Originally posted by abhilegend
He was banished to the farthest star in the universe which essentialy means the end of the universe since shazam couldn't harm him and it took him 5000 years to come back.
Because its been stated many times. Shazam banished him from entering ROE when he sent him to the farthest star in the universe. But when he died in mortal form and was resurrected by Sivana, the spell was lifted. How do you think he encountered superman on Earth one? He's used it for time-travel too.
context? you saying he can simply stop off at the rock and travel anywhere and anytime he wants? not buying that as anywhere CLOSE to a standard manoeuver for adam.
Originally posted by leonidas
"proofs to the contrary?" please, show all these proofs.lt like any abstract uses an m-body. m-bodies can vary in the amount of power each possesses. perhaps that m-body didn't possess all of lt's powers. whatever. utterly irrelevant to the discussion anyway. as is....most of what you said.
adam and marvel's powers MAY have been the same, but marvel still beat him. superman was still stronger than he was. and moving planets across galaxies then struggling to lift the great pyramid. ridiculous extremes that far exceed in number and scope pis scenes of today. even the classic spidey/fl was partially explained by the author, as was bp's armbar--ss ALLOWED the armbar, as was shown on the next page because he wanted to hear bp out. mcduffie explained it in an interview somewhere as well. but again, not relevant in any way.....
so you never saw him use the rock as a bus stop i take it? he didn't use it when shazam bfr'd him easily enough....
not sure why you think pc supes>>>sbp. in some scenes maybe, in others, not at all. but that's how pc worked--power suited plot. prime was above the others but as was born out not that far above the likes of modern superman. but his defeats will likely be attributed as pis by you....
you are sorta talking out of your arse here. no reason at all to think a bfr wouldn't work 100/100. he has no speed feats that would indicate he could contend with the speed feats of modern day supes and glads. i'm absolutely in agreement that a blow that would drop a charging rhino probably wouldn't stop him but the infinite fallacy revolving around his invulnerablility is ridiculous. you think if he would have run into pc validus that invulnerability would have held up?
there is no reason at all to think ss couldn't simply transmute him aside from you saying the kole incident was pis and since he's really got no combat speed feats, seeing glads and supes use their own speed and power on him in a way that has never happened would truly test that overblown invulnerability as well. i'd love to see him even hitting someone moving at the speed modern characters do. some will simply assume they can do everything better. but that is contrary to what the forum is about. if people want to use the silly uber prtrayals to show how great they are, then the dearth of feats in certain areas and the lesser feats of those same characters are also fair game.
Originally posted by leonidas
context for his using the rock. lots of times? pc? or even current, whatever. when? ss uses bfr when it's necessary--which it probably wouldn't be here.
Originally posted by abhilegend
Mr. Invincible was an android used by mr. Mind and was exactly as powerful as the scan says your speculations notwithstanding. Marvel didn't beat him directly, earth one where that issue of DCP happened slowly sapped marvels' power like a red sun did to superman. That's why he was completely unaffected to cap's blows in Earth-S. Can you show me this instance of superman struggling to lift a pyramid? I remember that was because red sun rays from a distant sun reached earth and weakened him. I did see him using ROE to reach earth one and time travelling. He would just return using ROE. Except he was FTL and flew across the universe. Cap has his strength feats too like moving a planet bigger than earth across several solar system and he couldn't harm him at all in Earth-S. Yeah, on earth-s it would. That's why they made a loophole that outside their own universe marvels start getting weaker. Except that its PIS or he wasn't on Earth-S when that transmutation happened and he was FTL too. You have a low showing for adam? Pray tell us about it.
soooo....still nothing for adam as regards feats? no scan that says he is 'invulnerable' to all harm?
and I'M speculating? 😂 really? you said he was powered by THE BIG BANG! that's actually carver-esque in it's falsity. he TAPPED (an unspecified amount of power) from a 'mass of matter' lol that seemed powerful. that's it. nothing more nothing less.
well, according to you a low showing is the kole showing but i don't see it as pis at all. ibis handled him effortlessly even though shazam was forced to bfr him somehow. supes was stronger than him. supes and marvel smacked him around. maybe not a low showing there, but had he not fled they would have taken him out for sure--so much for his being invulnerable.....
anyhow, my point stands--there is no reason--certainly nothing on panel--that would suggest the trio can't beat him in this fight. true, he is likely stronger than glads and supes, but their speed combat feats would make up for that. couple in ss's versatility and i don't see adam having a chance here. the dearth of feats he has would be more than enough to cripple most characters in the forum, but because he is "pc" he is automatically assumed to be uber. that is blatantly false.
Originally posted by abhilegend
First time he used it to go to earth one in the guise of cap and attacked superman. Second time to escape cap and landed in past and again to attack the batsons before billy was born. He's used it two times more. Yeah, because adam is going to kill him very soon.
be cool to see that..... and ss transmutes him before he ever gets the chance to do anything.
lol
yeah, i didn't bring that one up already..... 🙄 actually, with all the crying about pis in this thread, i think i'll call THAT pis. show the scans of a depowered pc superman and marvel slapping him around why don't ya....? or the one where superman is shown to be stronger. or how about kole transmuting him? no? don't like those so they didn't happen? all pis cuz....they don't fit your preconceived notion of what a pc character should be? what about all the combat speed feats and transmutation resistant feats? wanna show those?
hrm. i stand corrected. adam clearly wins. 😂 i don't understand the infatuation with pc guys. the amount of evidence lacking here is laughable and would condemn any non-pc character. if the proof is out there SHOW IT! i'll happily concede, as i've done in the past when proven wrong. but if you're not going to SHOW something, stop telling me how awesome he is, and stop perpetuating this ludicrous myth that he is 'teh invulnerable!!!1!" infinite fallacy for the fail.
Originally posted by leonidas
lolyeah, i didn't bring that one up already..... 🙄 actually, with all the crying about pis in this thread, i think i'll call THAT pis. show the scans of a depowered pc superman and marvel slapping him around why don't ya....? or the one where superman is shown to be stronger. or how about kole transmuting him? no? don't like those so they didn't happen? all pis cuz....they don't fit your preconceived notion of what a pc character should be? what about all the combat speed feats and transmutation resistant feats? wanna show those?
hrm. i stand corrected. adam clearly wins. 😂 i don't understand the infatuation with pc guys. the amount of evidence lacking here is laughable and would condemn any non-pc character. if the proof is out there SHOW IT! i'll happily concede, as i've done in the past when proven wrong. but if you're not going to SHOW something, stop telling me how awesome he is, and stop perpetuating this ludicrous myth that he is 'teh invulnerable!!!1!" infinite fallacy for the fail.
Feats show that he has true invulnerability. I mean SHAZAM did say he couldn't affect Adam. And are the 3 here more powerful than SHAZAM? Didn't think so.
Originally posted by Prep-Man
Feats show that he has true invulnerability. I mean SHAZAM did say he couldn't affect Adam. And are the 3 here more powerful than SHAZAM? Didn't think so.
except he did--he bfr'd him.
so, pc supes+marvel>>shazam? cuz they handled him easily. depowered supes>adam, therefore supes>>>shazam? kole CLEARLY>>>>shazam.
well thought out logic. way to choose a SINGLE feat and apply it across the board. anyway, i got 3 feats to your one. guess what that makes YOUR single feat....? 🙂
oh, and true invulnerability--what does that mean exactly again? and where does it end? how about validus? darkseid's omega effect? he should have simply tooled the anti-monitor himself apparently......
ludicrous.
Originally posted by leonidas
except he did--he bfr'd him.so, pc supes+marvel>>shazam? cuz they handled him easily. depowered supes>adam, therefore supes>>>shazam? kole CLEARLY>>>>shazam.
well thought out logic. way to choose a SINGLE feat and apply it across the board. anyway, i got 3 feats to your one. guess what that makes YOUR single feat....? 🙂
Through force and magic. BFR was his only option. IF Surfer does that, then he can win. Other than that, he can't. Stop crying about it.
And we have stated more than one feat. Deal.
Originally posted by leonidas
i swear, i thought it was just me. i seem to have gone all 'rant-y' but damn, that kind of perpetuated nonsense is ludicrous. people come here to get info--ACCURATE info.we are men of action--lies do not become us. 🙂
The thing is, anyone who calls the Pre-Crisis feats or era under suspect get accused of being biased against DC or whatever and that's not really fair or true. And it doesn't make sense to write off every absurd high feat a PC character does as "the norm" but then disregard everything else as PIS. Hell, if we're honest, a lot of those high end feats are blatantly PIS. Like you said, the powers or scope of them suited the plot, which, last time I checked, was essentially the definition of plot induced stupidity.