Originally posted by Jynocidus
this is how I see it. if this doesn't help, then Ima just sit back and see where this thread goes because I can't tolerate this DC judeo god "wankage."The zero factor here is the creators. The writers, artists, TOAA, however you see it.
Now, comes nothing. The blank slate. Chaos King if he won the Chaos War. What everything is created from. The void before creation.
Next, comes plot devices. Not only is this the ultimate energy where everything below this tier draws its energy from, it's also the basis behind how everything in existence functions regardless of mortality. This is...the Source for DC. This source, like all...power in existence, has positive and negative. So out of all the people in "Heaven", this is where Christ and the Anti-Christ are in terms of power, influence, and capability. However, other characters (I suspect Cyttorak) could fall into this category as well. Plot devices don't really fight, or have many showings. Everyone else from the lower tiers use their powers.
After your plot devices, you have your "nigh-omnipotent" beings. And there are 2 classifications of nigh-omnipotent (IMO)
-Absolute: LT moreso (imo) than The Spectre in this scenario. The "perfect" creations. They embody abstract concepts, and can exist independent of megaverses. Every company or continuity typically only has 1, because they....can't be beat. That's why LT says something along the lines of "power beyond mine is meaningless" I think.
-Anomalies: Pre-Retcon Beyonder. All powerful, but not independent of abstract concepts. He got retconned, so I take that (story-wise) as LT's necessity and nigh-omnipotence changing the continuity which is interchangeable with a retcon.
So...with that out of the way, notice how the cosmic hierarchy isn't even mentioned? Yet...I'm wanking Marvel. I could go on and on about how much further down on the list they are, but I'm staying on topic. Just know that for the most part they're not a factor and likely lose. What I'm saying, is that Presence does not exist within nor did it create the LT, so it has no power over it. Yet, the nature of LT's power could give it control over the Presence.
See above how i listed nigh-omnipotent beings are below plot devices? Now, get this. Everytime someone threatens a "plot device," the heroes have to save the day or....most likely the LT will intervene (there have been stories written about it obviously). And even here...Plot Devices are not truly absolute. They can be changed, manipulated, and reformed. That's what LT does, and will do for this battle.
Those same plot devices, should they malfunction, LT can also intervene. There is a NECESSITY for these functions to be in order. I'll go as far to say even writers utilize necessity when putting things into place. When they are not in order, his vengeance (response) is to correct the problem with his power which is equal (equity) if not beyond (there aren't any other absolute characters) anyone elses.
Also, those same plot devices can also be commanded or manipulated. How? By people using their powers at will. Your average character can only manipulate plot devices up to a certain point (like Supes flying and using HV to beat opponents), LT (as the embodiment of necessity, equity, and vengeance) could judge that any given plot device to do whatever he wants, and it is so. Spectre can't do what LT can here, because the source is in him. That source isn't in LT, they're opposing, so his powers of judgement...to me...work on the presence.
LT doesn't work for The Presence, LT works for TOAA. Presence was created by a "TOAA" of a different continuity. Yeah HOTI messed up LT, and yeah Protege "nearly usurped" his power, but Presence got his feminine aspect toyed with (lol) which only says that they both can be lowballed, or victims of a story, as with any other character.
Its not that difficult Jynocidus, in the DCU he is above everything just like in Marvel TOAA is.. Btw he is not in the thread so it does not matter....
🤨
Originally posted by kevdude
Its not that difficult Jynocidus, in the DCU he is above everything just like in Marvel TOAA is.. Btw he is not in the thread so it does not matter....🤨
The Presence is in this thread, by other names
Originally posted by Jynocidus
you all don't think LT could retcon DC?
Not even a little
okay, since everybody is against me here. tell me who this match is really in spite of?
marvel, because LT embodying necessity, equity, and vengeance stomps
or
DC, because this "god" created everything and we just take it for what it is.
i am confused. my initial reaction, is to rely on context and how i generally took the chars as. LT's power should be able to effect Presence here because
1: Presence is a creation....it is required (a necessity) for Presence to operate however the writers portray it at that time. --that says LTs powers have a range that Presence falls within.
2. since the presence is a creation...it is literally a plot device. LT( as equity) has power that can be that potent if need be. Why? Presence DID NOT create LT. Presence isn't the true omnipotent being...
3. as vengeance (a response), LT can react to ANYTHING Presence throws at it. What is presence going to do to LT? there are (necessities) behind any application of presence capabilities. How is Presence going to change what is necessary? Presence can't harm necessity.
Originally posted by Jynocidus
okay, since everybody is against me here. tell me who this match is really in spite of?marvel, because LT embodying necessity, equity, and vengeance stomps
or
DC, because this "god" created everything and we just take it for what it is.
i am confused. my initial reaction, is to rely on context and how i generally took the chars as. LT's power should be able to effect Presence here because
1: Presence is a creation....it is required (a necessity) for Presence to operate however the writers portray it at that time. --that says LTs powers have a range that Presence falls within.
2. since the presence is a creation...it is literally a plot device. LT( as equity) has power that can be that potent if need be. Why? Presence DID NOT create LT. Presence isn't the true omnipotent being...
3. as vengeance (a response), LT can react to ANYTHING Presence throws at it. What is presence going to do to LT? there are (necessities) behind any application of presence capabilities. How is Presence going to change what is necessary? Presence can't harm necessity.
Sometimes, when everyone is telling you that you're saying some of the stupidest stuff they've ever read on these boards, you're actually saying some of the stupidest stuff on these boards.
I've never been one to flame or throw around insults, but your stupidity and lack of basic understanding of these characters is beyond astonishing.