Marvel speed vs DC speed

Originally posted by CosmicComet
Speed not being a big deal *is* due to PIS.

If Wolverine can tag Thor multiple times, there is no reason that Thor should even be able to perceive Quicksilver AT ALL. Whichever side of the fence you are on this, there is PIS inherent here. Either its PIS that Wolverine can tag Thor that much, or its PIS that Thor can reliably keep track of Quicksilver.

Everything in a comic is 'plot induced', and if a character constantly limits himself for the sake of a story, we'd be arguing a different character to take away those limitations for a forum match.

Originally posted by CosmicComet
The thing is, space is a very big place.

In space, lightspeed itself is not impressive. Hell it takes 30+ minutes or so for light to travel from Jupiter to here.

Surfer himself enters hyperspace or some other sort of plot device for his best speeds, its more akin to teleportation than anything else, he uses it for going from point A to B, not for nimble aerial dog fights.

Humans can fire ahead of their tunnel vision when they fly in supersonic jets. Does not mean their reactions are supersonic. That is essentially what we are dealing with with these FTL flying speeds in space.

And this is the main reason space flight shouldn't be accepted as a speed feat or should be used as a perception on how fast a character is. Achieving light speed in space does not equal combat speed imo... its all a plot produced for a story.

An example. Vulcan has achieved light speed through space but he wouldn't be able to perceive Quicksilver if QS didn't want him seeing him. Despero has achieved light speed in space but if Wally doesn't want him seeing him, he isn't detecting him. The list goes on.

In comics, characters achieving light is rare in a gravitational environment... especially during combat. Its hard to find a character actually achieving light speed during a fight "minus flash", hell, it doesn't exist but again, if we fall back on space flight as a refrence of combat speed, then everyone has that ability.

Originally posted by carver9
And this is the main reason space flight shouldn't be accepted as a speed feat or should be used as a perception on how fast a character is. Achieving light speed in space does not equal combat speed imo... its all a plot produced for a story.

An example. Vulcan has achieved light speed through space but he wouldn't be able to perceive Quicksilver if QS didn't want him seeing him. Despero has achieved light speed in space but if Wally doesn't want him seeing him, he isn't detecting him. The list goes on.

In comics, characters achieving light is rare in a gravitational environment... especially during combat. Its hard to find a character actually achieving light speed during a fight "minus flash", hell, it doesn't exist but again, if we fall back on space flight as a refrence of combat speed, then everyone has that ability.

Based on what would Vulcan not be able to perceive Quicksilver?

Originally posted by Existere
Then the concept of PIS creates a flawed discussion.

Everything in a comic is 'plot induced', and if a character constantly limits himself for the sake of a story, we'd be arguing a different character to take away those limitations for a forum match.

Basically.

Originally posted by Mindset
Based on what would Vulcan not be able to perceive Quicksilver?

Based on Gladiator having to save him from a sniper bullet and Quicksilver being MUCH faster than a bullet.

@Carver

Pretty much.

On the other hand, straightline speed feats or ok for battle use if its provable that they can accelerate to said speeds in the necessary amount of time. Afterall, the shortest distance between two points is still a straight line.

Golden Age Captain Marvel for example could reach his top speeds of multiple millions of millions of times of lightspeed in the 'blink of an eye' and has lightspeed feats even on Earth.

Originally posted by Prep-Man
No offense, but I always thought that the whole MU being more realistic/believable is BS. Marvel has a crap load of powerful beings as well. Quicksilver can go light speed, the mutants can hang with cosmic beings, Thor and MU gods/cosmics. Overall, MU is just as powerful as DC, IMO. If I had to lean a certain way, I think DC has more powerful beings, because there are a crap load of Greenn Lanterns, a crap load of Kryptonians, a crap load of mages, a crap load of speedsters, etc...

No offense taken at all. I think marvel is written to a more "mortal level" Yeah Marvel has its mutants, but only quicksilver goes lightspeed. In dc everyone goes Lightspeed.

What mutants can really hang with cosmic beings??? Apocalypse?? Thats one being. What Mutants reguarly hang with Thor?? DC has guys that wear rings that can hang with gods. Everyone in JLA can beat a god except batman.

In Marvel not to many people can beat the god Hercules. In DC everyone can beat the God hercules.

Originally posted by carver9
Based on Gladiator having to save him from a sniper bullet and Quicksilver being MUCH faster than a bullet.

Hhhmmm... thinking about it, it would really help if you all made some type of thread where you all basically had produce feats "outside of space flight" where a character actually achieved light speed combat. That would help and aid at some of these debates, especially all these combos to kos before a person could actually move their muscles.

Again, achieving light is a rare instance in comics "outside of space flight".

But the thing is, people tend to fall back on other characters hitting other characters that actually have these showings... example.

Quicksilver for instance. Thor, Wolverine, along with numerous of others have tagged him AND perceived him... with that said, does that make them light speedsters.

Example... Flash... 100s have tagged and perceived him... does that make them light speedsters and if so, which ones is ftl and which ones aren't and why.

At some point the shyte's all relative. I think that people put too much thought into the speed thing, 99% of it is hyperbole. In regards to a forum battle, save for high end feats, it all tends to average out in the end.

Originally posted by Mindset
Maybe he didn't see it.

Lol... him and Glads were looking in the same direction and when Glads caught it, the bullet was right in front of his face.

That pretty much throw out Vulcan having ftl reactions or being able to perceive a QS.

Originally posted by carver9
Hhhmmm... thinking about it, it would really help if you all made some type of thread where you all basically had produce feats "outside of space flight" where a character actually achieved light speed combat. That would help and aid at some of these debates, especially all these combos to kos before a person could actually move their muscles.

Again, achieving light is a rare instance in comics "outside of space flight".

But the thing is, people tend to fall back on other characters hitting other characters that actually have these showings... example.

Quicksilver for instance. Thor, Wolverine, along with numerous of others have tagged him AND perceived him... with that said, does that make them light speedsters.

Example... Flash... 100s have tagged and perceived him... does that make them light speedsters and if so, which ones is ftl and which ones aren't and why.

except that you can't retroactively apply old feats to a character that might have had an upgrade.

and then there's consistency to worry about.

Originally posted by carver9
Lol... him and Glads were looking in the same direction and when Glads caught it, the bullet was right in front of his face.

That pretty much throw out Vulcan having ftl reactions or being able to perceive a QS.

I asked the writer.

Originally posted by dmills
At some point the shyte's all relative. I think that people put too much thought into the speed thing, 99% of it is hyperbole. In regards to a forum battle, save for high end feats, it all tends to average out in the end.

Yep...

I know Galan is going to hate this but I think that attosecond statement from Flash was also Hyperbole.

Originally posted by Mindset
Vulcan had sand in his eye.

I asked the writer.

😆

Originally posted by carver9
Yep...

I know Galan is going to hat this but I think that attosecond statement from Flash was also Hyperbole.

True story.

Originally posted by Hyperion Prime
No offense taken at all. I think marvel is written to a more "mortal level" Yeah Marvel has its mutants, but only quicksilver goes lightspeed. In dc everyone goes Lightspeed.

What mutants can really hang with cosmic beings??? Apocalypse?? Thats one being. What Mutants reguarly hang with Thor?? DC has guys that wear rings that can hang with gods. Everyone in JLA can beat a god except batman.

In Marvel not to many people can beat the god Hercules. In DC everyone can beat the God hercules.

Originally posted by -Pr-
except that you can't retroactively apply old feats to a character that might have had an upgrade.

and then there's consistency to worry about.

Hhhmmm...

I think consistency would "hurt" a lot of characters vs helping them ESPECIALLY when discussing speed.

Originally posted by CosmicComet
The thing is, space is a very big place.

In space, lightspeed itself is not impressive. Hell it takes 30+ minutes or so for light to travel from Jupiter to here.

Surfer himself enters hyperspace or some other sort of plot device for his best speeds, its more akin to teleportation than anything else, he uses it for going from point A to B, not for nimble aerial dog fights.

Humans can fire ahead of their tunnel vision when they fly in supersonic jets. Does not mean their reactions are supersonic. That is essentially what we are dealing with with these FTL flying speeds in space.