."
Looks to me like the twilight does it by itself, and since Zant can call the twilight up at will, he certainly can. Also, this means that whoever is killed by the Shadow Beasts becomes one, and if you remember, they can revive themselves as long as one is left alive. LoK's army is in trouble.
Originally posted by The ScenarioSo just random speculation that he can do so despite never seeing him do so one time? Tbh they'd need this against a superior army with superior grunts. The shadow beasts are quite weak anyways.
YouTube video4:41
"Remember that lady from the general store? Just one of those things attacked her, and a whole gang from town went to save her! And what happened? She was already gone, and there were TWO monsters waitin'!"
...You connectin' the dots? That means if we get attacked by them, then we'll be..."And then 6:22.
"You are [b]chosen by the gods
, and only that keeps you from turning into a spirit, or worse, into a dark monster when you enter twilight."Looks to me like the twilight does it by itself, and since Zant can call the twilight up at will, he certainly can. Also, this means that whoever is killed by the Shadow Beasts becomes one, and if you remember, they can revive themselves as long as one is left alive. LoK's army is in trouble. [/B]
Originally posted by ScreamPasteThis kinda tactic makes it fair for Moebius to time travel and get as many vampire hunters as he can. Believe me there were a ton.
Shadow beasts overrun LoK via zombie apocalypse.
Originally posted by The ScenarioDid Zant prevail in hyrule?
Exactly. Nobody else really has to lift a finger except Zant.
Originally posted by The Scenario
Behold, evidence of some reality warping.This is Morpheel, the boss of the water temple. You may recognize the area as one of the area Zant copies when he warps reality. The fight isn't really important (maybe Link holding on while it swimsto show a little strength), but no, I direct your attention to 3:50, wherein Morpheel slams its skull into the wall, thus draining the area of water.
Compared to here:
At 5:05. Zant has not teleported Link, or else there would be no water. There is water, however, so it seems Zant has recreated this arena and actually created water for it through the warping of reality. Further, he's created several giant copies of his helmet, which is a nice creation feat.
Thus, should Zant get close enough to pretty much anyone, he'll drown and/or destroy them if they are a vampire. This will kill Kain instantly and severely hinder Raziel. Since Zant can teleport and Raziel can barely attack, I don't see Raziel winning an underwater battle.
So Zant can take out most of the threats from LoK.
Or illusion, why do you keep grabbing onto the "reality warping"? all hes doing is mimicing what previous bosses have done. Theres no evidence to suggest hes actually created these environments and that he can create what he wills, the whole game would contradict him as he would be stronger than Ganondorf.
One problem, can you point out how Zants area is similiar to Morpheels? because its too dark for one thing, you cant see the pillars or the sides of the wall. how do we know its the same area? also it doesnt look like hes fighting the same as Morpheel like he is in the other boss fights...
No it wont kill any vampire instantly, first of all Vampires can survive years in the abyss, second, Raziels Earth reaver makes him heavier than water so he can walk on the ground as if its land so hes not hindered at all. Also this looks like contained water, not running water.
No he cant, sorry but if he tries to teleport or even as you assume reality warp its still 5 seconds too slow and a few guys with arrows bring him down, or better yet Kain in one teleport kills him. Nice try though I suppose...
Originally posted by quanchi112
How could they do so if an entire army didn't feel comfortable to send assassins or what not to dispose of him? He's far above any human and handled Midna with her amp and Link midway through like children. He's a badass.
Thats what I said earlier about how easily these people could be brought down, my answer to this personally is either they dont have assassins, their resources are poor, they have no backbone so their simply terrified of Zant or more importantly the twilight may have morphed them. Your trying to invent a reason for him to be impressive, what actual feats has he shown that outlines that he could survive a few Sarafan arrows? Midna destroyed Zant with a portion of her power at the end of their fight....
Originally posted by MooCowofJustice
Since when are Ganon's teleports slower?Yes, Kain does have a slow teleport. I've seen it.
There is really nothing I can say about this. For whatever reason, you chose to undermine yourself by putting "would" in quotation marks.
Fact list time, because I know you respond to these so well.
1. Zant's teleport actually shows him being broken down/shrunk before disappearing. The reality warping does not (this means it isn't a teleport).
2. Link is unaffected by evil magic. Zant is evil, yet, according to you, was able to affect Link with his magic anyway (this means that Link wasn't actually the target of the magic).
3. The room actually melts away and reforms (to teleport, Link and Zant would have to have done that).
Your definition of "a lot" is three? That's my definition of "few." And, those few do not support everything you say.
Since the first Zelda games, he is slow and predictable. Thats assuming ofc they are teleports, they looked more like movemet speed and afterimages to me.
nah, not by LoZ standards.
I said would because its completly theoretical as he would be killed and re-spun as a peasant in the EG's wheel of fate in truth.
1. No it does not, not at all. Just because one of Zants teleporting moves looks different its automatically reality warping? I lold....Kains got several teleports that look different as well, perhaps Kains reality warping as well!
2. I thought this was the fanon you were going to bring up, Links not immune, never proven it.
3. No it doesnt, it just goes dark as Zant teleports.....
I can name blood shower, repel shield, bat form, mist form, strength, speed, teleportation (several types), slow time, lightning off and TK the , mind control, inferno top off my head, thats more than 3 since each had their own vid. Theres pages of LoK evidence, anything I say is supported by actual evidence, not as I said ambigious opiniontated scenes that dont really show anything.
The rest is proven in Dark chronicle if its not had a video simply because its based on older games that not allof which were recorded. Like spirit wrack.
Originally posted by The Scenario
Ganondorf would definitely dispatch Zant to eliminate Kain.
Zant cannot harm Kain, both physically or mentally, he will however be a fair game for mind control so its all well and good!
Originally posted by ScreamPaste
What stops Zant from turning everyone in LoK into shadow beasts, souls, or hamsters? mmmAlso, "to you" is irrelevant, the soul reaver is below the master sword in power, and Raziel would get destroyed by any of the major Zelda characters who isn't in a dress. 😛
Because he cant? sort of like how he couldnt have done that to Zelda and her soldiers and had to attack with Shadow beasts?
No its not, the Soul reaver has powers and feats that can list on for pages, the MS has extra effectivness against evil, I lold!
(oh, and it can act like a key in plot determined temples!)
Originally posted by The Scenario
YouTube video2:00-2:30
"The Guardian Dieties of my world are on our side, too!"
Anyway, this also serves to protect Link from most anything Zant or Ganondorf could throw at him. The guy's got the support of multiple gods behind him, not to mention the Master Sword and Triforce of Courage.
Also, just because the Master Sword isn't very flashy doesn't mean it's weak.
Look at that. Midna just got tossed like freaking ragdoll, and the curse on Link got sealed into a crystal after it was broken. The Master Sword protects Link from magic pretty darn well.
See the Triforce of Courage there? That thing on Link's hand that repelled a Shadow Beast and turned him into a Wolf instead of a spirit like the others? It kept him physical, which is pretty nice.
So yeah, Link's got at least three different levels of protection on him, which prevent hax and tend to hurt evil things and generally dark things like Midna, who isn't necessarily evil. Master Sword will probably kill Raziel just for being a vampire/soul reaver.
fallible statements!
no it does not protest him as its a fallible statement and pretty useless as the power of these Gods (assuming it was not just a fallible statement) is just enough to expel "evil fog" with a sword 😆 your reaching, LoK has an actual continent smothering God with physical feats behind it unlike TP's.
Look at that! something with as much weight as a melon was tossed! zomg!!! this is probably the Masterswords only outside of normal sword feat I asssume consdiering you could not find something better? also this only proves that the MS can after a long charge (and possibly onyl while its in its plinth in that temple) can reform link from being transformed into a wolf, not that its a passive protection against further transformation.
Triforce of courage protects him against basic evil transformation, and not too well as he is still transformed....
Originally posted by quanchi112
He can't.
No your right, he cant because the only thing that allowed twilight to enter (naturally because with it, there is no twilight) is the darkening of light spirits and the only thing the twilight effected was normal citizens...anyone with magical protection it seems was fine.
Their trying to use twilight as a no limit fallacy basically 😉
Originally posted by ScreamPaste
Shadow beasts overrun LoK via zombie apocalypse.
Stronger and faster vampires say otherwise, as do the Sarafan equiped with light and holy magic. Oh and I almost forgot a certain giant ocoptus who will kill the whole TP army with a few tentacle swings...oh and wait! Raziel opens his cowl and devours their souls...or the council of nine create a better than trueforce expanding field of reality warp that transforms TP into mindless beasts under their control.
Originally posted by quanchi112
Did Zant prevail in hyrule?
No, one boy with a little imp and some basic tactics beat the predictable and physically featless robed wimp. A few arrows or any of the teleporters kill Zant from the start...thats this whole twilight no limit fallacy vanquished.
Midna destroyed Zant after he was nearly killed by Link in battle. He was beaten so destroying him with her power she acquired is no low feat at all. If it were as easy as you say to defeat Zant he wouldn't have dominated an entire realm with Link and Midna included. We see him in battle so to suggest a few arrows can kill him is about as ridiculous as saying a few bomb arrows can kill Kain.
I get that they are trying to say anything to say stomp just like you have previous times. I am trying to eliminate all these cheap little ways someone can say oh this guy solos and all that.
The hero destined to win along with an amped Midna beat him later on whereas in the middle of the game he crushed the both of them.
Originally posted by quanchi112
So just random speculation that he can do so despite never seeing him do so one time? Tbh they'd need this against a superior army with superior grunts. The shadow beasts are quite weak anyways.This kinda tactic makes it fair for Moebius to time travel and get as many vampire hunters as he can. Believe me there were a ton.
Did Zant prevail in hyrule?
Bring on the vampire hunters. Normal men will be less than fodder against Hyrule. 😐 They get turned into shadow beasts, swelling Hyrule's numbers, or just lol'd at and whiped out in a single instant by Zant, let alone Ganondorf.
Don't care what they can get from the history of Nosgoth. Link/Ganondorf/Zelda form the triforce, and destroy LoK in an instant. The only thing in LoK I could even see puttign down any shadow beasts is the EG himself, which will either get obliterated by the triforce, or just good old fashioned slain by Link.
Originally posted by ScreamPasteYes, I played it so why don't you give me one example. Transforming Link whose a normal little guy into a wolf who isn't mindless and who has powers isn't the same thing as turning someone into a mindless shadow beast.
No, did you even play TP? Zant can transform people. The ToC meant Link can only be transformed into a wolf, who was still physicly powerful. No one in LoK has that protection. Also, Shadow beasts are above vampires, and can be seen overrunning 'elite humans' with ease, where as a handul defeated the most physicly powerful vampire in LoK. Weak? Lol'd.Bring on the vampire hunters. Normal men will be less than fodder against Hyrule. 😐 They get turned into shadow beasts, swelling Hyrule's numbers, or just lol'd at and whiped out in a single instant by Zant, let alone Ganondorf.
Don't care what they can get from the history of Nosgoth. Link/Ganondorf/Zelda form the triforce, and destroy LoK in an instant. The only thing in LoK I could even see puttign down any shadow beasts is the EG himself, which will either get obliterated by the triforce, or just good old fashioned slain by Link.
Give me one example of Zant turning anyone into a mindless shadow beast. He couldn't even get Midna to follow him so how does he get powerful foes with magic to do his bidding?
These tactics aren't allowed so quit wanking Zelda and blowing things out of proportion. Nowhere in this game did anyone access the triforce and eliminate anyone. Please replay the game and get a clue and get back to me.
Mages defeated ganondrof and he accessed the triforce of power. That's not overtly impressive since you claim all they have to do is access it to solo armies, right?
Originally posted by Burning thought
Since the first Zelda games, he is slow and predictable. Thats assuming ofc they are teleports, they looked more like movemet speed and afterimages to me.
Zant's are faster. Zant's power = Ganon's.
Originally posted by Burning thought
nah, not by LoZ standards.
Lol, LoZ standards, as if you knew what you were talking about. I've seen a Kain teleport take at least three seconds. But then again, this is without you wanking it to incredible levels.
Originally posted by Burning thought
1. No it does not, not at all. Just because one of Zants teleporting moves looks different its automatically reality warping? I lold....Kains got several teleports that look different as well, perhaps Kains reality warping as well!2. I thought this was the fanon you were going to bring up, Links not immune, never proven it.
3. No it doesnt, it just goes dark as Zant teleports.....
1. No, because Link is affected. And it's clearly the room that does the changing, not Link and Zant. Kain can reality warp when everything else changes and he remains the same.
2. It's been proven for almost as long as I've been a member here. It's actually been so long I don't even remember where the quote was.
However, it expels evil magic in TP by freeing Link from Wolf Form after being cursed by Zant. Link didn't even have to touch it for it to do that.
3. Actually it goes dark as Zant warps the room into the form of his choosing.
Originally posted by Burning thought
I can name blood shower, repel shield, bat form, mist form, strength, speed, teleportation (several types), slow time, lightning off and TK the , mind control, inferno top off my head, thats more than 3 since each had their own vid. Theres pages of LoK evidence, anything I say is supported by actual evidence, not as I said ambigious opiniontated scenes that dont really show anything.The rest is proven in Dark chronicle if its not had a video simply because its based on older games that not allof which were recorded. Like spirit wrack.
You one said Kain could recreate the big bang. You've said he could kill Link with these spells despite no feats above killing humans, if they even had that.
So I'll ask you a question, could Kain lift a Goron with his TK?
Originally posted by quanchi112
Yes, I played it so why don't you give me one example. Transforming Link whose a normal little guy into a wolf who isn't mindless and who has powers isn't the same thing as turning someone into a mindless shadow beast.Give me one example of Zant turning anyone into a mindless shadow beast. He couldn't even get Midna to follow him so how does he get powerful foes with magic to do his bidding?
These tactics aren't allowed so quit wanking Zelda and blowing things out of proportion. Nowhere in this game did anyone access the triforce and eliminate anyone. Please replay the game and get a clue and get back to me.
Mages defeated ganondrof and he accessed the triforce of power. That's not overtly impressive since you claim all they have to do is access it to solo armies, right?
See Scenario's post, Zant doesn't even need to do it personally. The beasts can do it themselves, and who do you think created the first shadow beasts?
Lol, @ you just "disallowing" almost everything in Zelda. 🙄. You played TP, yes? You "get a clue", then. Link has the Triforce of Courage, Zelda/Midna have/had Wisdom, and Ganondorf has power. The three simply combine them, instant win. "It's super effective! Critical hit!".
LOL. No, he was captured before he had it. Impaled before, he had it, and only sealed away by the mirror of Twilight. He came back, and through out the game we're witnessing his power. Zant, with a fraction of Ganondorf's power was capable of soloing armies. haermm
Originally posted by Burning thought
Or illusion, why do you keep grabbing onto the "reality warping"? all hes doing is mimicing what previous bosses have done. Theres no evidence to suggest hes actually created these environments and that he can create what he wills, the whole game would contradict him as he would be stronger than Ganondorf.
If was an illusion, why does Link need to swim/use the Zora armor? Why is Zant still affected by the acid water in the Diababa copy? Why does the floor becomes slippery in the Blizzeta copy? There was even a new area that seemed to be just outside Hyrule Castle, where Link never fought anything but Zant.
Even if it's an illusion (which it obviously isn't), it's still real enough to drown humans and destroy vampires.
One problem, can you point out how Zants area is similiar to Morpheels? because its too dark for one thing, you cant see the pillars or the sides of the wall. how do we know its the same area? also it doesnt look like hes fighting the same as Morpheel like he is in the other boss fights...
Only further proof that Zant created it. There is no other chamber like that in the Water Temple, or the entire game, so Zant had to have created it, which explains the differences. He doesn't fight the same in as the boss itself in most of them.
No it wont kill any vampire instantly, first of all Vampires can survive years in the abyss, second, Raziels Earth reaver makes him heavier than water so he can walk on the ground as if its land so hes not hindered at all. Also this looks like contained water, not running water.
Raziel was protected by the Elder God, or was ressurrected as you say he can do. Raziel's physical body was destroyed, and even after this the Elder God tells him that water will dissolve his new physical body because he's a vampire. It doesn't matter if it's running water or not, as I've seen both send Raziel back to the spectral realm before he beats Rahab.
No he cant, sorry but if he tries to teleport or even as you assume reality warp its still 5 seconds too slow and a few guys with arrows bring him down, or better yet Kain in one teleport kills him. Nice try though I suppose...
It takes significantly shorter to simply transform them or loose twilight. After that, he can destroy them at his leisure. Five seconds is not that short, however.
Thats what I said earlier about how easily these people could be brought down, my answer to this personally is either they dont have assassins, their resources are poor, they have no backbone so their simply terrified of Zant or more importantly the twilight may have morphed them. Your trying to invent a reason for him to be impressive, what actual feats has he shown that outlines that he could survive a few Sarafan arrows? Midna destroyed Zant with a portion of her power at the end of their fight....
They were transformed. Zant's fast enough to teleport away before warping reality.
Since the first Zelda games, he is slow and predictable. Thats assuming ofc they are teleports, they looked more like movemet speed and afterimages to me.
Then you must have missed his Twilight Princess teleports, despite me showing you multiple times.
Both 3:36 and 4:09
First one is twilight based, also used for possession, and the second is his own isntant teleport.
nah, not by LoZ standards.
Slower than both Ganondorf and Zant.
I said would because its completly theoretical as he would be killed and re-spun as a peasant in the EG's wheel of fate in truth.
How? Prove this. Has he done as much before?
1. No it does not, not at all. Just because one of Zants teleporting moves looks different its automatically reality warping? I lold....Kains got several teleports that look different as well, perhaps Kains reality warping as well!
Not a teleport. Refer again to the differences between areas. Such as the water that wasn't there before.
2. I thought this was the fanon you were going to bring up, Links not immune, never proven it.
There are three different videos proving you wrong here.
3. No it doesnt, it just goes dark as Zant teleports.....
Not a teleport. Refer to the differences between areas a sceond time. Such as the water that wasn't there before.
I can name blood shower, repel shield, bat form, mist form, strength, speed, teleportation (several types), slow time, lightning off and TK the , mind control, inferno top off my head, thats more than 3 since each had their own vid. Theres pages of LoK evidence, anything I say is supported by actual evidence, not as I said ambigious opiniontated scenes that dont really show anything.
How much of that is in Defiance?
The rest is proven in Dark chronicle if its not had a video simply because its based on older games that not allof which were recorded. Like spirit wrack.
Dark Chronicle is down. Regardless, I doubt all of that is Defiance only.
Zant cannot harm Kain, both physically or mentally, he will however be a fair game for mind control so its all well and good!
Just like Kain is perfect for possession. Also, Zant already killed Kain.
Because he cant? sort of like how he couldnt have done that to Zelda and her soldiers and had to attack with Shadow beasts?
1:45, Zant waves his hand and Midna is polymorphed.
0:20, Zant hits several soldiers with twilight, and then Shadow Beasts come out of nowhere. To quote Barnes, "You connectin' the dots?"
No its not, the Soul reaver has powers and feats that can list on for pages, the MS has extra effectivness against evil, I lold!(oh, and it can act like a key in plot determined temples!)
You underestimate the extra effect on evil, and keep ignoring the protection feats.
fallible statements!
From the ruler of the Twilight Realm, who also knows that Sols, those orbs of light that powered up the Master Sword, are the Twili equivalent of the sun.
no it does not protest him as its a fallible statement and pretty useless as the power of these Gods (assuming it was not just a fallible statement) is just enough to expel "evil fog" with a sword 😆 your reaching, LoK has an actual continent smothering God with physical feats behind it unlike TP's.
Enough to protect from dark magic and cut through it like it's not there. From that point on, the Master Sword one-hit kills Shadow Beasts and all other dark creatures.
You've yet to post anything that proves what you're claiming about the Elder God.
Look at that! something with as much weight as a melon was tossed! zomg!!! this is probably the Masterswords only outside of normal sword feat I asssume consdiering you could not find something better? also this only proves that the MS can after a long charge (and possibly onyl while its in its plinth in that temple) can reform link from being transformed into a wolf, not that its a passive protection against further transformation.
And pushed back Wolf Link, who is known to be extremely strong. And we already proved that overcoming Midna's TK is an act measured in the tons. Besides, that wasn't the point of the feat. It was to show that the Master Sword protects Link.
Triforce of courage protects him against basic evil transformation, and not too well as he is still transformed....
Go back up to the Midna video and go to 2:38, where Midna says there was a prophecy that the hero will take the form of a Divine Beast. Guess what the Triforce of Courage turned Link into.
No your right, he cant because the only thing that allowed twilight to enter (naturally because with it, there is no twilight) is the darkening of light spirits and the only thing the twilight effected was normal citizens...anyone with magical protection it seems was fine.
See the Zant invading Hyrule video, above. Does LoK even have protection? Only the Triforce users and beings that lived in twilight were unaffected.
Their trying to use twilight as a no limit fallacy basically 😉
LoK doesn't have feats to defens itself, however.
Stronger and faster vampires say otherwise, as do the Sarafan equiped with light and holy magic. Oh and I almost forgot a certain giant ocoptus who will kill the whole TP army with a few tentacle swings...oh and wait! Raziel opens his cowl and devours their souls...or the council of nine create a better than trueforce expanding field of reality warp that transforms TP into mindless beasts under their control.
Instant revival and zombie style say otherwise. You've got kill all the Shadow Beasts at once, and any of your forces that die will join them, as will some who get hit by twilight. EG's tentacles are pathetically weak from shown feats. He gets overrun eventually. Raziel gets killed by Zant. Circle of nine isn't Defiance.
No, one boy with a little imp and some basic tactics beat the predictable and physically featless robed wimp. A few arrows or any of the teleporters kill Zant from the start...thats this whole twilight no limit fallacy vanquished.
I can't believe you still think this. Zant can teleport, too, and warps reality to kill anyone in his way.
Originally posted by MooCowofJustice
Zant's are faster. Zant's power = Ganon's.Lol, LoZ standards, as if you knew what you were talking about. I've seen a Kain teleport take at least three seconds. But then again, this is without you wanking it to incredible levels.
1. No, because Link is affected. And it's clearly the room that does the changing, not Link and Zant. Kain can reality warp when everything else changes and he remains the same.
2. It's been proven for almost as long as I've been a member here. It's actually been so long I don't even remember where the quote was.
However, it expels evil magic in TP by freeing Link from Wolf Form after being cursed by Zant. Link didn't even have to touch it for it to do that.
3. Actually it goes dark as Zant warps the room into the form of his choosing.
You one said Kain could recreate the big bang. You've said he could kill Link with these spells despite no feats above killing humans, if they even had that.
So I'll ask you a question, could Kain lift a Goron with his TK?
Zants are faster than Ganons so thats not true, its obvious Zant has ways of using Ganons power that Ganon himself does never use or have.
Oh I do, you dont unfortunaltey.
1. This can still be drawn to the conclusion that this is teleportation, the areas are the same.
2. No its not, the idea that its been "proven" is only accepted by the over zealous fanboys.
Yeh after a long charge it can reverse Links transformation into a wolf, lol, its not impressive..
3. Or as he teleports out of it, hence the darkness.
Yeh by using a no limits fallacy sometihng you know all about, like how you tried to claim Link could lift an aircraft carrier. Link is easy game to spells using just what their suppsoed to do, Links got no resistance so you wanking him into something hes not wont save him, nor does it decline the power of an ability.
Not sure how heavy a normal Goron is, should be a piece of cake as Dangaroo who is far larger is stopped by Links weight+some iron, the Sarafan that Kain throws around with ease wear more metal than that.
Originally posted by quanchi112
Midna destroyed Zant after he was nearly killed by Link in battle. He was beaten so destroying him with her power she acquired is no low feat at all. If it were as easy as you say to defeat Zant he wouldn't have dominated an entire realm with Link and Midna included. We see him in battle so to suggest a few arrows can kill him is about as ridiculous as saying a few bomb arrows can kill Kain.I get that they are trying to say anything to say stomp just like you have previous times. I am trying to eliminate all these cheap little ways someone can say oh this guy solos and all that.
The hero destined to win along with an amped Midna beat him later on whereas in the middle of the game he crushed the both of them.
No its not, that would be ridiculous because kain has gaugable feats unlike Zant who would be killed in a few arrows, maybe a slash.
Their trying to use fallacies and things that dont exist, I am using basic abilities.
If your refering to a few TK tricks, thats hardly "crushed", they did not even fight him.
Originally posted by The Scenario
Because its an illusion/mimic of each fight, the power of suggestion is incredible by itself without someone actually seeing before them what their opponent wants them to like Zant seems to be able to. He seems to be able to illusionscape the events from Links mind that Link has previously faced. Also I can throw these back at you and ask why Zant allows himself to be affected by acid water, or why he gives himself the disadvantages of said bosses that he mimics if its him apprently "warping reality", its BS.
Its real enough to make Link believe it, theres no evidence to suggest Zant is creating these places physically.
No, further proof he teleported elseware. You dont see to know "where" that is, and it seems he teleported to an area that was not seen previously.
Theres no indication of protection from anyone, the only thing thats true is after the years Raziel spent in the abyss he was revived one way or another, you will need to prove Zant can keep Raziel in this scape (if he could get him in it) for this duration otherwise he would have done so to Link.
He cant do these things willy nilly and twilight has not affected anything beyond peasents by the looks of the initial video where Zant calls it down. He also requires lack of light, such as the light spirits. 5 seconds is a long time for a few guys to release arrows.
What? fast enough to teleport away before warping reality? the areas he forms are fairly small, room sized assuming he does warp reality or create illusions (i sitll think its more likely teleport, the areas are too similiar in detail and it would not make sense) he is within range of any LoK weapon which would kill him before he can release the "warp".
Thats not teleport, thats pretty much the equivalent of Kains mist form, only its twilight based as you said. The second one does not seem like a teleport at all and more importantly he does it in Zeldas body. He seems to be able to do a few things, such as that blast of TK on Midna that we have not seen him do by himself, or at least I have not.
Not quite.
Thats the very point of the Elder God, he is responsibel for the wheel of fate. The birth, death and rebirth of life in the universe...its how he survives.
He thrives on the dead, spinning their souls in the Wheel of Fate: the purifying cycle of death, birth and rebirth to which all spirits are inexorably drawn
You could not prove the water was even in the water temple and this post outlines how you dont know where that place Zant ports to is alike to it. We cant see the simularities.
Your next few posts are not directed at you and you have taken them out of context, the argument is that those powers have been proven, how relevant they are to this thread is unimportant to that argument 😉
Possessed by whom? you really think any of these characters are going to turn into twilight and reach Kain without having their spirits (without physical forms protecting them) reaved, what a joke. Zant cannot harm Kain, said this.
Has Zant done this outside the twilight realm to something other than a Twili (is that the name of his race? cant remember)?
I forgot that piece of evidence, thanks for helping me out. Soldiers walk throughout that twilight and are unharmed, seems it cannot morph or harm "anyone" afterall which is evidence as he would have used twilight solely and would not need an army.
Not really, its just like any weakness, its "more effective" than a typical weapon or object but thats about it and protection? theres no proof of this, so far youve shown me it can reflect little bolts from Ganon and after a long charge up can reverse a transformation....
gameplay mechanics....and thats still not impressive so I dont know why you mentioned it.
I have posted it so many times before, the Elder God as a physical entity is pretty basic so asking for proof of its strength is like asking for proof of Cronos' from God of war whos size alone affords him strength. Also I am not trying to claim something reaching and ambigious like your claims of protection and reality warping 🙄
Its still fallible because its an out of hand statement not necesserily refering to literal truth, and their Gods are apprently "sols", or better described as tiny orbs of light....
😆 no youve tried to assume that Midna using any Tk including her own levitating just happens to be "in the tonnes", its another huge reach for the LoZ side. Wolf Link strong, based on what? being pushed along by a Ganon braced by a Midna who is actually based on feats strong?
A wolf...thats a divine beast?
Youve shown evidence that twilight does not necesserily transform, mere human soldiers were bathed in it and the shadow beasts were required to crush them. its also outlined in that video that he required to beat Zelda, it seems the will of a leader must protect the planet in some form. Lok are beyond peasants and normal soldiers (well...those who are not sarafan anyway).
No limit fallacy, LoK are beyond normal peasants who were simply taken into twilight. All it takes to push back twilight seems to be light, hence why the MS needed the sols, and the regions require light spirits, LoK has light in the many folds. Also you would not want to turn vampires into souls without physical forms, they are more powerful and gain more power besides as Dumah points out.
This shows huge LoZ fanboyism almost on par with Screampaste, where are the feats that Shadowbeasts all have to be destroyed? also I have seen no reason to belive there are armies of them, on the contary Vampires as you may well know pass on their "dark gift" of vampirism as well so Shadows are not the only ones multiplying. The worst thing youve said in this forum is that EG is going to be overwhelmed? lol and is featless despite burrowd throghout the deep places of a planet and able to multiply and regenerate instantly? the EG can indeed solo this with simply burying of his foes.
Tell that to mortanius and Moebius who are both of the circle of nine 😆 , also tell that to the 500 years Raziel covers in Defiance, the period Defiance is set in covers the future and the past so stop claiming desperate ignorance.
He can teleport sure, warp reality and kill anyone? no....the circle of nine are closer to warping reality.
Originally posted by ScreamPasteWho was turned mindless then? The guy needed Midna because on his own he just wasn't all that and that had a lot to do with why he couldn't completely shatter the twilight mirror.
Clearly you didn't. Link is [b]protected. This is why he's the only one who turns into a Wolf. Also, if you don't remember, a plot point was Zant trying to get Midna to be his queen so he would also have access to the power of the twili.See Scenario's post, Zant doesn't even need to do it personally. The beasts can do it themselves, and who do you think created the first shadow beasts?
Lol, @ you just "disallowing" almost everything in Zelda. 🙄. You played TP, yes? You "get a clue", then. Link has the Triforce of Courage, Zelda/Midna have/had Wisdom, and Ganondorf has power. The three simply combine them, instant win. "It's super effective! Critical hit!".
LOL. No, he was captured before he had it. Impaled before, he had it, and only sealed away by the mirror of Twilight. He came back, and through out the game we're witnessing his power. Zant, with a fraction of Ganondorf's power was capable of soloing armies. haermm [/B]
There weren't tons of shadow beasts throughout the land they warped in and they already had hyrule as their prisoners. So where's the domination in this?
Zant can't just turn an opponent especially one with magic at his side over into a magical shadow beast. You don't even have any instances of him doing so in the game so please use a little common sense.
I am outlawing both cheap tactics and you never even proved this would even work on anyone. it's also hysterical someone would compare a normal hyrulian to the powerful characters who wield magic themselves in nosgoth.
Nowhere in the game were triforces soloing armies. Zant also had an army at his side when he subjugated hyrule's pathetic army. I've never seen a more pathetic army than hyrule's anyways.
Originally posted by Burning thoughtMidna destroyed him after Link beat him. Midna couldn't just destroy him and Ganondorf can rez him as well. His feat were easily wrecking Midna and Link while together like they were minor irritants.
Or illusion, why do you keep grabbing onto the "reality warping"? all hes doing is mimicing what previous bosses have done. Theres no evidence to suggest hes actually created these environments and that he can create what he wills, the whole game would contradict him as he would be stronger than Ganondorf.One problem, can you point out how Zants area is similiar to Morpheels? because its too dark for one thing, you cant see the pillars or the sides of the wall. how do we know its the same area? also it doesnt look like hes fighting the same as Morpheel like he is in the other boss fights...
No it wont kill any vampire instantly, first of all Vampires can survive years in the abyss, second, Raziels Earth reaver makes him heavier than water so he can walk on the ground as if its land so hes not hindered at all. Also this looks like contained water, not running water.
No he cant, sorry but if he tries to teleport or even as you assume reality warp its still 5 seconds too slow and a few guys with arrows bring him down, or better yet Kain in one teleport kills him. Nice try though I suppose...
Thats what I said earlier about how easily these people could be brought down, my answer to this personally is either they dont have assassins, their resources are poor, they have no backbone so their simply terrified of Zant or more importantly the twilight may have morphed them. Your trying to invent a reason for him to be impressive, what actual feats has he shown that outlines that he could survive a few Sarafan arrows? Midna destroyed Zant with a portion of her power at the end of their fight....
Since the first Zelda games, he is slow and predictable. Thats assuming ofc they are teleports, they looked more like movemet speed and afterimages to me.
nah, not by LoZ standards.
I said would because its completly theoretical as he would be killed and re-spun as a peasant in the EG's wheel of fate in truth.
1. No it does not, not at all. Just because one of Zants teleporting moves looks different its automatically reality warping? I lold....Kains got several teleports that look different as well, perhaps Kains reality warping as well!
2. I thought this was the fanon you were going to bring up, Links not immune, never proven it.
3. No it doesnt, it just goes dark as Zant teleports.....
I can name blood shower, repel shield, bat form, mist form, strength, speed, teleportation (several types), slow time, lightning off and TK the , mind control, inferno top off my head, thats more than 3 since each had their own vid. Theres pages of LoK evidence, anything I say is supported by actual evidence, not as I said ambigious opiniontated scenes that dont really show anything.
The rest is proven in Dark chronicle if its not had a video simply because its based on older games that not allof which were recorded. Like spirit wrack.
Zant cannot harm Kain, both physically or mentally, he will however be a fair game for mind control so its all well and good!
Because he cant? sort of like how he couldnt have done that to Zelda and her soldiers and had to attack with Shadow beasts?
No its not, the Soul reaver has powers and feats that can list on for pages, the MS has extra effectivness against evil, I lold!
(oh, and it can act like a key in plot determined temples!)
fallible statements!
no it does not protest him as its a fallible statement and pretty useless as the power of these Gods (assuming it was not just a fallible statement) is just enough to expel "evil fog" with a sword 😆 your reaching, LoK has an actual continent smothering God with physical feats behind it unlike TP's.
Look at that! something with as much weight as a melon was tossed! zomg!!! this is probably the Masterswords only outside of normal sword feat I asssume consdiering you could not find something better? also this only proves that the MS can after a long charge (and possibly onyl while its in its plinth in that temple) can reform link from being transformed into a wolf, not that its a passive protection against further transformation.
Triforce of courage protects him against basic evil transformation, and not too well as he is still transformed....
No your right, he cant because the only thing that allowed twilight to enter (naturally because with it, there is no twilight) is the darkening of light spirits and the only thing the twilight effected was normal citizens...anyone with magical protection it seems was fine.
Their trying to use twilight as a no limit fallacy basically 😉
Stronger and faster vampires say otherwise, as do the Sarafan equiped with light and holy magic. Oh and I almost forgot a certain giant ocoptus who will kill the whole TP army with a few tentacle swings...oh and wait! Raziel opens his cowl and devours their souls...or the council of nine create a better than trueforce expanding field of reality warp that transforms TP into mindless beasts under their control.
No, one boy with a little imp and some basic tactics beat the predictable and physically featless robed wimp. A few arrows or any of the teleporters kill Zant from the start...thats this whole twilight no limit fallacy vanquished.
Who was turned mindless then?Ever met a shadow beast?
The guy needed Midna because on his own he just wasn't all that and that had a lot to do with why he couldn't completely shatter the twilight mirror.Lol? He was far more powerful than Midna, he needed her power to shatter the mirror because "only" the leader of the Twili can do that, and he wasn't really their leader.
Nowhere in the game were triforces soloing armies. Zant also had an army at his side when he subjugated hyrule's pathetic armyYou mean when he assaults the castle and the knights of Hyrule, when the soldiers are all already done with? Where did those Shadowbeasts come from, eh?
Zant can't just turn an opponent especially one with magic at his side over into a magical shadow beast. You don't even have any instances of him doing so in the game so please use a little common sense.Midna is more powerful than any vampire I've seen in LoK and he changed her into an imp with the wave of a hand. haermm He could change anyone he wanted from LoK.
Originally posted by quanchi112Midna destroyed him after Link beat him. Midna couldn't just destroy him and Ganondorf can rez him as well. His feat were easily wrecking Midna and Link while together like they were minor irritants.
Canonically he does not seem to be harmed by Link, only "beaten", the feats were still incredibly poor. And he was not "wrecking", anyone, why do you keep saying that, this does not prove he can survive a few arrows...