Darth Maul vs. Darth Vader

Originally posted by truejedi
You are failing to acknowledge the substantial gap between QGJ and ROTS Kenobi... Until you acknowledge that (right now you are considering them near equal) anything we say will be denied by you, so I ask you this:

What did QGJ ever do in combat that was impressive?

ROTS Kenobi killed Grievous, and Defeated "the chosen one" Anakin Skywalker. (as well as 4 magnaguards)

What fight did QGJ ever win?

Originally posted by RE: Blaxican
"replicate surviving".

lol. Quan.

Originally posted by quanchi112
That's what makes it more fun.

Originally posted by quanchi112
I am not implying all masters are equal I am saying the master Maul faced he crushed. That's impressive considering it was a handicapped fight to begin with.

No, I don't see qui Gonn winning but then again he's nothing to Maul either.

No, I am not and never once did I say Maul would beat Yoda I stated he could replicate surviving.

No, it's you showing blind favoritism not me. You speculate the entire team ignore the fact Vader was beaten twice and soundly at that. Vader only beat Dooku's 'ass after he fought him for the second time.

Obi was beaten rather quickly so no I don't see him doing well at all in the fight. His anger cost him the fight and the same would happen to Vader.

Anakin was dominated by Dooku as a padawan and he was lucky to have survived just like he was lucky to have survived against Obi. Someone always saves the emo.

Sidious had everything to lose and only had to survive Yoda had to kill him. Fleeing was smart.

Yeah you are when you ignore who was fighting who in these comparisons. Well yes, Maul was impressive; comparing it to the fight of Vader Vs Obi, it's not impressive at all. See.

Qui Gon did alright against Maul, wasn't a stomp. But ok.

Now you're switching the argument. This is concerning Yoda Vs Sidious. But now you're claiming that Maul is on par with Sidious, if he's to survive a duel with Yoda. Laughable.

A "no you" retort, brilliant. Anakin was beaten once by a Master when he was a Padawan, though he did fare well, something you ignore. Vader was beaten by Obi Won, who is far above Qui Gon and his Padawan self, though he arguably lost to rage/pride. See what I mean about your comparison of Masters being equal.

You also ignore that Maul ultimately lost to pride as well, while insisting that Vader's rage/pride will be a handicap here. See, blind favortism with a heafy helping of zero-objectivity. Obi lost to Maul cos he was a Padawan at the time, simple as that.

Anakin lost as a Padawan, he fared well oveerall, considering he was just a Padawan. Ignoring that he was jsut a Padawan in his first Dooku encounter won't make it change.

If Sidious could have killed Yoda, he would have, it's simple as that. He fled (second attempt at that) because he knew Yoda was superior, as Yoda had just shown him in three clashes.

Edit.

Originally posted by Robtard
Yeah you are when you ignore who was fighting who in these comparisons. Well yes, Maul was impressive; comparing it to the fight of Vader Vs Obi, it's not impressive at all. See.

Qui Gon did alright against Maul, wasn't a stomp. But ok.

Now you're switching the argument. This is concerning Yoda Vs Sidious. But now you're claiming that Maul is on par with Sidious, if he's to survive a duel with Yoda. Laughable.

A "no you" retort, brilliant. Anakin was beaten once by a Master when he was a Padawan, though he did fare well, something you ignore. Vader was beaten by Obi Won, who is far above Qui Gon and his Padawan self, though he arguably lost to rage/pride, something else you ignore. See what I mean about your comparison of Masters being equal. You also ignore that Maul ultimately lost to pride as well, while insisting that Vader's rage/pride will be a handicap here. See, blind favortism.

Obi lost to Maul cos he was a Padawan.

Anakin lost as a Padawan, he fared well oveerall, considering he was just a Padawan.

If Sidious could have killed Yoda, he would have, it's simple as that. He fled (second attempt at that) because he knew Yoda was superior, as Yoda had just shown him in three clashes.

I am saying Maul would beat Dooku nowhere did I state he can stalemate either sidious or yoda.

Vader was beaten by someone who told him not perform the move which got him defeated. He is beyond moronic and emotional to be able to take on someone as cold and smooth as Maul.

No proof Obi as a master could beat Maul. None. We saw him utterly trounced by Dooku yet he beat and held his own against Vader. Hmmmm.

Sidious was trying but continuing the fight when he could die simply wasn't worth the risk so biding his time was a win for him and a loss for Yoda.

Originally posted by quanchi112
Maul stomped him. Soon as he was separated from his partner he died very quickly.

I am saying Maul would beat Dooku nowhere did I state he can stalemate either sidious or yoda.

Vader was beaten by someone who told him not perform the move which got him defeated. He is beyond moronic and emotional to be able to take on someone as cold and smooth as Maul.

No proof Obi as a master could beat Maul. None. We saw him utterly trounced by Dooku yet he beat and held his own against Vader. Hmmmm.

Sidious was trying but continuing the fight when he could die simply wasn't worth the risk so biding his time was a win for him and a loss for Yoda.

Watch the fight again, it was a careful exchange of blows and Maul proved to be the better, it wasn't a stomp with Qui Gon doing jack and shit. Qui Gon seemed to have a stamina issue though; that's not an insult to his skills.

There's nothing in the films to suggest Maul would beat Dooku, so it seems like Maul fanboysim is what you base your ideas from. Page6, you said Maul could "stalemate" Dooku in the same fashion Dooku did to Yoda. Though it has been shown to you, Dooku ran, cos he lost. So you're contradicting yourself again.

So you're dictating the outcome of this fight on CIS/PIS? Fair enough, but why do you then ignore that the "cold and smooth" Maul lost in a moronic fashion as well and to a padawan no less? (Hint:Blind favoritism and zero-objectivity)

Except of course the fact that when Obi lost to Dooku it was EP2, but in Ep3 Anakin had grown in power enough to defeat Dooku ("I've doubled in strength" he said, or something like that), Are you suggesting Obi Wan hadn't grown more powerful as well, that he just stagnated? Laughable.

Watch the damn film again. Sidious was on the losing end; why he fled. He wanted Yoda dead, he wouldn't have hesitated to slaughter him, had he been capable. Yoda falling is what saved his wrinkled ass. Blaxican's opinion seems to be correct, you don't know Star Wars stuff very well. I suggest you watch all the films multiple times.

Edit: Simplest way to compare, watch both fight clips side-by-side. Vader and Obi simply do more and better than Maul, Qui Gon or Padawan Obi.

Originally posted by quanchi112
Maul stomped him. Soon as he was separated from his partner he died very quickly.

I am saying Maul would beat Dooku nowhere did I state he can stalemate either sidious or yoda.

Vader was beaten by someone who told him not perform the move which got him defeated. He is beyond moronic and emotional to be able to take on someone as cold and smooth as Maul.

No proof Obi as a master could beat Maul. None. We saw him utterly trounced by Dooku yet he beat and held his own against Vader. Hmmmm.

Sidious was trying but continuing the fight when he could die simply wasn't worth the risk so biding his time was a win for him and a loss for Yoda.

Maul stomped nobody... Why do you keep saying that, when he clearly did NOT stomp anyone. A roflstomp was when Anakin stomped Dooku in the ROTS. And You're saying he can beat Dooku which in abc logic follows you up by saying he could stalemate Yoda, since Dooku didn't die to Yoda in Episode II, Although it was clearly obvious YOda ws ****ing with Dooku the whole time. Cold and Smooth as Maul? Lol... alright. If Maul was so smooth he wouldn't of died to Obi Wan when he was a low ranking Jedi. IDK why you keep failing to acknowledge Mauls failure in knowledge of the force. Next you're going to say that Maul can absorb force lightning and shoot it back at people.

Originally posted by quanchi112
Fighting maul and being a master in general who tutored obi. I think it's obvious he wasn't a schlub.

Let's see: Your reasoning here is poor:

Fighting Maul means nothing. Anyone could fight maul. I could fight maul, it means nothing.

Being a master in general means nothing. That was a COUNCIL memberJEdi Master in AOTC getting shot with 3 shots by Boba Fett. He was lousy. A Jedi Master, and lousy. So QGJ being a master does not prove he was good at combat.

As far as tutoring Obi? Seriously? how is that pertinent at all?

You need to supply something that QGJ has achieved in combat: I know a LOT about star wars, and I have nothing for you. I remember this pair running from a pair of droids in TPM.

You are completely missing out on how much Kenobi improved between TPM and ROTS. He fought a war for 14 years. He went from a novice at Ataru to a master (the master) of Soresu.

There is no comparison.

Darth Maul was like a big budget Hollywood movie. Looks good, nice effects, but has a plot that goes nowhere.

Originally posted by Robtard
Watch the fight again, it was a careful exchange of blows and Maul proved to be the better, it wasn't a stomp with Qui Gon doing jack and shit. Qui Gon seemed to have a stamina issue though; that's not an insult to his skills.

There's nothing in the films to suggest Maul would beat Dooku, so it seems like Maul fanboysim is what you base your ideas from. [b]Page6, you said Maul could "stalemate" Dooku in the same fashion Dooku did to Yoda. Though it has been shown to you, Dooku ran, cos he lost. So you're contradicting yourself again.

So you're dictating the outcome of this fight on CIS/PIS? Fair enough, but why do you then ignore that the "cold and smooth" Maul lost in a moronic fashion as well and to a padawan no less? (Hint:Blind favoritism and zero-objectivity)

Except of course the fact that when Obi lost to Dooku it was EP2, but in Ep3 Anakin had grown in power enough to defeat Dooku ("I've doubled in strength" he said, or something like that), Are you suggesting Obi Wan hadn't grown more powerful as well, that he just stagnated? Laughable.

Watch the damn film again. Sidious was on the losing end; why he fled. He wanted Yoda dead, he wouldn't have hesitated to slaughter him, had he been capable. Yoda falling is what saved his wrinkled ass. Blaxican's opinion seems to be correct, you don't know Star Wars stuff very well. I suggest you watch all the films multiple times.

Edit: Simplest way to compare, watch both fight clips side-by-side. Vader and Obi simply do more and better than Maul, Qui Gon or Padawan Obi. [/B]

No, I am not contradicting myself at all you are just not understanding what I mean which falls on you. The point is if Maul's goal was to survive as long as Dooku did before leaving the fight he could have. Dooku can't beat Yoda either so again my point makes total sense.

Maul was arrogant and was taunting. I doubt this situation would present itself again. There was also another lightsaber in the room which he won't have in a forum fight if he gets disarmed.

Obi wasn't a good matchup to Dooku he just had his number. While Dooku smashed obi obi was still a better matchup against vader than dooku was. It's how these characters matched up.

I never said he was capable of beating yoda I stated sidious didn't have to kill him. Yoda's mission was to kill him sidious' was to survive. Yoda failed.

I could care less what your opinion of me is I am correct and have backed up my case quite well.

I've seen vaderism before rear it's ugly head in the face of logic and reason.

Originally posted by Kaibs
Maul stomped nobody... Why do you keep saying that, when he clearly did NOT stomp anyone. A roflstomp was when Anakin stomped Dooku in the ROTS. And You're saying he can beat Dooku which in abc logic follows you up by saying he could stalemate Yoda, since Dooku didn't die to Yoda in Episode II, Although it was clearly obvious YOda ws ****ing with Dooku the whole time. Cold and Smooth as Maul? Lol... alright. If Maul was so smooth he wouldn't of died to Obi Wan when he was a low ranking Jedi. IDK why you keep failing to acknowledge Mauls failure in knowledge of the force. Next you're going to say that Maul can absorb force lightning and shoot it back at people.

No, Anakin thoroughly beat him in rots but dooku stomped him as a padawan.

I am saying Maul could do the same exact thing Dooku did and stalemate him for a time and then flee. I never meant like a true stalemate. Wow.

Yoda doesn't screw around he wanted to defeat him he doesn't show off he does what needs done. he's not some arrogant fool. You don't even grasp Yoda's character. 😂

Originally posted by quanchi112
Wrong. Maul beat him in moments. Rewatch the fight at no point in time did he ever have an advantage on Maul. This is sheer stompage.

No, I am not contradicting myself at all you are just not understanding what I mean which falls on you. The point is if Maul's goal was to survive as long as Dooku did before leaving the fight he could have. Dooku can't beat Yoda either so again my point makes total sense.

Maul was arrogant and was taunting. I doubt this situation would present itself again. There was also another lightsaber in the room which he won't have in a forum fight if he gets disarmed.

Obi wasn't a good matchup to Dooku he just had his number. While Dooku smashed obi obi was still a better matchup against vader than dooku was. It's how these characters matched up.

I never said he was capable of beating yoda I stated sidious didn't have to kill him. Yoda's mission was to kill him sidious' was to survive. Yoda failed.

I could care less what your opinion of me is I am correct and have backed up my case quite well.

I've seen vaderism before rear it's ugly head in the face of logic and reason.

Originally posted by quanchi112
I dunno. I think he [talking about Maul] can more than stalemate him [talking about Yoda] in the same manner Dooku did in the time allotted for their onscreen fight.

Originally posted by quanchi112
I am saying Maul would beat Dooku nowhere did I state he can stalemate either sidious or yoda.

Anyhow, one just need watch Maul's fight and Vader's fight with Obi-Wan to see Vader's faster and more agile; even employs kicks multiple times. Actaully a solid fight and a good scene, if you pay attention, enjoy: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pSwy412nttI

Originally posted by truejedi
Not obvious at all. It can be if you supply proof.

Let's see: Your reasoning here is poor:

Fighting Maul means nothing. Anyone could fight maul. I could fight maul, it means nothing.

Being a master in general means nothing. That was a COUNCIL memberJEdi Master in AOTC getting shot with 3 shots by Boba Fett. He was lousy. A Jedi Master, and lousy. So QGJ being a master does not prove he was good at combat.

As far as tutoring Obi? Seriously? how is that pertinent at all?

You need to supply something that QGJ has achieved in combat: I know a LOT about star wars, and I have nothing for you. I remember this pair running from a pair of droids in TPM.

You are completely missing out on how much Kenobi improved between TPM and ROTS. He fought a war for 14 years. He went from a novice at Ataru to a master (the master) of Soresu.

There is no comparison.

Fighting Maul a competent sith as long as he did shows a lot of skill. It's pretty obvious Maul was portrayed as a badass in the film.

See the above sentence.

I see nothing on screen to show me he could defeat Maul with the improvements he made.

I mean getting tossed around by Dooku twice shows me what ?

Him beating vader shows me two things. vader's an idiot an dlost to someone he should by all accounts beat.
Vader's emotions cost him the match.

Same thing happens here it happened to obi against maul. Maul doesn't lose his cool vader always was presuit.

Lightsabers only goes to maul.

All out goes to Vader.

Originally posted by Werewolf582
Lightsabers only goes to maul.

All out goes to Vader.

Originally posted by quanchi112
Maul stomped qui gonn and easily bested Obi.

No, Anakin thoroughly beat him in rots but dooku stomped him as a padawan.

I am saying Maul could do the same exact thing Dooku did and stalemate him for a time and then flee. I never meant like a true stalemate. Wow.

Yoda doesn't screw around he wanted to defeat him he doesn't show off he does what needs done. he's not some arrogant fool. You don't even grasp Yoda's character. 😂

Once Jinn was isolated, Maul was able to fight more aggressively.

As for him besting Obi in a saber battle, never happened. Obi Wan was all up in Maul's grill, backing him towards the laser gates, forcing Maul to go to force powers.

Rant complete.

Originally posted by RJ 2.0
Maul beat Jinn by wearing him down. Jinn was the better swordsman, but Maul knew what he was doing in the Naboo saber battle. As he fought them, he was always retreating, always towards the room blocked off by the laser gates. Maul knew that if he stood his ground and faced them together without retreating, odds are he would have lost, so he separated the master from the apprentice, wore the master down, killed him, then faced the apprentice alone.

Once Jinn was isolated, Maul was able to fight more aggressively.

As for him besting Obi in a saber battle, never happened. Obi Wan was all up in Maul's grill, backing him towards the laser gates, forcing Maul to go to force powers.

Rant complete.

Who wouldn't try to fight someone one on one as opposed to two on one. ?

😂

He used tactics to separate them and defeated them both via skill

Force powers and sabers to hand in hand. Force powers were also used by Palpatine who was disarmed against Yoda but he still managed to get the better of him.

Maul won by disarming his opponent who went into a rage ala Rob style.

Originally posted by quanchi112
Qui gon had the benefit of fighting maul two on one and you say maul wore him down. 😂

Who wouldn't try to fight someone one on one as opposed to two on one. ?

😂

He used tactics to separate them and defeated them both via skill

Force powers and sabers to hand in hand. Force powers were also used by Palpatine who was disarmed against Yoda but he still managed to get the better of him.

Maul won by disarming his opponent who went into a rage ala Rob style.

You watch TPM at all? You seriously didn't see that Jinn was tired out right before Maul killed him?

This was necroed?

And Vader stomps. It'd be like asking who'd win between Vegeta and Raditz, or Angron and Ultramarine, or Raizen and Sazaku or, whatever

Originally posted by RJ 2.0
You watch TPM at all? You seriously didn't see that Jinn was tired out right before Maul killed him?

Well Qui-Gon was like, 3 times Mauls age.