Bronze Tiger vs Steve Rogers: H2H Only

Originally posted by Marvelknight
So is this what you come to say to me? Now, Now Space M, If you want I can take it to the stars.

First, why don't you prove to me why it's a "BIG DEAL" for someone like Bronze Tiger? Okay? Because I don't think you or anyone understand that BRONZE TIGER, is a VERY, VERY high tier martial artist in his universe. What are you trying to say? Again with this Bull****, underestimating Bronze Tiger, like you don't know who the **** he is. Look anywhere online, and you will see the same thing. Bronze Tiger is nasty in martial arts. Basically, Bronze Tiger and Richard Dragon are the Ryu and Ken of DC Comics.

And I'll tell you right now that Steve's stats won't be a BIG DEAL for Lady Shiva, Batman, Wild Cat, Oh yeah, Bronze Tiger, or Richard Dragon and others in DC who I don't need to mention.

You talk about Daredevil, black panther, and shang chi... But.... They're not Bronze Tiger. We're talking about someone Steve has never fought before.

Your argument is fallacious. Nobody here thinks that Bronze Tiger isn't a top tier martial artist, everyone knows he is one of the top three martial artists in DC. That isn't a point of contention so don't pretend that it is. However what we also know is that Captain America is established as being more skilled than several characters who are the very least Bronze Tiger's equal, and on top of that has superhuman attributes and unlimited stamina. No reasonable person thinks this is a contest, your argument of "But OMG didn't you know Bronze Tiger is skilled!11!!!!" doesn't change anything, we know he is skilled, but we know Cap is more skilled AND better in every other way.

If Bronze Tiger and Dragon are Ryu and Ken, then Captain America is Akuma.

Originally posted by srankmissingnin
Your argument is fallacious. Nobody here thinks that Bronze Tiger isn't a top tier martial artist, everyone knows he is one of the top three martial artists in DC. That isn't a point of contention so don't pretend that it is. However what we also know is that Captain America is established as being more skilled than several characters who are the very least Bronze Tiger's equal, and on top of that has superhuman attributes and unlimited stamina. No reasonable person thinks this is a contest, your argument of "But OMG didn't you know Bronze Tiger is skilled!11!!!!" doesn't change anything, we know he is skilled, but we know Cap is more skilled AND better in every other way.

If Bronze Tiger and Dragon are Ryu and Ken, then Captain America is Akuma.

exactly what I was trying to say, and succinctly put as well. 😄

Originally posted by Marvelknight
No and that's one of the problems here in the debate. Catseye doesn't need a list a of feats no more than Bronze Tiger need them to be established as who and what he is.

"Characters don't need feats to be established"...........

🤨

Yeah, not even going to respond to that nonsense in detail.
Yes they do.

Originally posted by Marvelknight
People keep crying Steve's better stats this better stats

Originally posted by Marvelknight
that and it's not as big of a factor as many would think. Not at all.

Point conceded.

Originally posted by Marvelknight
And if everyone is going on the idea that Tiger will tire out and Steve will win. Well if that's the only reason then it's certainly not enough to go on the idea that Steve is the better fighter at all.

I don't think ANYONE tried to argue that Steve's a better fighter BECAUSE he has better stats...

Though, I suppose you could.

I CERTAINLY haven't seen anyone pose that Steve has better fighting ability/skill (not the same as being a better fighter) because he has better stats.

But IF Bronze Tiger starts to go ANY amount of distance with Steve, then yes, his lack of superhuman stats is going to hurt him.

Originally posted by Marvelknight
All Bronze Tiger has to do is fight with his head and get enough points at the end of each round. UFC rules are in effect or did everyone here just looked over that fact?

Did you? Because as someone else stated, in any grappling scenario Steve will overpower BT. 😕

In any case, BT isn't going to win based on striking points. He'd have to keep up with steve to do that, he can't, AND every break between rounds works in Steve's favor as BT's lactic acids will have more time to build up. His body will more readily start eating his energy too.

BT isn't getting the takedown advantage, or holding Steve down if he DID pull of that little miracle, Steve is stronger than him.

BT isn't likely to sub Rogers because Rogers is just as skilled/more skilled AND he likely can power out of any submission holds BT attempts.

Alteratively good American Wrestling tends to dominate in UFC fights and I'd take Rogers as a better wrestler than BT.

Originally posted by srankmissingnin
Your argument is fallacious. Nobody here thinks that Bronze Tiger isn't a top tier martial artist, everyone knows he is one of the top three martial artists in DC. That isn't a point of contention so don't pretend that it is. However what we also know is that Captain America is established as being more skilled than several characters who are the very least Bronze Tiger's equal, and on top of that has superhuman attributes and unlimited stamina. No reasonable person thinks this is a contest, your argument of "But OMG didn't you know Bronze Tiger is skilled!11!!!!" doesn't change anything, we know he is skilled, but we know Cap is more skilled AND better in every other way.

If Bronze Tiger and Dragon are Ryu and Ken, then Captain America is Akuma.

Originally posted by King Castle
if we were to use Wolvie, sabe and Romulus who would be who and or if we use daken, Romulus and x-23?

eh...the street fighter comparison sort of starts to break down here. I'm not sure it's appropriate.

Originally posted by Space M ummy
eh...the street fighter comparison sort of starts to break down here. I'm not sure it's appropriate.

i just wanted to be funny b/c no one wants to be romulus or use him as the peak standard for any character

Originally posted by jinzin

Originally posted by jinzin
Also

ok. from my point of view, the fact that slade could fight at all was a minor miracle, and he still held his own. i don't see anything in those scans that proves tiger would beat him in a fair fight.

Originally posted by Marvelknight
And I didn't ask you that question... So I will rephrase.

What is the reason you brought it up in the first place?

someone else did. i was just commenting on it.

Originally posted by Space M ummy
What I'm saying, and what you don't appear to be understanding, is that when given two opponents of equal skill, the one with the better stats has the advantage. Since the SSS guarantees that Steve is going to be better than BT Physically, BT needs to have a substantial advantage in MA to overcome it.

Go back and read through EVERYTHING I posted. Nowhere did I "underestimate" Bronze Tiger, what I *DID* do was play up Steve's victories against the top tiers in 616. Underrate Shang Chi, Iron Fist, Daredevil, Black Panther, Wolverine, Batroc, etc if you want to, but the fact is that since Steve can and has easily beaten ALL of marvel's top tier, you'd need to make the claim that BT is significantly better than all of them. Good luck with this, because it's not happening.

And wouldn't Steve be someone Bronze Tiger has never met before? Genius logic there. But speaking in terms of MA, there are only so many styles in existence, and rogers has fought against literally every skilled combantant there is to fight in the MU. Bronze tiger isn't going to whip out a style he's never seen before, and in fact Rogers has strong showings and victories against opponents with completely unique styles as well.

Bottom line, rogers still has an advantage.

Genius logic? I'm not the one giving a list of who Bronze Tiger has beaten. You did that with the idea that all of those characters are better then Bronze Tiger. So don't come and act like I can't see what you're doing. What I said goes both ways. You can't show me up, and it's funny how you named all the people Steve beat. But who has beaten Steve? If anyone is willing to even say. Because I can't say who has ever truly beaten Bronze Tiger in DC.

And you think that the fighter with the better stats, automatically gives them the win? Yeah genius logic, right? Any martial artist will tell you that it's not always about how strong you are or how fast you are. And it's not always about how much you know...

It's comes down to who is the better "FIGHTER". Because if this was a Steve vs Ryu thread. None of this talk would ever surface, you can believe that.

Originally posted by Marvelknight
Genius logic? I'm not the one giving a list of who Bronze Tiger has beaten. You did that with the idea that all of those characters are better then Bronze Tiger.

Man, you are something else. I'm not sure whether you're really this dense, or trolling.

The point of listing who Rogers has beaten is to illustrate that his knowledge of MA is extremely broad. All of those listed are not only masters of multiple styles, but widely considered the best there is in H2H combat in 616.

Since it appears I need to spell out everything, the point is this- If Steve has decisive victories over the best martial artists in the world across dozens of styles some of which are unique, then that says that steve is well versed in many, many fighting styles. At MINIMUM, speaking ONLY of skill, he's on Bronze Tiger's level. Some have argued that strictly in terms of skill, he's better, but I didn't go there. When you consider that high level of skill PLUS his physical superiority, it's open and shut.

So don't come and act like I can't see what you're doing. What I said goes both ways. You can't show me up, and it's funny how you named all the people Steve beat. But who has beaten Steve? If anyone is willing to even say. Because I can't say who has ever truly beaten Bronze Tiger in DC.

Personally I think i'm doing a pretty good job of grinding your argument to dust, but that's just me. You'll also notice if you read my posts that I specifically called out Taskmaster as being the one pure MA that's flat out better than Rogers is. So not only am I WILLING to say, I did so some time ago.

And you think that the fighter with the better stats, automatically gives them the win? Yeah genius logic, right? Any martial artist will tell you that it's not always about how strong you are or how fast you are. And it's not always about how much you know...

So if it's not about how strong you are (rogers is stronger), how fast you are (rogers is faster), how experienced you are (rogers has the edge here also), or how much you know (rogers has a far greater record against skilled opponents) then what is it chief? Luck?

It's comes down to who is the better "FIGHTER". Because if this was a Steve vs Ryu thread. None of this talk would ever surface, you can believe that.

and considering all of the above, it's not hard to conclude that Rogers has the advantage in a fight. I'm not sure what you're trying to accomplish bringing up Ryu from street fighter though.

Originally posted by srankmissingnin
Your argument is fallacious. Nobody here thinks that Bronze Tiger isn't a top tier martial artist, everyone knows he is one of the top three martial artists in DC. That isn't a point of contention so don't pretend that it is. However what we also know is that Captain America is established as being more skilled than several characters who are the very least Bronze Tiger's equal, and on top of that has superhuman attributes and unlimited stamina. No reasonable person thinks this is a contest, your argument of "But OMG didn't you know Bronze Tiger is skilled!11!!!!" doesn't change anything, we know he is skilled, but we know Cap is more skilled AND better in every other way.

If Bronze Tiger and Dragon are Ryu and Ken, then Captain America is Akuma.

Which top tier MA has Cap beaten in MU in hth?

captain america was stalemeted by daredevil and taken out by black panther he is not that big of a deal people are trying to make him super human while freakin crossbones sometimes give him trouble , i say its a split 5/10 and i am talking from a non biased opinion

Originally posted by Prep-Man
Which top tier MA has Cap beaten in MU in hth?

And I also want to know who has beaten Steve. Somebody tell me please...

Originally posted by Space M ummy
Man, you are something else. I'm not sure whether you're really this dense, or trolling.

The point of listing who Rogers has beaten is to illustrate that his knowledge of MA is extremely broad. All of those listed are not only masters of multiple styles, but widely considered the best there is in H2H combat in 616.

Since it appears I need to spell out everything, the point is this- If Steve has decisive victories over the best martial artists in the world across dozens of styles some of which are unique, then that says that steve is well versed in many, many fighting styles. At MINIMUM, speaking ONLY of skill, he's on Bronze Tiger's level. Some have argued that strictly in terms of skill, he's better, but I didn't go there. When you consider that high level of skill PLUS his physical superiority, it's open and shut.

Personally I think i'm doing a pretty good job of grinding your argument to dust, but that's just me. You'll also notice if you read my posts that I specifically called out Taskmaster as being the one pure MA that's flat out better than Rogers is. So not only am I WILLING to say, I did so some time ago.

So if it's not about how strong you are (rogers is stronger), how fast you are (rogers is faster), how experienced you are (rogers has the edge here also), or how much you know (rogers has a far greater record against skilled opponents) then what is it chief? Luck?

and considering all of the above, it's not hard to conclude that Rogers has the advantage in a fight. I'm not sure what you're trying to accomplish bringing up Ryu from street fighter though.

Sure, nice job smashing my argument to dust. All I hear is Steve is more Skilled. Prove it. Prove that Bronze Tiger can't beat him. Show me who has beaten Bronze Tiger. I'll be waiting.

Srankmissingnin, please tell how the hell do know that Steve's skill is better than Bronze Tiger? You can't, it's your opinion. Funny that Marvel thinks Steve's skill falls at 6. Not 7. And MARVEL COMIC > anyone's opinion on KMC, Hero Chat, Comic Vine etc... So don't give me no bull**** about it's only the comics we look at. Because If Steve is really superhuman, Marvel would state that. Steve is at the very peak level physically, with no built up of fatigue toxins, with slightly accelerated healing. Marvel doesn't consider him to be a Superhuman, he's enhanced at best.

And there are many here on KMC, myself included who feel that Batman skills are better than Steve. So no way in hell is Steve a better fighter than Bronze Tiger.

Jinzin when you first read up on a new character. It's pretty much established who he is and what he has done. Feats later on validate what has been said or shown in the back stories featured in later issues. When I say established, I mean with the company (Marvel Comics, DC Comics, Image Comics ets). So please come again.

who on here thinks that?

aside from that it's not how we feel about a character as a reason why he wins but by evidence of his abilities, skills physical attributes.

the whole BT wins proof me wrong is fallacious there are dozen of characters who skills are referenced with no evidence let alone with losing b/c he only has a few appearances with legitimate fighters.

saying BT wins b/c he has never fought anyone of real worth hence hasnt lost and his few fights are all questionable is a faulty premise.

Originally posted by Marvelknight
Jinzin when you first read up on a new character. It's pretty much established who he is and what he has done. Feats later on validate what has been said or shown in the back stories featured in later issues. When I say established, I mean with the company (Marvel Comics, DC Comics, Image Comics ets). So please come again.

Exactly... "Feats validate" established characters... 😐

I don't know where you think you're going with this. 😕

I could bring up a hundred badguys that Cap has taken down in his own book that never did anything of merit what the hell would that be proof of? 🤨

Originally posted by stay_hood captain america was stalemeted by daredevil and taken out by black panther he is not that big of a deal people are trying to make him super human while freakin crossbones sometimes give him trouble , i say its a split 5/10 and i am talking from a non biased opinion

i guess crossbones would be akuma plus. 😂

Originally posted by jinzin
Exactly... "Feats validate" established characters... 😐

I don't know where you think you're going with this. 😕

I could bring up a hundred badguys that Cap has taken down in his own book that never did anything of merit what the hell would that be proof of? 🤨

Originally posted by Prep-Man
i guess crossbones would be akuma plus. 😂

Shin Akuma... newb 😛

Originally posted by King Castle
that they are Peak slight superhuman above slade and batman, shiva, cass and ask ppl to proof you wrong by providing nonexistent evidence that would make your opinion moot

Dayum! Now THAT'S debate! 😱

Originally posted by stay_hood
captain america was stalemeted by daredevil and taken out by black panther he is not that big of a deal people are trying to make him super human while freakin crossbones sometimes give him trouble , i say its a split 5/10 and i am talking from a non biased opinion

I fully agree with you. This is crazy to think Ben can't win here at all. They talk like he's the god of fighting lol. He would get his ass derailed if he was in Tekken, Street Fighter, or SNK😂

Originally posted by Marvelknight
I fully agree with you. This is crazy to think Ben can't win here at all. They talk like he's the god of fighting lol. He would get his ass derailed if he was in Tekken, Street Fighter, or SNK😂

aside from that it would come down to the controller and not actual comic history.

give me Cap from marvel vs capcom and we'll see. 😆