Superman vs Alan Scott

Started by abhilegend7 pages

Alan is a glass canon, if this goes h2h which it would go rather quickly, its over for him. Anyway split IMO, superman is vulnerable to magic and everyone in comics is vulnerable to punches. Alan likely has no counter for Kal's speed, a possesed Jay beat the shit out of him. Oh and superman has outperformed alan against an Ion fueled Alex nero IIRC. For superman's magic resistance

Physically restrains blaze and tanks a magical blast that tore her to pieces

The best thing about this, his powers were being sapped by that magical dimension

Originally posted by Cogito
This isn't about a magic weakness/lack of invulnerability.

This is about Alan being boss. Also it's about Alan being more powerful.

Originally posted by JakeTheBank
It's a significant factor. Tbh, I don't see how it can be viewed otherwise.
Agreed.

Originally posted by Cogito
Superman is THE boss.

Originally posted by abhilegend
everyone in comics is vulnerable to punches.

I still go with Alan, especailly since he got a big push before the reboot.

Originally posted by biensalsa
It greatly depends on the level of power behind those punches.

Originally posted by abhilegend
Superman is THE boss.

Superman's Tony Danza?

Originally posted by OneDumbG0
And, no, Hulk has never been one-shotted by Thor's lightning. Another stupid forum myth.

😗

Originally posted by OneDumbG0
Second, not the first shot from behind. Captain Marvel was edging Superman out in straight H2H. And, no, I'm not talking about when Billy sucker punched him. And we're talking about Zeus. Not some high herald who receives a portion of Zeus' power on loan. Somehow you think an actual skyfather with his magic lightning raining about and amping his fists would find Superman resisting him? smh

And, no, Hulk has never been one-shotted by Thor's lightning. Another stupid forum myth.

Where has Captain Marvel edged-out Superman in straight hand-to-hand without sucker-punching? Are you talking about SUPERMAN/BATMAN #4(I think)? If so, that was a statement that magick gave Captain Marvel the edge "toe-to-toe," but that's not what we actually SEE, is it? To top it off, Superman was in less than peak condition due to Kryptonite, numerous fights and partial solar drain.

Originally posted by Delta1938

😗

Thor didn't even use his hammer to summon that lightning either.

Originally posted by biensalsa
In all the comics I have Magic is sometimes mentioned as a "weakness" and then right at the very next panel Superman is fine.

The Captain Marvel where he say "CM has the advantage because of his magic" proves this. As everybody knows Superman won the fight.

And what was mentioned of Superman never feeling magical lighting like that before it proves just that He never felt lighting like that before, that's it and nothing else.

If Superman were WEAK to magic, then that Thunder should have killed him as it will kill a normal human, but it did not.

Superman is not weak to magic, he is vulnerable to it as almost everybody is, with it's degrees.

Magic is not a big factor in here. IMO, Evidence is there and plenty of it.

Superman did not win that initial H2H fight in Superman/Batman. Superman's cuts, bruises and stark admission evince that.

Superman being weak to magic doesn't necessitate that he's as weak as a normal defenseless human being to it. That I've had to address this blatant false dichotomy multiple times only reveals how shallow of a counter-argument there actually is here and the paucity of evidence being relied on. Acting like Superman's weakness to magic is an all or nothing affair doesn't disprove that he is weaker to magic than his peers.

Magic is a significant factor. It has been in almost every single instance where Superman confronts magic. That is the plain, clear interpretation that has been spoonfed for decades of Superman comics for virtually all of his incarnations from the oldest to the newest. Acting otherwise is convenient pandering and bonethrowing at its best. At its worse, its blundering incompetence. The comics cannot be clearer.

Originally posted by Delta1938
http://i1199.photobucket.com/albums/aa466/Delta1938/Thor%20VS%20Hulk/HulkANN2001_19a.jpg

😗

Try posting the previous pages where Thor is fighting Hulk. That lightning bolt was not the one thing that Thor hit Hulk with during that fight. Accordingly, it was not a one shot, it was the last shot. This forum myth of Thor one-shotting Hulk with lightning is as ignorant as the forum myth that Superman isn't anymore weak to magic than anyone else.
Originally posted by Delta1938
Where has Captain Marvel edged-out Superman in straight hand-to-hand without sucker-punching? Are you talking about SUPERMAN/BATMAN #4(I think)? If so, that was a statement that magick gave Captain Marvel the edge "toe-to-toe," but that's not what we actually SEE, is it? To top it off, Superman was in less than peak condition due to Kryptonite, numerous fights and partial solar drain.
How you ignore Superman's cut up face (and Billy's lack of) just as he makes that clear statement is beyond me. Reread the comic and don't waste my time. That you'd argue against me is one thing, that you'd argue against Superman's own statements and fights is something wholly different.

the page itself even has hulk say he's "not finished fighting Long-hair", pretty much idiot proofing (unsuccessfully) the out of context scan.

Now cuts and bruises determine that who wins a fight! Magic affects superman but his durability is so high that it seems to be on the same degree as everybody else.

Originally posted by psycho gundam
the page itself even has hulk say he's "not finished fighting Long-hair", pretty much idiot proofing (unsuccessfully) the out of context scan.
I know the idea that a ko attack which was preceded by other attacks suddenly becomes a oneshot is just deliberately being deceitful.

It's actually complicated. Magic will affect Superman greater than HIS EQUAL in durability. But mostly Superman is already more durable than many of his peers. Thus magic affecting both him and someone with lower durability can possibly result in the similar damage.

Like the wise Digi said, magic should only be brought up if the fight is near even anyway. Then the edge should go to the magic user. But if Superman already wins a solid majority over someone then magic may not sway the fact that Superman wins a slight majority or at least earns a split.

I'm not familiar with Alan's top feats. So with respect and kindness may someone tell me of his best combat speed and reflex feats or feats relevant to combat. And also tell me of his top durability feats as well.

Originally posted by OneDumbG0
Superman did not win that initial H2H fight in Superman/Batman. Superman's cuts, bruises and stark admission evince that.

Superman being weak to magic doesn't necessitate that he's as weak as a normal defenseless human being to it. That I've had to address this blatant false dichotomy multiple times only reveals how shallow of a counter-argument there actually is here and the paucity of evidence being relied on. Acting like Superman's weakness to magic is an all or nothing affair doesn't disprove that he is weaker to magic than his peers.

Magic is a significant factor. It has been in almost every single instance where Superman confronts magic. That is the plain, clear interpretation that has been spoonfed for decades of Superman comics for virtually all of his incarnations from the oldest to the newest. Acting otherwise is convenient pandering and bonethrowing at its best. At its worse, its blundering incompetence. The comics cannot be clearer.

I read all that but all I saw was this:

Originally posted by OneDumbG0
Waaaaahhh!!!! I don't like Superman's showings vs magic because they are stupid

Plain and simple

^ Irony. Because this is quite fitting:

Originally posted by biensalsa
Waaaaahhh!!!! I don't like Superman's showings vs magic because they are stupid
You don't like that Superman is vulnerable to magic then deal with it. Stop pretending that he isn't. It's tired and it's sad.

But by all means, keep shoveling the sh1tty false dichotomy as the frequency you've offered it has made clear it's the best argument you've all got. In which case, so tired. So sad.

😬

ODG's point seems pretty clear to me.

Magic isn't an auto-win against Superman, but it is a significant factor, especially when dealing with the level of magic power Alan wields.

I really don't see how anyone can deny that or claim that it won't be a significant factor in this fight. Alan's not some random Joe Schmoe with a magic wand or something simple like that. The source of his power is literally the combined raw and chaotic magical energy the Guardians collected and sealed away eons ago and likely one of the most potent source of mystical energy in the DCU.

How something like the Starheart or its potency isn't a significant factor in this fight is beyond me, tbh, unless of course this has gone off topic and the conversation has turned into Superman vs. magic in general.

Originally posted by OneDumbG0
^ Irony. Because this is quite fitting: You don't like that Superman is vulnerable to magic then deal with it. Stop pretending that he isn't. It's tired and it's sad.

But by all means, keep shoveling the sh1tty false dichotomy as the frequency you've offered it has made clear it's the best argument you've all got. In which case, so tired. So sad.

Vulnerable as many comic book characters, and We return to the original point.

No one ever mentions magic vulnerability when the thread involves other character than Superman.

The evidence has been shown to you, at this point you are clearly dismissing the evidence.

You want more evidence? Nah, never mind, you are gonna start crying again.