Originally posted by NemeBro
It was so slow the warp would have been completed within the day had he not been stopped.I don't feel the need to provide a scan, because I honestly can't imagine Mr Master isn't already planning to do so.
And that was just a planetary warp. So should i be impressed that it takes 24hrs for a being some people would rank beyond the Infinity Gauntlet to bring about their complete influence over a planet? 😬
Originally posted by GalacticStorm
And that was just a planetary warp. So should i be impressed that it takes 24hrs for a being some people would rank beyond the Infinity Gauntlet to bring about their complete influence over a planet? 😬
???????? 😕
Any response?
With a snap of the fingers or a thought skyfathers, the IG and the Phoenix are bringing about changes on a similar or far greater scale.
Why should MJJ be ranked higher based on a future vision and the abilities of his alternate reality counterpart when all he did was nearly warp planet earth before he got stomped by the Fury? 😬
Originally posted by GalacticStormI don't get it.
😂Phoenix Force is confirmed on panel to be the Big Bang that is the sum and substance of creation. Its bio also states that it is a multiversal force. Those firebirds are avatars not the sum of the Force as also stated on panel.
HOTI is overrated because Thanos fought the abstracts who themselves are mere fragments of the the universe and each one taps into a portion of the universes power. Great.
White Phoenix Of Crown manipulated the atoms of the universe in her palm thereby wielding considerably greater energies than those contained within said universe.
IG is below HOTI universe. Simple.
Also assuming automatic M-Bodies, and LT taps into a portion of the universes power ftw
Originally posted by Sr J-Bieb
I don't get it.Also assuming automatic M-Bodies, and LT taps into a portion of the universes power ftw
I dont get that response.
But i'll try and respond based on what i think youre saying lol.
These hierarchies are based on power, not who would win in a fight, the most powerful dont always win. Rankings in hierarchies should not be influenced by your ideas on the outcome of a versus match.
See the universe as one sphere of energy for the purposes of explanation.
Each of the abstracts share a bit of that overall spheres power, they all tap into the universes power.
Thanos beating those abstracts is impressive as is absorbing all of that energy in his great feat of power.
However what the White Phoenix did was manipulate that sphere of energy at the atomic level and materialize it in her palm thereby wielding considerably greater energies than those contained within said sphere. Thanos fighting those little abstracts, those little facets of that sphere is like me or you watching over a sandbox of fighting ants in comparison.
Then think about the Phoenix Force, not only is reality carved out of its energies as the sentient Big Bang, but it powered not just the White Phoenix, but also the entire Phoenix corps.
The Force is underrated, due to varying showings of its firebird avatars, of which there are many of varying power levels in operation across the multiverse.
Originally posted by GalacticStormYou're saying Thanos is overrated because he beat the most powerful beings in Marvel, while Phoenix isn't because it manipulated a universe.
I dont get that response.But i'll try and respond based on what i think youre saying lol.
These hierarchies are based on power, not who would win in a fight, the most powerful dont always win. Rankings in hierarchies should not be influenced by your ideas on the outcome of a versus match.
See the universe as one sphere of energy for the purposes of explanation.
Each of the abstracts share a bit of that overall spheres power, they all tap into the universes power.
Thanos beating those abstracts is impressive as is absorbing all of that energy in his great feat of power.
However what the White Phoenix did was manipulate that sphere of energy at the atomic level and materialize it in her palm thereby wielding considerably greater energies than those contained within said sphere. Thanos fighting those little abstracts, those little facets of that sphere is like me or you watching over a sandbox of fighting ants in comparison.
Then think about the Phoenix Force, not only is reality carved out of its energies as the sentient Big Bang, but it powered not just the White Phoenix, but also the entire Phoenix corps.
The Force is underrated, due to varying showings of its firebird avatars, of which there are many of varying power levels in operation across the multiverse.
No, they're not based on who would win (actually they pretty much are) but it's hard to say Thanos is less powerful than Phoenix when his feat vastly surpasses it's greatest. Or when it's heavily implied that the HOTU is God's actual power.
Even using your... logic... as an absolute, LT doesn't tap into the universes power. In fact, all of your logic is overridden by LT being there. It stops simply being universal powers assembled when he's there.
And when do we start factoring in that the entire universe fought back, as opposed to it simply doing nothing when Phoenix manipulated it (since I don't want to get into a "baby universe, shit, and more shit" argument)?
Had WPOTC been inside said universe, would it have been able to accomplish the same thing with every being in the universe attacking it? Had Thanos been in the same higher dimensional plane as Jean, do you have doubts he could have done the same thing?
Side note, where would you place Jamie Braddock considering he warped the White Hot Room?
Originally posted by GalacticStormI dont get that response.
But i'll try and respond based on what i think youre saying lol.
These hierarchies are based on power, not who would win in a fight, the most powerful dont always win. Rankings in hierarchies should not be influenced by your ideas on the outcome of a versus match.
See the universe as one sphere of energy for the purposes of explanation.
Each of the abstracts share a bit of that overall spheres power, they all tap into the universes power.
Thanos beating those abstracts is impressive as is absorbing all of that energy in his great feat of power.
However what the White Phoenix did was manipulate that sphere of energy at the atomic level and materialize it in her palm thereby wielding considerably greater energies than those contained within said sphere. Thanos fighting those little abstracts, those little facets of that sphere is like me or you watching over a sandbox of fighting ants in comparison.
Then think about the Phoenix Force, not only is reality carved out of its energies as the sentient Big Bang, but it powered not just the White Phoenix, but also the entire Phoenix corps.
The Force is underrated, due to varying showings of its firebird avatars, of which there are many of varying power levels in operation across the multiverse.
Originally posted by Sr J-BiebYou're saying Thanos is overrated because he beat the most powerful beings in Marvel, while Phoenix isn't because it manipulated a universe.
Makes no sense at all.No, they're not based on who would win (actually they pretty much are) but it's hard to say Thanos is less powerful than Phoenix when his feat vastly surpasses it's greatest. Or when it's heavily implied that the HOTU is God's actual power.
Even using your... logic... as an absolute, LT doesn't tap into the universes power. In fact, all of your logic is overridden by LT being there. It stops simply being universal powers assembled when he's there.
And when do we start factoring in that the entire universe fought back, as opposed to it simply doing nothing when Phoenix manipulated it (since I don't want to get into a "baby universe, shit, and more shit" argument)?Had WPOTC been inside said universe, would it have been able to accomplish the same thing with every being in the universe attacking it? Had Thanos been in the same higher dimensional plane as Jean, do you have doubts he could have done the same thing?
Btw.
ODG and I completely dismantled the whole "holding a universe in her palms" bull shit ...
"dismantling it's component parts" (that was especially funny)
... and/or manipulating even a Timeline directly.
Originally posted by Sr J-BiebSide note, where would you place Jamie Braddock considering he warped the White Hot Room?
He's just gonna drown you in some story how it never happened,
and instead "this happened"
I mean, this should be his quote: ... "who you gonna believe me, or your own two eyes?"
😂
Originally posted by GalacticStorm
😂Phoenix Force is confirmed on panel to be the Big Bang that is the sum and substance of creation. Its bio also states that it is a multiversal force. Those firebirds are avatars not the sum of the Force as also stated on panel.
HOTI is overrated because Thanos fought the abstracts who themselves are mere fragments of the the universe and each one taps into a portion of the universes power. Great.
White Phoenix Of Crown manipulated the atoms of the universe in her palm thereby wielding considerably greater energies than those contained within said universe.
IG is below HOTI universe. Simple.
Like it or not i can give sound reasoning for the rankings 🙂
First I was like 😆 but then I was like 😮
And wth is with this "Phoenix is the Big Bang" crap that keeps popping up on multiple forums? There have been very few to wield the powers of the Big Bang and the Phoenix Force isn't one of them.
Originally posted by CortSether
First I was like 😆 but then I was like 😮And wth is with this "Phoenix is the Big Bang" crap that keeps popping up on multiple forums? There have been very few to wield the powers of the Big Bang and the Phoenix Force isn't one of them.
But it's true. There was a scan where know-it-all Reed equated the PF with the Big Bang.
Originally posted by zopzop
But it's true. There was a scan where know-it-all Reed equated the PF with the Big Bang.
I'll take the on-panel depictions of Reed Richards with the Alien Entity as he recreates all of Marvel with the Big Bang over a brief comment by Reed and a misinformed bio.
Like i said, its no doubt going to take this AvX series confirming the Force as the power behind HofM to get most of you guys to catch on but its all good 🙂
However i'll tackle your points regardless.
Originally posted by Sr J-Bieb
You're saying Thanos is overrated because he beat the most powerful beings in Marvel, while Phoenix isn't because it manipulated a universe.
Makes no sense at all.
Vastly greater how? My example clearly laid out just how inferior the feat was. The abstracts are mere facets of the universe, they tap into the universes power, they are all derivative from the Big Bang. The White Phoenix manipulated all that is the universe all of their very being, all the matter and energy that composes the universe by the atomic level and materialized it in her palm within seconds. At that point, the abstracts became irrelevant, she was tapped into energies which surpass their totality, energies which make up their being anyway. The Phoenix Force empowered Jean Grey to do this, the Phoenix Force also simultaneously powers all reality as the sentient Big Bang as stated on panel and all of the Phoenix Corps.
Makes a whole lotta damn sense.
Originally posted by Sr J-Bieb
No, they're not based on who would win (actually they pretty much are) but it's hard to say Thanos is less powerful than Phoenix when his feat vastly surpasses it's greatest. Or when it's heavily implied that the HOTU is God's actual power.
Nope. Nightcrawler, or Shadowcat could conceivably f*ck up a lot of characters vastly more powerful than them due to the strategic applications of their powers. That does not mean that in a hierarchy of power they should be above said characters.
This hierarchy is about power, look at that thread title. It is NOT about who would win in combat. That is what versus match ups are for. Whilst this criteria is often related, one does not necessarily equal the other. The most powerful will not always win. The weakest will not always lose a fight.
The only person who likens the HOTI power to god is Thanos himself. He made similar ramblings when he wielded the Cosmic Cube and the Infinity Gauntlet. He does it whenever he comes across what he perceives to be a supreme power source beyond his understanding. None of this has ever ever been supported or verified by other characters on panel or by handbooks.
Should i call the Phoenix Force gods power because Jean Grey likened herself to Tiphereth when healing the M'Kraan crystal?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tiferet
Tiphereth the point at which the divine manifests itself in mortal form and also sacrifices its form for the sake of creation?
Should i call the Phoenix Forces power Gods power because the White Hot Room is called "the Crown" and the Phoenix host is connected to its power through the crown?
The Crown is represented by white. (White Hot Room/White Phoenix Of The Crown) It is the realm of superconsciousness and the closest you can get to the Divine. The Crown is also represented on the body as the head and through this the consciousness meets the Divine and the Divine bends the consciousness to its will:
http://www.inner.org/sefirot/sefketer.htm
Should i call the Phoenix Force gods power cos in Secret Avengers the firebird avatar is referred to as a seraph?
(Literally means "burning ones" gods winged fiery angels who bring about Gods Judgement on Earth with a cleansing fire)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Seraph
NO
However as you can see, the Phoenix Force in continuity, on multiple occasions has faaaar more reason to be likened to Gods power than the HOTI.
Originally posted by Sr J-Bieb
Even using your... logic... as an absolute, LT doesn't tap into the universes power. In fact, all of your logic is overridden by LT being there. It stops simply being universal powers assembled when he's there.
Not at all. LT as stated is a conceptual being that utilizes M bodies. Theres one LT entity, however there are many LT m-bodies that he can employ.
The LT Mbody has shown its not infallible.
Its attack has been thwarted by Korvac.
Its power has been re-directed at it by Reed Richards destroying it.
Its Mbody was absorbed by Thanos.
Beating an Mbody or representation is not the same as tackling the entity in its entirety. Beings like LT and the Phoenix are multiversal as stated on panel, a universal manifestation of them does not represent all that they are. They deal with issues on a multiversal scale.
Originally posted by Sr J-Bieb
And when do we start factoring in that the entire universe fought back, as opposed to it simply doing nothing when Phoenix manipulated it (since I don't want to get into a "baby universe, shit, and more shit" argument)?
Irrelevant when you wield considerably greater powers than all that is contained within the universe. The IG by current continuity taps into the energies of the Big Bang and it absolutely stomped all of the abstracts fighting back merely cos it had greater access to said power. White Phoenix taps into those same energies but again on a greater scale as the Phoenix host and she manipulated the whole universe in her palm at an atomic level, rendering little fisticuffs within the little universe irrelevant. 😬
Originally posted by Sr J-Bieb
Had WPOTC been inside said universe, would it have been able to accomplish the same thing with every being in the universe attacking it? Had Thanos been in the same higher dimensional plane as Jean, do you have doubts he could have done the same thing?
Given the considerably greater energy output it would take to manipulate an entire universe at the atomic level as opposed to fighting fragments of said universe then it stands to reason that if it was her desire the WP could completely stomp the abstracts. No single abstract wields the entire universes power, they all have it divided between them. She showed exponentially greater power than any of them individually or as a whole.
We'll never know if Thanos could have done the same thing. However given he never displayed anything as high level or as intricate as that, he gets ranked below. Simple.
Originally posted by Sr J-Bieb
Side note, where would you place Jamie Braddock considering he warped the White Hot Room?
He warped a place of residence, not the entity itself. Jamie Braddock was later pitted against the First Fallen said to be the Phoenixes counterpart and got stomped. I'd place Jamie Braddock below the abstracts.
Originally posted by guy222I know who he is. I am just frightened to mention him.
no one knows bout the goat monk 🙁
He hears EVERYTHING.
😕
And, he's a "goat". They eat garbage you know. Important side-note.
Plus, I don't know enough about the Captain Britain storyline to speak knowledgeably.
I will say that, from what I do know and what I have read, he is a top-level contender in this forum.
Originally posted by Horrificus
I know who he is. I am just frightened to mention him.He hears EVERYTHING.
😕
And, he's a "goat". They eat garbage you know. Important side-note.Plus, I don't know enough about the Captain Britain storyline to speak knowledgeably.
I will say that, from what I do know and what I have read, he is a top-level contender in this forum.
It turned out that the GOat Monk was Jamie Braddock, from the future.
