Originally posted by Tha C-Master
Spider-Man has blitzed a team of Bishop, Raidactive Man, Blizzard, and Mr. Fantastic, he's also out done the X-Men in speed. Spider-Man would have had to have been faster to do that.Spider-man holds back against Cap and other humans. How about we use his good feats instead of his bad. Like going against Carnage and dodging him even though he has no Spider Sense and he's MUCH faster than Wolverine and Elektra too. There is blitzing and moving so fast that nobody can see you.
You can't talk about understanding because you clearly lack it.
Gorgon is not stronger than Spider-Man and he doesn't have better feats in another league any physical area especially in feats, but I hate feat wars. So I'm not going into that.
Aahhhh... so you are bringing up the xmen fight? Why not bring up the fight where spiderman say this AFTER the xmen fight "he's faster than me BUT no one is faster than me" doubting himself... questioning his speed against wolvy. Now let's bring up their other encounter after their first fight. Hhhmmm... wolvy is on the roof scouting and spidey attacks him thinking that wolvy is a clone... spidey tries to blitz him, wolvy dodge the blitz. Spidey then tries to blitz wolvy again and punch him but wolverine grabs him during this blitz and kicks him in the stomach. Spidey tries to fight again which ends with wolvy claws to his throat and guess what, in that comic spidey yet again comments on wolvy speed.
They meet again, wolvy makes it simple and just blitz spiderman into a wall and put his claws to his throat.
Spiderman only has one good showing against logan and that is when he web logan all up but the sad thing is, even in that fight, logan wasn't even paying parker any attention and parker was fearing for his life. Is parker fast, suuuure, is he faster than logan, debatable, especially if we go by their showings against each other, like parker spider sense going off but he was still unable to prevent a blitz from wolvy which ended with wolvy stabbing him in the chest.
Originally posted by Dum Dum DuganThe hread is a real mess, dont think you'll be able to find a thing. He's one.
can I see these feats? if there a section of the respect thread that has it or something, feel free if it either to post the link to the page, rather then wasting your time posting scans.
Originally posted by carver9
Aahhhh... so you are bringing up the xmen fight? Why not bring up the fight where spiderman say this AFTER the xmen fight "he's faster than me BUT no one is faster than me" doubting himself... questioning his speed against wolvy. Now let's bring up their other encounter after their first fight. Hhhmmm... wolvy is on the roof scouting and spidey attacks him thinking that wolvy is a clone... spidey tries to blitz him, wolvy dodge the blitz. Spidey then tries to blitz wolvy again and punch him but wolverine grabs him during this blitz and kicks him in the stomach. Spidey tries to fight again which ends with wolvy claws to his throat and guess what, in that comic spidey yet again comments on wolvy speed.They meet again, wolvy makes it simple and just blitz spiderman into a wall and put his claws to his throat.
Spiderman only has one good showing against logan and that is when he web logan all up but the sad thing is, even in that fight, logan wasn't even paying parker any attention and parker was fearing for his life. Is parker fast, suuuure, is he faster than logan, debatable, especially if we go by their showings against each other, like parker spider sense going off but he was still unable to prevent a blitz from wolvy which ended with wolvy stabbing him in the chest.
Originally posted by SamZED
Ugh.. context, man? First of all, Wolverine has never. EVER. blitzed Spider-man and he never will or possibly could. The time when Logan "blitzed" Spider-man and put claws to his face you forgot to mention that they were teamed up. They werent fighting, or eving sparring. Wolverine simply grabbed Spider-man and poped his claws in the middle of conversation. You wanna count that as blitz you might as well count Spider-man kicking Logan out of window or webbing him up in an alley as a blitz. Again, context matters. The time Spider-man doubted his speed was because of his CIS, he also was affraid he might die for some reason. Doesnt change the fact that Logan didnt lay a finger on him throughout the entire battle until Spider-man allowed him to, even thought Spider-man commented that he's fighting "slow" because of the state of mind he was in. When they met on the rooftop, Spider-man thought he's fighting some clown dressed up as Wolverine. That changes a lot. Yeah Logan tagged him, great for him, but so did Ox and Fancy Dan, that's what happpens when his CIS kicks in, doesnt make Ox as fast as Spider-man. Again context matters. Wolverine is fast, but he's not Spider-man fast. And I can show you a dozen scans of him trying to gutt Spider-man and not succeeding. Spider-man cant blitz Wolverine, Logan is too good for that. But Spier-man srtill has a definite speed advantage over him.
All of this is your opinion, especially since we have scenes of Spiderman complimenting Wolverines speed TWICE whereas Wolverine has never said anything about Spidermans speed. You can say "Wolverine isnt a complimentive guy" but he complimented Gorgons speed throughout the arc. You could show me things that Spiderman has done with his speed that Wolvy might have not done but I could show you things with Wolvy speed that he has done that Spiderman have not done.
Their speed is debatable and arguing this is futile. You bring up the fact that Wolverine didnt lay a claw on Spidey during their first encounter, Wolverine wasnt trying to and he made that plain and clear when he jumped on top of Spiderman and instead of clawing him, he decides to to punch him. Then he also made it clear when Spidey was punching him in the face and he was smiling.
Didnt Spiderman recently struggle to even tag Daredevil (a controlled Daredevil but still the same to me)? You all overate his speed... sure he is fast but going by showings he doesnt have a speed gap over Cap, Elektra, punisher shot him, Daredevil has good showings against him, and the list goes on.
All of their speed feats are comparable and still fall short to someone like Gorgon.
All you're doing is lowballing Spider-Man while hyping up Wolverine characters. Just like you do with Superman. You don't want to use the Xmen fight but you want to pick the fight that you like where he *let* Wolverine jump on him? Wolverine can be hurt and has been hurt by people weaker than Spider-Man and he has been hurt by his punches. To say otherwise is almost too stupid to even argue.
Originally posted by Tha C-Master
All you're doing is lowballing Spider-Man while hyping up Wolverine characters. Just like you do with Superman. You don't want to use the Xmen fight but you want to pick the fight that you like where he *let* Wolverine jump on him? Wolverine can be hurt and has been hurt by people weaker than Spider-Man and he has been hurt by his punches. To say otherwise is almost too stupid to even argue.
Im not lowballing Spiderman... I'm giving FACTS. Tell me some high showings... ok, you bring up Spiderman blitzing Mr. Fantastic and his group. I can bring up Wolverine fighting 300 super humans and killing all of them without damage and the thing about it, he had just woke up from a coma. Or I can bring up him soloing the xmen, soloing the xforce, soling Alpha flight, taking on the fantastic four, etc, etc. You bring up Spidey fighting Thor... I bring up Wolverine also blitzing Thor and Thor even comments on how fast Wolverine is. You bring up Spiderman fighting the xmen (all the way back in the 80's), Wolverine has had so many upgrades after that, that its kind of pointless to even bring up BUT I didnt take the feat away from him, what I said was, right after that fight, they fought one on one and Spiderman questioned his speed against Wolvy.
What other feats are there to bring up? Both have comparable feats and its mainly due to their skill and speed. You are over hyping Spiderman so that you can have an argument to suggest that he is on Gorgon level when all in all, he isnt.
Carver? Where was I overhyping? I've said everything the character has done. You rank Spider-Man under just about any Wolverine related character just like you rank Superman under just about anybody. Typical.
Until you prove Gorgon being stronger this is a waste of time. I can't even believe you are arguing something so silly.
Originally posted by King CastleIt goes to all characters which is why I hate using featwars. To sit there and say that Spider-Man can't keep up with street levelers and then say he's weaker than Gorgon with no proof is simply retarded.
the same argument goes to spiderman as well...... if you wanna lowball, lowball both or find average ground or go by high end... or go by panel history fights between the two.also neither are in this fight
Spider-Man's own villians are faster than the aforementioned and they don't trigger his Spider-Sense, but he can't keep up with someone slower, come again?
Using crossover matches where they will inevitably "draw" is an exercise in futility because they are both popular characters hence why we use forums in the first place. Gorgon is not physically superior to the symbiotes or Spider-Man. The symbiotes can see in all directions. Until some proof otherwise come in that's worth two shits, then this is a waste of time.
Spider-man vs Mr. Fantastic is about an average showing, they aren't really at his speed anyways. Spider-Man has far higher far better feats.
Can someone post up Wolverine and Thor?
Originally posted by King CastleI don't think anybody except fanboy Wolverine supporters think that Wolverine is as fast as Spider-Man.
i fully agree with carver,,, and i dont think anyone aside from cmaster remotely thinks spidey is on the same lvl as gorgon in speed.. well no one on kmc,,.. you can find lots at cv...
I said they have comparable speed, which they do. Unless you choose to prove it. They both use their speed in different ways and Gorgon has no feats above him. Especially in strength.
Does anybody notice a trend here in any Wolverine, Sabretooth, Gorgon, Omega Red thread? The same people arguing for him over and over and over again. The same people that the forum laughs at.
I wouldn't worry about what carver thinks, he's still healing from his spanking in the Iron Man vs Akuma thread.
And don't get me started with you ... you say some of the worst things on the forum.
almost your entire argument has bn nothing but bashing rather then making points.. insulting ppl b/c they dont share the same spiderman view as you.. talking about how you dont wanna post here how you are tired of the ppl here.. if you dont like it here then dont post in the thread just to say that and just leave
i posted a pic in the 1st page that shows venom sym not having full visual by showing spidey standing behind it while its keeping watch,,,
you dont make assumptions of powers b/c how you think it should work you do it with panel evidence and history of it being shown working..
Originally posted by Tha C-Master
Carver? Where was I overhyping? I've said everything the character has done. You rank Spider-Man under just about any Wolverine related character just like you rank Superman under just about anybody. Typical.
Until you prove Gorgon being stronger this is a waste of time. I can't even believe you are arguing something so silly.It goes to all characters which is why I hate using featwars. To sit there and say that Spider-Man can't keep up with street levelers and then say he's weaker than Gorgon with no proof is simply retarded.
Spider-Man's own villians are faster than the aforementioned and they don't trigger his Spider-Sense, but he can't keep up with someone slower, come again?
Using crossover matches where they will inevitably "draw" is an exercise in futility because they are both popular characters hence why we use forums in the first place. Gorgon is not physically superior to the symbiotes or Spider-Man. The symbiotes can see in all directions. Until some proof otherwise come in that's worth two shits, then this is a waste of time.
Spider-man vs Mr. Fantastic is about an average showing, they aren't really at his speed anyways. Spider-Man has far higher far better feats.
Can someone post up Wolverine and Thor?
I don't think anybody except fanboy Wolverine supporters think that Wolverine is as fast as Spider-Man.
I said they have comparable speed, which they do. Unless you choose to prove it. They both use their speed in different ways and Gorgon has no feats above him. Especially in strength.
Does anybody notice a trend here in any Wolverine, Sabretooth, Gorgon, Omega Red thread? The same people arguing for him over and over and over again. The same people that the forum laughs at.
I wouldn't worry about what carver thinks, he's still healing from his spanking in the Iron Man vs Akuma thread.
I never said Gorgon was stronger, I said that he could POSSIBLY be stronger. Stop bringing up Superman, especially since I havent gave him a lost in a whiile against his peers. I dont know where you all are getting the fact that I hate the character when all in all, when he is pitted against people, I give him the win.
What I told you about Gorgons vs Spiderman strength is that Spiderman has punched at Wolverine TWICE to no avail... Wolverine tanked it and during on point, he laughed at Spidermans effort. What I also told you is that Gorgon and Wolverine was in the same predicument as Spidey and Wolvy and Wolverine face was busted up from punches from Gorgon and he was almost KOED whereas again, Spiderman punches did jack to him.
The only reason I am saying that you are over hyping the character is because you are saying that Spidey is on Gorgon level of speed when all in all, he isnt. Do you think Spidey could outright fight Elektra on a physical level without getting touched. Do you think Spiderman could blitz both Elektra AND Wolverine at the same time before they even get the chance to move a muscle? It aint happening.
Wolverine alone (without spiderman using his webbing) could pull a majority against Spiderman in a melee, and Spidey vs Elektra in a melee is debatable. Well, Gorgon took on the both of them and blitzed the hell out of them.
I'm about to make some threads... I will be back.
Originally posted by King CastleThat's an outright lie. I've made this argument several times before you even got here.
almost your entire argument has bn nothing but bashing rather then making points..i posted a pic in the 1st page that shows venom sym not having full visual by showing spidey standing behind it while its keeping watch,,,
you dont make assumptions of powers b/c how you think it should work you do it with panel evidence and history of it being shown working..
Gorgon is *not* physically superior to the symbiotes. And contrary to Carver he isn't even in another league from Spider-Man physically. I already said they had comparable speed. Carver is so thickheaded that he annoys me by dragging this into Wolverine vs Spider-Man.
The reason I say this is because the Symbiotes are on a higher level than Spider-Man. Gorgon is more or less comparable (except in strength) despite you making an attempted spite thread (which blew up in your face) symbiotes can see in more than one direction. They don't have "eyes".
Originally posted by carver9I already posted up Spider-Man blitzing people. He has a better history of it.
I never said Gorgon was stronger, I said that he could POSSIBLY be stronger. Stop bringing up Superman, especially since I havent gave him a lost in a whiile against his peers. I dont know where you all are getting the fact that I hate the character when all in all, when he is pitted against people, I give him the win.What I told you about Gorgons vs Spiderman strength is that Spiderman has punched at Wolverine TWICE to no avail... Wolverine tanked it and during on point, he laughed at Spidermans effort. What I also told you is that Gorgon and Wolverine was in the same predicument as Spidey and Wolvy and Wolverine face was busted up from punches from Gorgon and he was almost KOED whereas again, Spiderman punches did jack to him.
The only reason I am saying that you are over hyping the character is because you are saying that Spidey is on Gorgon level of speed when all in all, he isnt. Do you think Spidey could outright fight Elektra on a physical level without getting touched. Do you think Spiderman could blitz both Elektra AND Wolverine at the same time before they even get the chance to move a muscle? It aint happening.
Wolverine alone (without spiderman using his webbing) could pull a majority against Spiderman in a melee, and Spidey vs Elektra in a melee is debatable. Well, Gorgon took on the both of them and blitzed the hell out of them.
I'm about to make some threads... I will be back.
He is not stronger than Spider-Man.
Originally posted by Tha C-Master
That's an outright lie. I've made this argument several times before you even got here.Gorgon is *not* physically superior to the symbiotes. And contrary to Carver he isn't even in another league from Spider-Man physically. I already said they had comparable speed. Carver is so thickheaded that he annoys me by dragging this into Wolverine vs Spider-Man.
The reason I say this is because the Symbiotes are on a higher level than Spider-Man. Gorgon is more or less comparable (except in strength) despite you making an attempted spite thread (which blew up in your face) symbiotes can see in more than one direction. They don't have "eyes".
They are not comparable and the only reason that I brought Wolverine up is because he is the center piece of this argument involving Gorgon. Spiderman cant do to Wolverine what Gorgon has done to Wolverine. Spiderman cant be almost a Mile away and blitz Wolverine instantly like Gorgon did.
Im not trying to turn this into a Wolverine vs Spiderman thread but I'm trying to help you open your eyes. Spiderman is fast but there ARE people out there, even meta's, that are faster than him.
Originally posted by carver9None of that was an opinion, I was stating facts. Now saying that Wolverine wasnt trying to gutt Spider-man (when he clearly was) is an opinion. He made several clear attempts to stab him, he couldnt afford to hold back because his best friend's life was at stake, while Spider-man was a nobody to him at that point. He only retracted his claws after Spider-man allowed him to tag him. Logan isnt stupid, he knew Spider-man aint gonna kill him, so there was no longer need to gutt him, he already won the fight the second Spider-man stopped hitting him and backed off letting Logan up and wellcoming him to attack. That's why he retracted his claws. But Until that moment he clearly was attempting to gutt him, nothing suggests that he wasn't. We see him clearly try, he says he's gonna do it, and Spider-man comments that he's trying to. And yet he couldnt. And he was only smiling to freak Spider-man out because he had no other way of stopping him. And that worked. He didnt let him punch him, in fact he was about to throw the finishing blow "here it comes" when started slowing down saying "Mary Jane" but Logan didnt get the chance becasue Spider-man finally started fighting back using his spider sense to guide him.
All of this is your opinion, especially since we have scenes of Spiderman complimenting Wolverines speed TWICE whereas Wolverine has never said anything about Spidermans speed. You can say "Wolverine isnt a complimentive guy" but he complimented Gorgons speed throughout the arc. You could show me things that Spiderman has done with his speed that Wolvy might have not done but I could show you things with Wolvy speed that he has done that Spiderman have not done.Their speed is debatable and arguing this is futile. You bring up the fact that Wolverine didnt lay a claw on Spidey during their first encounter, Wolverine wasnt trying to and he made that plain and clear when he jumped on top of Spiderman and instead of clawing him, he decides to to punch him. Then he also made it clear when Spidey was punching him in the face and he was smiling.
Didnt Spiderman recently struggle to even tag Daredevil (a controlled Daredevil but still the same to me)? You all overate his speed... sure he is fast but going by showings he doesnt have a speed gap over Cap, Elektra, punisher shot him, Daredevil has good showings against him, and the list goes on.
All of their speed feats are comparable and still fall short to someone like Gorgon.
Complimenting speed, doesnt mean much. Ive never seen Deadpool compliment Wolverine's speed, yet ive seen him say "Holly sh!t! You're FAST!!!" about Spider-man. And keep in mind that Deadpool has matched every Wolverine's speed feat. It doesnt work that way.
I can post Spider-man feats that Logan hasnt matched, you cant post feats that Spider-man wont be able to match unless they involve something like cutting or stabbing, simply because Spider-man doesnt do that. And believe me you cant post any Wolverine speed that I havent see anlready. Again, someone like Deadpool's got speed feats that match some of Spider-man's. Yet you dont see me argue that he's as fast. And when he tried to stab Spider-man during their fight he couldnt do that just like Wolverine couldnt despite trying several time and on many occasions.
Daredevil was clearly upgraded, in their other confrontation with pissed off Spider-man Pete oneshotted Matt. As for Punisher shooting him you wanna bring up low showings of him not being able to dodge a bullet when he's godged thousands of them at the same time? Spider-man recently fought bloodlusted Shang Chi who had a speed and strength upgrade yet Spider-man was dodging him without much trouble while holding back. The list that goes on faids very fast when CIS is off. Same people who give him trouble, normally get oneshotted by pissed off Spider-man in a second. There's a speed gap between him and people like Elektra, Cap and others. That's why he can dodge someone like Logan or Deadpool even though he isnt nearly as skilled as they are. Becuase he has a speed advantage over them.
Gorgon is fast, but I dont see him being faster than Venom Brock who's blitzed Carnage, and did things like catch bullet after it was fired and even catch 3 bullets at the same time. I dont believe he's faster than Spider-man either. Much more experienced? Yes, definitely. Faster? No. The fact that Logan complimented him isnt enough to suggest that.
the syms like venom direct their physical perception to an area and they can make more eyes to see but they dont have 360 degree sight like Carnage does as a default power..
venom is not going to start off seeing all around him b/c he never has and he has bn snucked up on by ppl and this power would have bn great when hunting for ppl rather then directing toward one direction looking for someone who is behind him.
now Venom is faster then spidey but he is also a brute and violent which negates a lot of his speed barely putting him above spidey at times if not equaling him when playin cat and mouse games.
now i dont appreciate you callin my thread a spite thread since that is not why i made it..
now Venom if he has eyes all over the place how will that help him when fighting Gorgon and he uses his stone stare?
it would be a handicap for the sym rather then an advantage.
Originally posted by Tha C-Master
I already posted up Spider-Man blitzing people. He has a better history of it.He is not stronger than Spider-Man.
LOL... I never said that Spiderman couldnt blitz people but he isnt blitzing Elektra OR Wolverine. Sure, he can blitz Mr. Fantastic, SURE, he can blitz cage but he failed to blitz Wolvy, he FAILED to blitz cap (and got owned) and he has failed to blitz Elektra.
Do you want to know why he cant blitz them? Their speeds are comparable. Do you want to know why Gorgon blitz Elektra to the point where she couldnt even touch him and she had a gun and a sword... because Gorgon is faster. Do you want to know why Gorgon blitzed Wolverine TWICE, because Gorgon is faster. Do you want to know why an INJURED Gorgon blitzed both Elektra and Wolverine before they even got the chance to land another attack, because Gorgon is faster.
Spiderman cant do that, no matter how much you like the character, he cant do it. Spiderman isnt blitzing both Elektra and Wolverine at the same time OR defeating them in a melee fight. I love Wolvy but I do not think that Wolvy would blitz both spiderman and Elektra in a melee fight either... thats something that speedsters does and that is what Gorgon is, a true speedster.