Thor vs Worldbreaker Hulk (Slugfest) · Comic Book 'Versus' Forum

carver9 Senior Member

Originally posted by Naija boy
lol Carver unwittingly is perhaps the biggest challenge to hulk on KMC. No offense Carv 😄

Maybe I need to start cheering for Surfer then. 😠

carver9 Senior Member

Originally posted by Newjak
Feats aren't the only thing that amtters yes, battles do count to, but that doesn't just mean you throw those feats out when obviously there is a large power gap in the contestant that generally gets explained away by one holding back.
I like how you use the term angry to make it sound like that means he was obviously that strong. I hate to break it to you Carver if he needed a Colossus level being to help him with Wendigo that means he was not operating at his top tier level.

Or you could just be lowballing Wendigo. No one said he NEEDED him, Sasquash was just there. You must never read the fight...Sasquashed got two paneled by Wendigo...then Hulk showed up.

If Hulk is pissed, he gains a strength increase...I don't understand how you are denying this when this factor is the main part of his powerset just like its a part of Namor powerset to increase in strength when hydrated.

Newjak I am Beyond Power

Originally posted by carver9
Or you could just be lowballing Wendigo. No one said he NEEDED him, Sasquash was just there. You must never read the fight...Sasquashed got two paneled by Wendigo...then Hulk showed up.
If Hulk is pissed, he gains a strength increase...I don't understand how you are denying this when this factor is the main part of his powerset just like its a part of Namor powerset to increase in strength when hydrated.

When did I say he doesn't increase in strength based on anger....

That's actually the whole point is his strength is variable....

Even when he is pissed off it doesn't mean he is balls to the wall high level or even mid level.

carver9 Senior Member

Originally posted by Newjak
When did I say he doesn't increase in strength based on anger....
That's actually the whole point is his strength is variable....
Even when he is pissed off it doesn't mean he is balls to the wall high level or even mid level.

Newjack,.you would need some type of evidence showing that a pissed Savage strength is below Herald level because looking on panel, its the exact opposite. What showings are you basing this off of?

carver9 Senior Member

Don't avoid my question like you've been doing.

Newjak I am Beyond Power

Originally posted by carver9
Newjack,.you would need some type of evidence showing that a pissed Savage strength is below Herald level because looking on panel, its the exact opposite. What showings are you basing this off of?

Why do I need to do anything... All I need is the fact that Savage Hulk's strength was variable even pissed or angry as he generally is always angry.

The fact even pissed off he can still range from Namor level to Thor level even all the way down to Abom level.

So why do I need anything. It's not like I care about your approval.

carver9 Senior Member

Originally posted by Newjak
Why do I need to do anything... All I need is the fact that Savage Hulk's strength was variable even pissed or angry as he generally is always angry.
The fact even pissed off he can still range from Namor level to Thor level even all the way down to Abom level.
So why do I need anything. It's not like I care about your approval.

This isn't about an approval, this is about the fact that everything on panel concerning Savage Hulk being angry contradicts everything you are saying. Savage Hulk starts off pissed...there is no such thing as him starting off low...his strength continues to grow while the fight proceeds.

Savage Hulk has fought Wendigo 5+ Times...are you really implying Wendigo never fought Savage at his best during ANY of these fights? Savage Hulk has fought Thor 12+ Times, are you really implying Savage Hulk wasnt at his best during any of these fights.? I can easily prove that when Hulk is angry, he is at or above top tier.

A angry Savage Hulk.

The proof is on you buddy. Prove your lame claim that when Savage Hulk is angry, his strength isnt in the high Herald tier.

Naija boy Senior Member

Originally posted by Newjak
😆 That is true.
How the hell am I highballing or using Hercules to try and up Thor. Thor can hold his own as already shown Thor has one shotted and outright KOed Namor in the rain. So there needs to be no exaggeration its simply there.
The point is that Herc's upper/mid/lower bound limit far exceeds Namor's lower/mid/upper bound limits you want to act like just because they have kind of close fights that changes somehow 😬
And yes Colossus is playing out of his league when it comes to Namor and Hercules. You trying to make it sound closer then what it is is actually a pathetic attempt at underplaying the gaps between these characters.
Hercules mid bound tows islands Colossus is at best a 1000 tonner based on feats and how he fairs against people. Hercules is 1000s if not millions of times stronger than Colossus just based on that. You add in the planetary feats the upper bound then it's far more.

Ill just take your blatant dodge of the core of my post regarding savage hulk as more evidence of your inability to muster a reasoned response. Concession accepted 🙂

Now to the next part, you are highly exxagerating the gap between inferior characters i.e colossus and namor, and then herc so that u can infer an even huger gap between they and Thor. Your high balling because you are attemptin to ignore character interaction and make detrminations of high feats instead.

Show me some of these Namors upper bound feats that make him exponentially stronger than colossus. i.e learn how to back up your claims as opposed to ad nauseam regurgitation.

Also, direct character comparisons and interaction trump high balling any day of the week. Trying to cite hercules highest feats while directly ignoring the direct comparisons between he and Namor is feat whoring at the expense of portrayals. Seriously to use this foolish logic against you, Thor has way better high end strength feats than juggernaut and yet in their direct interactions such a strength gap had not shown. I'm sure in such a situation you would not give high end feats such precedence.....smh. The same reasoning can be applied across the board to a variety of characters. But thats where the issue is with you. Critical "reasoning" is a concept beyond you, besides already being an inept and hypocritical debater. Fact is Namor and Herc have interacted on numerous occasions and none of those have portrayed Namor as being astronomically below Herc. Ignoring those direct interactions in favor of feat whoring is idiotic.

As for colossus and herc. That was not thé direct example i brought up. so i will wait for you to actually prove thé énormity of the gap between herc and namor before getting into that. Instead of dodging and making blanket claims, try to actually reason out a rebutall. Take it as a challenge. Im sure u can at least manage an attempt.....
🙂

PillarofOsiris Senior Member

I love the use of a emoticon or a "lol" to prove a point. I love this site.

Naija boy Senior Member

^Emoticons and lols arent used to prove points, reasoned arguments (which too many people seem incapable of) are used for that. The other stuff is mostly for kicks and to express amusement like so 🙂

Stoic Avenger

Originally posted by leonidas
wut? there is nothing 'convenient' about it. you say you get what i'm saying, but your use of pietro as an example that questions my post clearly tells me you don't. 😬
you somehow continue to push this idea of a hidden agenda on me and you keep turning my comments into some unsaid commentary on hulk and his strength.
i couldn't care less if hulk was shown to do something 1000x greater than anything he's done before. i think his feat against bi-beast and wendigo doesn't come close to his best, but whatever.
my problem has nothing whatsoever to do with hulk. seriously. it has to do ENTIRELY with an off-hand remark that has been taken literally by hulk fans to attempt to quantify his strength. which i STILL find ridiculous. the whole fight was written almost tongue-in-cheek, so to take the comment literally seems ridiculous to me. was hulk strong? yes. stronger than ever? who knows. maybe. probably. that's enough for me. the clinging to a number by some seems almost desperate and actually detracts from the story's main point.
you can claim they were 1000x their regular power as many times as you like. you have a bit of narrative to support it but no feats. at all. so make your declarations as black and white as you'd like, and try and claim them as fact. i don't care. i'll not be buying them though.

Understood. This however is still your opinion, and it is in no way concrete, as it was stated exactly how powerful Wendigo, and the Bi-Beast were. Silly or not. No feats? Well they were simply never given any time in their augmented states to mount any defense, or offense as they were flying into space only to be stopped by Arm'Cheddon's space ship. That's if we want to go with what was written on panel, and not our imaginings.

Sr J-Bieb Dead

Bi Beast and Wendigo died by hitting that ship.
And Hulk beating them had more to do with manueverability than it did with raw power

psycho gundam The Nightmare of Solomon

Originally posted by Sr J-Bieb
Bi Beast and Wendigo died by hitting that ship.
And Hulk beating them had more to do with manueverability than it did with raw power

Originally posted by Sr J-Bieb
Bi Beast and Wendigo died by hitting that ship.

err.. he maneuvered them into the ship with raw power?

p.s. H1 can do the math on that feat anytime he feels like eating humble pie

carver9 Senior Member

Lol.

carver9 Senior Member

Newjack...almost forgot...I would like to post this as well.

Hulk JUST turned to Savage Hulk...there was no time to get angry and this is what happened.

http://i226.photobucket.com/albums/dd124/HulkFights/Vs%20Thor/Fight%205/1.jpg
http://i226.photobucket.com/albums/dd124/HulkFights/Vs%20Thor/Fight%205/2.jpg
http://i226.photobucket.com/albums/dd124/HulkFights/Vs%20Thor/Fight%205/3.jpg

Thor even admits in the last scan that Savage Hulk is stronger than him. Those 3 to 4 hits Savage Hulk landed on Thor had him in pain..slowly getting up to his ft and again, this was a Savage Hulk that JUST turned, a SavageHulk that didn't even have time to completely build up his strength.

Your argument is flawed in so many way.

Sr J-Bieb Dead

Originally posted by psycho gundam
err.. he maneuvered them into the ship with raw power?
p.s. H1 can do the math on that feat anytime he feels like eating humble pie

I never said raw power had nothing to do with it, but Hulk mostly won because of how "agile" he was

Also dying by hitting a ship makes no sense for beings that powerful

Newjak I am Beyond Power

Originally posted by Naija boy
Ill just take your blatant dodge of the core of my post regarding savage hulk as more evidence of your inability to muster a reasoned response. Concession accepted 🙂
Now to the next part, you are highly exxagerating the gap between inferior characters i.e colossus and namor, and then herc so that u can infer an even huger gap between they and Thor. Your high balling because you are attemptin to ignore character interaction and make detrminations of high feats instead.
Show me some of these Namors upper bound feats that make him exponentially stronger than colossus. i.e learn how to back up your claims as opposed to ad nauseam regurgitation.
Also, direct character comparisons and interaction trump high balling any day of the week. Trying to cite hercules highest feats while directly ignoring the direct comparisons between he and Namor is feat whoring at the expense of portrayals. Seriously to use this foolish logic against you, Thor has way better high end strength feats than juggernaut and yet in their direct interactions such a strength gap had not shown. I'm sure in such a situation you would not give high end feats such precedence.....smh. The same reasoning can be applied across the board to a variety of characters. But thats where the issue is with you. Critical "reasoning" is a concept beyond you, besides already being an inept and hypocritical debater. Fact is Namor and Herc have interacted on numerous occasions and none of those have portrayed Namor as being astronomically below Herc. Ignoring those direct interactions in favor of feat whoring is idiotic.
As for colossus and herc. That was not thé direct example i brought up. so i will wait for you to actually prove thé énormity of the gap between herc and namor before getting into that. Instead of dodging and making blanket claims, try to actually reason out a rebutall. Take it as a challenge. Im sure u can at least manage an attempt.....
🙂

There was no concession it was just your post about Wendigo was stupid then as it was from the beginning.

And yes you can't completely overlook battles but there are things called PIS/CIS. Unless you want to admit Spider-man beating Firelord physically is possible, or that Black Panther can arm bar lock the Surfer... do you really want to say that.

Fact: There are a number of reasons why certain characters do well particularly when heroes are fighting each other. Namely they hold back against each other.

As for Juggernaut, his punches measured something like 6.0 - 8.0 on the ricter scale. He has thrown an object out of Earth into space. He managed to stop WWH when everyone else was getting destroyed. And just so you don't think I'm trying to just use Hulk, he has also collapsed entire valleys, over powered Colossus easily, and jugger powered Colossus pushed Kuurth all the way back to where he started from. There's his battle with the Stone Cutter that was rocking everything. There's also numerous statements that says he is on Thor's level strength wise.

So no I'm not just relying on feats from his fight vs Thor. Juggernaut has all 3 items going for him he has fights, feats, and statements. 😉

And truth is you still can't prove Wendigo was anywhere close to Thor level strength or even Namor level at that.

Carver Hulk always starts of pissed you're right and yet people like Abom and Rhino can give him prolonged fights to.

carver9 Senior Member

Just terrible.

Just because Wonderman has giving Thor fits.

Rhino has given Hulk fits.

Colossus has given Gladiator fits.

Ironman has given Surfer fits (hell, Rhino did well against Surfer as well)

Piotro/Colossus has given Juggernaut fits.

Namor has given Sentry fits.

This doesn't put these people in the same tier...its comics and its how Things tend to play out to make the story interesting. With the fights that you are talking about with Rhino vs Hulk,how did the fight go...was Rhino winning? Did he show that he was stronger than Hulk?

Abomination is a Hulk villain...of coarse he would give Hulk a fight and at one point he was created to be twice as strong as Savage Hulk but the thing about this is, Abomination loses to the Hulk because the Hulk is stronger.

Kind of like Tutinax and the Thor fight. Thor has gotten completely DOMINATED by Tutinax twice. Tutinax doesn't have the fts to suggest he could hang with Savage Hulk, let alone WWH who would outright destroy him and ESPECIALLY WBH who would one shot his a**.

I'm trying to understand your argument but its not making any sense. You are trying to use Savage Hulk lowest showings to aid in your argument when the same can be said about almost any character, including Thor.

carver9 Senior Member

And that still doesn't change the fact that in both of my scans with Thor fighting Hulk, Thor gets completely dominated and in another, he admits Savage Hulk is stronger than him. What more proof do you need?

TheHulk Retired Debater

Originally posted by carver9
Just terrible.
Just because Wonderman has giving Thor fits.
Rhino has given Hulk fits.
Colossus has given Gladiator fits.
Ironman has given Surfer fits (hell, Rhino did well against Surfer as well)
Piotro/Colossus has given Juggernaut fits.
Namor has given Sentry fits.
This doesn't put these people in the same tier...its comics and its how Things tend to play out to make the story interesting. With the fights that you are talking about with Rhino vs Hulk,how did the fight go...was Rhino winning? Did he show that he was stronger than Hulk?
Abomination is a Hulk villain...of coarse he would give Hulk a fight and at one point he was created to be twice as strong as Savage Hulk but the thing about this is, Abomination loses to the Hulk because the Hulk is stronger.
Kind of like Tutinax and the Thor fight. Thor has gotten completely DOMINATED by Tutinax twice. Tutinax doesn't have the fts to suggest he could hang with Savage Hulk, let alone WWH who would outright destroy him and ESPECIALLY WBH who would one shot his a**.
I'm trying to understand your argument but its not making any sense. You are trying to use Savage Hulk lowest showings to aid in your argument when the same can be said about almost any character, including Thor.

👆