Batman vs Wolverine: Willpower Edt. Who has more willpower?

Originally posted by Dum Dum Dugan
I agree, having a shitter life does not mean your will is better.

Also it not very fair debate anways in terms of shittier lifes Wolverine takes that hands down.

Can we get scan or something on these events or at the veyr least more detail.

I don't have any scans of RIP/Final Crisis/Return of Bruce Wayne on hand, so I'll do my best to explain it. Since I'm arguing in favor of Batman here, you can ask that someone else post the actual scans, look up issues numbers yourself, or what have you if you want to see for yourself and not take my word on it.

Essentially, Darkseid shot Batman's psyche through the time itself as a means to perpetually torture him and break him down for eternity, and through force of will, he fought his way from the days of the Neanderthal back to present day Gotham, pitting his will against that of Darkseid's own machinations and iirc, a trap designed to destroy the world should Batman's mind return to the present.

Originally posted by -Pr-
Bruce imo, for the reasons Jake posted.

Also think u all are really over looking Wolverine here and if I had a better indication of the feats u guys are referring to i think i could produce some very comparable feats from Wolverine.

Originally posted by Dum Dum Dugan
Can we get some scans, issue numbers? at least a a detail description. Just saying events is a pit vague.

Also think u all are really over looking Wolverine here and if I had a better indication of the feats u guys are referring to i think i could produce some very comparable feats from Wolverine.

Why does picking Batman automatically mean we're over-looking Wolverine?

It's not possible that we could simply think that Batman has more willpower?

I know what Wolvie is capable of. I know what Batman is capable.

And Batman takes this. Handily.

Flipping through Morrison's Batman run, I realize just how much of a mindphuck RIP on up was.

Could we get some Wolverine feats?

Originally posted by -Pr-
Why does picking Batman automatically mean we're over-looking Wolverine?

It's not possible that we could simply think that Batman has more willpower?

Well it obvious you think he has more, why else would you say it?

Originally posted by Bentley
Could we get some Wolverine feats?

Originally posted by Dum Dum Dugan
It the way and which you pick him. You said "Batman omg" Which to me implies you don't think it arguable. And I think that is a mistake to think Batman takes this hands down. Perhaps he does take this , i doubt it, but even if he did, it far from a certainty.

Well it obvious you think he has more, why else would you say it?

No I didn't say "Batman omg".

Why is that a problem?

I dont think Batman jumping through time that much of a will feat even if it is from the Omega Sanction. there was really nothing there that various heroes couldnt confront.

I could one up the Omega Sanction quite handedly with Wolverine going to hell which is far more higher than the Omega Sanction.

It would be similar to the thought process being used here and slightly better. 😮‍💨

Originally posted by -Pr-
No I didn't say "Batman omg".

Why is that a problem?

It was not a problem. It is just your opinion. I thought you said OMG. As if you were implying that Batman winning this is not debatable. However I simply miss read what you posted and i apologies.

people seems to be mistaking pain tolerance for willpower...

batman's willpower would dance circles around wolverine's

Originally posted by gogogadgetgo
people seems to be mistaking pain tolerance for willpower...

Originally posted by gogogadgetgo
[B]
batman's willpower would dance circles around wolverine's

This as an absurd statements to make and you sir need to back this up. lets see some evidence.

Originally posted by Dum Dum Dugan
Also there far more people trying to pass off Wolverine killing as lacking will which is not the case at all. Killing does not make you have inferior will power.

killing often is to gain a feeling of satisfaction, or revenge...batman doesn't kill, and therefore denies himself the pleasure of ultimate revenge that weaker men succumb to.

its easier to kill than to have the power to kill but not do it.

Originally posted by gogogadgetgo
people seems to be mistaking pain tolerance for willpower...

batman's willpower would dance circles around wolverine's

why do you think people use torture to break a person's will?

even Green Lantern's have lost their Will and concentration to pain b/c they were unable to overcome it.

🙄

Originally posted by Starscream M
actually killing does mean lack of willpower for heroes

killing often is to gain a feeling of satisfaction, or revenge...batman doesn't kill, and therefore denies himself the pleasure of ultimate revenge that weaker men succumb to.

its easier to kill than to have the power to kill but not do it.

that is your opinion not a fact of heroics.

a hero is suppose to make great sacrifices for others. Batman doesnt kill b/c he made an oath not to that shows he has discipline and resolve but nothing else..

Give Batman Venom and torture him for the majority of his life and see what happens.

Wolverine kills b/c he knows some ppl deserve to die or risk them killing and harming again. He makes the sacrifices that other heroes wont. that is more heroic than saying I refuse to sacrifice part of myself for others.

Logan does it willingly at great cost to himself.

again Batman doesnt live with a berserk animal inside him trying to get out there is no accomplishment for him not killing and it doesnt show he has greater will.

Originally posted by Starscream M
actually killing does mean lack of willpower for heroes

It could mean that it certain cases, but just because some heroes kill and other do not. Do not make them inferior in terms of will power. Your statement is very much false.

Originally posted by Starscream M

killing often is to gain a feeling of satisfaction, or revenge...batman doesn't kill, and therefore denies himself the pleasure of ultimate revenge that weaker men succumb to.

Originally posted by Starscream M

its easier to kill than to have the power to kill but not do it.

Originally posted by Dum Dum Dugan

No it not. I have the power to kill as does anyone and the majority of us don't kill. your logic is very much flawed.

These guys face things regular people don't.

Originally posted by Juntai
What if you walked in as your mom was being bludgeoned to death with a tire iron and you knew where a gun was stashed nearby? Would you kill then?

These guys face things regular people don't.

We can pretend that Batman might make the noble choice due to willpower but you dont know that. All we have is the feats at hand and Batman has not shown to have the greater will simply b/c he doesnt have similar situations as Wolverine.

Originally posted by Nietzschean
I dont think Batman jumping through time that much of a will feat even if it is from the Omega Sanction. there was really nothing there that various heroes couldnt confront.

I could one up the Omega Sanction quite handedly with Wolverine going to hell which is far more higher than the Omega Sanction.

It would be similar to the thought process being used here and slightly better. 😮‍💨

The Omega Sanction was intended to break Batman's spirit and torture him for all time, culminating with Darkseid's intent to have Batman give in to Anti-Life. Not sure how that's not a huge willpower feat in your eyes especially considering that under Morrison, Darkseid was this ultimate evil threat who threatened all reality. The Sanction was a last ditch effort to deal with Batman (short of killing him) because Darkseid couldn't control him and his will. I don't wank Darkseid or Morrison, but you do need to understand how impressive all of that is. It's far more impressive than Logan going to a version of Marvel's Hell.

Furthermore, if you want to bring hell into this, Batman endured the psychological torture and manipulation of Dr. Hurt, who was, for all intents and purposes, the actual Devil himself. Morrison himself states that that was the overall intent of R.I.P (which actually stands for Rot in Purgatory); Batman cheating the Devil himself.

Batman's will is so strong, that when he was captured and his memories were being looked into in order to create an army of Batmen, his very mind was turned into a weapon. Under Morrison, Batman was almost literally portrayed and handled as "Batgod", whose force of will and sense of self is easily superhuman.