Originally posted by ScreamPaste
Interesting.By avoiding them before they're fired off, or blocking them, unless you can show me someone reacting to such an attack /after/ it's been used.
See, you could say that, except that Ganon didn't avoid it, he swatted it out of the air. That is a legitimate lightning timing feat. In order to track something through the air, and strike it as it passes you, sending it back to it's source, you need to have good reaction time. In this case, a lightning bolt.
IE, Ganondorf actually has a feat, rather than speculation.
Well for one, nothing says they'd tank them 'easily', just not be one shotted. Meh. And even so, for this thread it doesn't matter, Gouki has better feats that have nothing to do with those characters.
No evidence = no ability, I'm afraid. Gouki is not a lightning timer.
Bigger kids have tried, and Gouki still needs to be able to fight deal with the twilight field and Ganon's other devious abilities. Can Gouki detect people in other dimensions? Can he strike someone who can react to lightning strikes with casuality? Ganondorf can also open up a hole in dimensions and force Gouki through with TK, trapping him between them.
Gouki very much needs his team mates.
Indeed.
I can not show you anything, since said characters are virtually weaklings and unimportant, their fights are never shown in detail.
Actually, you can prepare to strike something impossibly faster than you are before it's even released, if you know where it's headed. Also, if you can see someone swat lightening, then it was moving as fast as lightening. I would love to see this event you describe.
It's not speculation on my part either, it's called common sense.
Well, they do tank them easily. Blanka is hardly a threat in the SFU.
Sure, whatever pleases you.
Gouki will obliterate Ganon's soul with the force of his own sins before he has a chance to do anything. To pile on to that, so far, I haven't seen Ganon accomplish a single feat that would harm Gouki. And Again, Oni has TK and Asura Senku as well, making him intangible.
In the words of Gouki:"The Raging Demon... Its power is unequal... It is not my fists, but your past sins that will kill you... The more evil your past doings, the more painful your death..."
Why are we even debatin Akuma at this point? He's never been seen at lvls even close to his actual limits. I would assume that this thread calls for reg Akuma, and he should lose against cats usin powerful magic. His only hope would be a SSGS. Now when he goes Shin and Oni, that's another story. A tale that can't be told cuz he never needed to got to these lvls in canon and he never did.
Can't argue for or against Shin or Oni since nobody knows shit about'im. To do so is just plain ridiculous.
Originally posted by Burning thought
Maybe incapacitated is the wrong word, but I dont have one off the top of my head for lieing on your back for a good few seconds helpless to a boys follow up strike.
Dazed, perhaps? It's not like Kain can really make him fall of off anything anyway, unless Ghirahim tries the Endless Plunge again. Even then, the fight has 2 more phases you don't seem to be taking into account.
Kinda like most of Kains teleports yet according to you thats slow, considering everyone can continually move faster than that, he wouldnt be able to, add to the fact this looks purely like cancellation of a summon, e.g. not sometihing you can do to something or someone thats not your own like Link and the fact it appeared, apprently specific to location in the middle of the floor makes me wonder if he can even use it. We also dont see Ganon do this spell, so its ambigious of cast time and such.
It's a little quicker than Kain's canon teleport, or at least the initial opening is. I would not say it looks like cancellation of a summon, either, mostly due to large portal in the floor. Twinrova used the same effect to capture Nabooru in the middle of the desert, so it isn't tied to location, and I don't see how a portal opening in a second leaves any doubt as to the cast time.
Its probably his final form, and he shows that he cant take falls. Not canonically I would wager, only in gameplay and as i said to scream, could be that based on the evidence his inner body is soft and so cant take falling traumer.
It also shows that he takes three of Link's "Fatal Blows" using the Master Sword to the chest without dying, and only suffering some cracks. It also shows his arms being invulnerable to Link's slashes, given that he uses him bare arms to block. I don't think he even has an inner body, either, given his...species. It might be the effort of making a barrier to stop his fall for all we know, since he doesn't seem to move much when he does that.
Originally posted by The Scenario
Dazed, perhaps? It's not like Kain can really make him fall of off anything anyway, unless Ghirahim tries the Endless Plunge again. Even then, the fight has 2 more phases you don't seem to be taking into account.It's a little quicker than Kain's canon teleport, or at least the initial opening is. I would not say it looks like cancellation of a summon, either, mostly due to large portal in the floor. Twinrova used the same effect to capture Nabooru in the middle of the desert, so it isn't tied to location, and I don't see how a portal opening in a second leaves any doubt as to the cast time.
It also shows that he takes three of Link's "Fatal Blows" using the Master Sword to the chest without dying, and only suffering some cracks. It also shows his arms being invulnerable to Link's slashes, given that he uses him bare arms to block. I don't think he even has an inner body, either, given his...species. It might be the effort of making a barrier to stop his fall for all we know, since he doesn't seem to move much when he does that.
No Kain could just TK him into the air or throw him higher than hes fallen, anyone here could do that. The two phases do not counter the earlier though.
His summoned being was defeated and he said specifcally he was banishing it, so unless you can prove he can banish anyone the same way and can create portals like that anywhere despite the appearance of the area its not much use. Not sure if its the same, you would have ot show me Twinrovas and wut? the portal opening would be after the cast time, which we dont know apprently.
Not sure how thats impressive tbh considering most here in this thread could take unlimited numbers of those strikes.
Bleh, I should be asleep.
Originally posted by linkownsyousobsHonestly, nah...
I'd say it's because he was heavy, and it was hard for him to get off his back. The armor surrounded his entire body.
Link beat him all to shit with his sword, the fall has nothing to do with it. I could get beaten down with a bat, and when I git the floor it'll take me a while to get up, that has nothing to do with fall distance or being heavy, lol.
Originally posted by linkownsyousobsWell, honestly, the hits from Link's sword would be far more dangerous than any fall anyway. Lol.
Yes, and since he was covered in armor, he was only able to drive him to the edge. You hitting him respectively didn't do much because it kept clanging off of his armor. Bleh, idc, it was just a suggestion.
And tbh, it's entirely probably him laying there for any period of time is just to allow the player time to hit him with a fatal blow... IE, gameplay. Considering the things we seem him do in cutscenes and the scale of power shown in the game, a fall is honestly hilariously small time. :/
Shit, the imprisoned's weakest form made the entirety of the sealed grounds heave and quake just by escaping its' seal.
Originally posted by Burning thought
No Kain could just TK him into the air or throw him higher than hes fallen, anyone here could do that. The two phases do not counter the earlier though.
Unlikely given how Ghirahim actually is heavier, and being thrown higher will just give him more time to teleport. Though I'm pretty sure Ghirahim was in sword form for this thread.
His summoned being was defeated and he said specifcally he was banishing it, so unless you can prove he can banish anyone the same way and can create portals like that anywhere despite the appearance of the area its not much use. Not sure if its the same, you would have ot show me Twinrovas and wut? the portal opening would be after the cast time, which we dont know apprently.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pl7EnUA0PQo#t=9m35s
It's the same, it can be created anywhere, it affects other people. Twinrova's appears to be weaker, though.
Not sure how thats impressive tbh considering most here in this thread could take unlimited numbers of those strikes.
Unlimited? Really, that's just being unfair. Quite a few people in this thread would be harmed pretty badly by a strike like that. Link's not in this thread, though, unfortunately.
Originally posted by ScreamPasteA thought occurs, think Samus can shoot through a magical barrier? If so, that would force Ganon to hit her first. That could be an advantage because having some control over where the fight occurs and awareness of target priority probably allows the trio to stick close to her. Dante I think can be seperated easily enough, but Sora may have a teleport. If not, that makes things much easier.
As for this, the wave beam has shot through forcefields before, and depending on the version goes through walls and such. The barrier being semitransparent just makes it easier. Granted, she probably won't be damaging it that way.
Originally posted by ScreamPaste
Well, honestly, the hits from Link's sword would be far more dangerous than any fall anyway. Lol.And tbh, it's entirely probably him laying there for any period of time is just to allow the player time to hit him with a fatal blow... IE, gameplay. Considering the things we seem him do in cutscenes and the scale of power shown in the game, a fall is honestly hilariously small time. :/
Shit, the imprisoned's weakest form made the entirety of the sealed grounds heave and quake just by escaping its' seal.
They would've if they pierced his armor... that's what the fatal blow was for.
True... all enemies lay down a few seconds after you beat the hell out of them. Probably just a mechanic.
The Imprisoned is a f*cker.... don't get me started on him, I hate it so much. Tis a ***** on Hero Mode... I almost rage quit on the 3rd fight. Dx
As for this, the wave beam has shot through forcefields before, and depending on the version goes through walls and such. The barrier being semitransparent just makes it easier. Granted, she probably won't be damaging it that way.
So it seems both Sora and Samus have methods to continue to be annoying to Ganon even when separated from one another. In Sora's case, direct teleportation. Hm.
I'd say if he takes Samus down before being significantly weakened he'll take it, though. Her visors and beams kind of shiv his intangibility and invisibility which is annoying, and limits him pretty bad. Conversely, he has powerful electrical attacks at his disposal, and can pen her in with forcefields and teleport on top of her. Something I think could ruin her day in a hurry. Dante would be unable to reach her, leaving Sora as her only aid.
How do you feel those odds are? In an enclosed space, my money is on Ganon over Samus, it's a matter of how effectively he can strike at her without taking significant return fire with Sora chasing him around.
If she proves tougher to kill than Sora though, Sora could be chosen to go down first because of his sheer ability to follow Ganon around and make himself annoying, whereas Dante can be sidelined.
Hm, need some durability showings on Sora.
Originally posted by The Scenario
Unlikely given how Ghirahim actually is heavier, and being thrown higher will just give him more time to teleport. Though I'm pretty sure Ghirahim was in sword form for this thread.http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pl7EnUA0PQo#t=9m35s
It's the same, it can be created anywhere, it affects other people. Twinrova's appears to be weaker, though.Unlimited? Really, that's just being unfair. Quite a few people in this thread would be harmed pretty badly by a strike like that. Link's not in this thread, though, unfortunately.
Assuming he can teleport, he didnt seem to be able to in that form specifically otherwise why didnt he avoid falling? perhaps his reaction times are slow, which is likely.
They both seem really weak, I dont know how strong that women is but even she was able to shout to link in the time it took for the portal that was already beneath her to take her, also I assum that did not go to the gap between dimensions?
Not really, its just fact. Well I guess your speaking for Samus there, but I wouldnt say even Samus would be pierced like that.
Also I have not looked, but have you mentioned one shotting Ganon with the plasma cannon? has he got heat resistance on par with tin? I feel ike your not hardly even trying to come up with defence for Samus in this thread, hell even with my limited knowledge i could probably argue her better at the moment.
Also I like how Scream has simply assumed their all going to be trapped by forcefields, as if his forcefields are godly strong and cannot be harmed.
Originally posted by No End N Site
Now when he goes Shin and Oni, that's another story. A tale that can't be told cuz he never needed to got to these lvls in canon and he never did.
Kevin Slackie: I felt that Evil Ryu and Oni broke everything vanilla and Super had set up story wise. Are they a part of the story canonically?Seth Killian: The core Street Fighter games are in fact canon, so yeah you gotta sort it out cause their there
Both Oni and Shin Evil Ryu ACTUALLY HAPPENED in SFIV.
Originally posted by Burning thought
Assuming he can teleport, he didnt seem to be able to in that form specifically otherwise why didnt he avoid falling? perhaps his reaction times are slow, which is likely.
Next time watch the whole fight, he teleports in his second and third phases. When you start making conclusions based on "why didn't X do Y?", you're going to a bad place. For instance, I could conclude that Kain's reactions are slow because he didn't mist form or teleport before Raziel could tag him, see? Besides, Ghirahim already dodged one of Link's attacks by teleporting in his untransformed states, and another by jumping, and he blocks nearly all of Link's attacks in all three forms, whether with swords or his arms.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JGnM-_mAeHc#t=19m55s (Here's your teleport, BTW)
Hmm. Actually, I wonder how Ghirahim throwing Tornados around will change this fight...
They both seem really weak, I dont know how strong that women is but even she was able to shout to link in the time it took for the portal that was already beneath her to take her, also I assum that did not go to the gap between dimensions?
Nah, she just got sent to be brainwashed and turned into an Iron Knuckle. Basically they just mind controlled her, put her in some ridiculously heavy armor, and gave an axe so she could smash stone pillars with it.
Not really, its just fact. Well I guess your speaking for Samus there, but I wouldnt say even Samus would be pierced like that.
Oh no, not Samus, though it might damage her. She still couldn't take "unlimited" strikes. More along the lines of Sora and War who might be disabled, Dante might be dazed for a bit, and Kain would certainly feel it. Still Ghirahim taking it is impressive, even if his big glowing weak point isn't as tough as the rest of him.
Also I have not looked, but have you mentioned one shotting Ganon with the plasma cannon? has he got heat resistance on par with tin? I feel ike your not hardly even trying to come up with defence for Samus in this thread, hell even with my limited knowledge i could probably argue her better at the moment.
Ganondorf tanked fire from a dragon spirit that incinerated most of a ship. In that same spirit's words, "Ganon cannot be defeated by such simple means as wrath and fire." So actually Ganondorf has quite good heat resistance, much better than, say, Kain. Hence why I'm choosing to focus on the Light Beam, which is much more likely to harm GanonDemise than plasma is, as well as the possibility of the electrical Wave Beam that could achieve a stun. Adding in the castle durability from Twilight Princess, this guy is pretty tough to hurt.
Also I like how Scream has simply assumed their all going to be trapped by forcefields, as if his forcefields are godly strong and cannot be harmed.
A known castle buster (Midna) just barely managed to bring one down, exhausting herself in the process, and Link with the Golden Gauntlets throwing a pillar at one failed to break it, instead breaking the pillar. They are pretty godly, but Samus has the means to bypass them with her weapons so it's all good.
Originally posted by ScreamPaste
How do you feel those odds are? In an enclosed space, my money is on Ganon over Samus, it's a matter of how effectively he can strike at her without taking significant return fire with Sora chasing him around.
Samus does a lot of fighting in enclosed spaces, and getting into melee leads one into encounters with Screw Attacks and Power Bombs, which I imagine are unpleasant. If her mobility is limited, I'd recommend the Morph Ball for smaller size and unpredictability.
Originally posted by The Scenario
Next time watch the whole fight, he teleports in his second and third phases. When you start making conclusions based on "why didn't X do Y?", you're going to a bad place. For instance, I could conclude that Kain's reactions are slow because he didn't mist form or teleport before Raziel could tag him, see? Besides, Ghirahim already dodged one of Link's attacks by teleporting in his untransformed states, and another by jumping, and he blocks nearly all of Link's attacks in all three forms, whether with swords or his arms.http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JGnM-_mAeHc#t=19m55s (Here's your teleport, BTW)
Hmm. Actually, I wonder how Ghirahim throwing Tornados around will change this fight...
Nah, she just got sent to be brainwashed and turned into an Iron Knuckle. Basically they just mind controlled her, put her in some ridiculously heavy armor, and gave an axe so she could smash stone pillars with it.
Oh no, not Samus, though it might damage her. She still couldn't take "unlimited" strikes. More along the lines of Sora and War who might be disabled, Dante might be dazed for a bit, and Kain would certainly feel it. Still Ghirahim taking it is impressive, even if his big glowing weak point isn't as tough as the rest of him.
Ganondorf tanked fire from a dragon spirit that incinerated most of a ship. In that same spirit's words, "Ganon cannot be defeated by such simple means as wrath and fire." So actually Ganondorf has quite good heat resistance, much better than, say, Kain. Hence why I'm choosing to focus on the Light Beam, which is much more likely to harm GanonDemise than plasma is, as well as the possibility of the electrical Wave Beam that could achieve a stun. Adding in the castle durability from Twilight Princess, this guy is pretty tough to hurt.
A known castle buster (Midna) just barely managed to bring one down, exhausting herself in the process, and Link with the Golden Gauntlets throwing a pillar at one failed to break it, instead breaking the pillar. They are pretty godly, but Samus has the means to bypass them with her weapons so it's all good.
Samus does a lot of fighting in enclosed spaces, and getting into melee leads one into encounters with Screw Attacks and Power Bombs, which I imagine are unpleasant. If her mobility is limited, I'd recommend the Morph Ball for smaller size and unpredictability.
Fair enough but still, it seems suspect. And tornados, depends on how strong they are.
😆 I like how only the characters you like get a more positive word. Well no, not really. He got impaled, true he got back up but so would most here as I said, infact several here wouldnt even be pierced.
So fire is the same as melting metal quickly? no, no its not....you see, your bias, burning up a ship is not the same as melting metal at any speed. Its funny how you say hes tough to hurt on a castle feat but someone who can take millions times the force to smash a castle in a square mm of his chest, your willing to debate far more against.
Cna you show me some of these forcefields and their power, and more importantly Ganon making them.
Originally posted by Burning thought
Fair enough but still, it seems suspect. And tornados, depends on how strong they are.
Depends on how well they fly, it's likely to throw everyone everywhere.
😆 I like how only the characters you like get a more positive word. Well no, not really. He got impaled, true he got back up but so would most here as I said, infact several here wouldnt even be pierced.
Quite a few would still be injured by a 30 tonner (I got the weight of the metal block, btw) shoving a sword into their chests. That would pierce quite a few of them.
So fire is the same as melting metal quickly? no, no its not....you see, your bias, burning up a ship is not the same as melting metal at any speed. Its funny how you say hes tough to hurt on a castle feat but someone who can take millions times the force to smash a castle in a square mm of his chest, your willing to debate far more against.
I think you're missing the point here. Ganondorf has fire resistance, but a weakness to light based and holy weapons. The Light Beam has exactly the same feats of incinerating creatures that the plasma beam does, and it's a weakness, so it's a much more effective weapon against Ganondorf than something he would have resistance to. Any particular reason you're arguing that Ganondorf, who has fire resistance, would be hurt by the plasma beam but at the same time claiming that Kain, who has a vulnerability to fire, would not be hurt? It's also funny how the thing that busted the castle was a spear (i.e: sharp point) wielded by a much stronger character than Raziel hitting Ganon and that the explosion was purely collateral damage. Really, if you're trying to suggest that Raziel could replicate any of Midna's feats, you're going to need better evidence.
Cna you show me some of these forcefields and their power, and more importantly Ganon making them.
Sure thing.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kMG6chL_YrI#t=5m5s (Link throws the infamous pillar into one of Ganondorf's forcefields. The pillar breaks.)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HI0k71V57Ko (You've seen it a million times, but here's Midna breaking the barrier around Hyrule Castle and exhausting herself.)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BXeJdB9_-zQ#t=4m (This is the above barrier being formed.)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pj6vXjrZmfw#t=4m (Sidelining Midna)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bx0Yfg6EasQ#t=32s (Sidelining Zelda)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cFHT4Y6-UMk#t=46s (Fire barrier because why not.)