Nephthys, you still can't establish in your side-topic that Vitiate can dominate Windu's mind, when he fails to break Revan after three centuries of probing. And IDK what unique technique Revan could have developed in the few hours he had regained his memories to counter the Emperor's mind domination. It sounds more like a "I'm more powerful and prepared now" thing.
Originally posted by Nephthys
The energies that he prepared would have been used in the Force Wave. Why would he not do so and flatten Revan against a wall if he had truly prepared so much energy?Besides which I don't think its even possible to use the Force in that manner.
It probably speaks to how very not cosmic Vitiate really is, given that fact.
Originally posted by Nephthys
If theres evidence on one side and none of the other, then there isn't even an argument. You have nothing by speculation. You have no argument.
Asserting that I have nothing but Karpyshyn's say-so on the matter is a flat-out lie. I've been posting excerpts and passages from Revan and various texts wherein Vitiate's proclivity for using preparation, rituals, and traps to achieve his end have been emphasized. I've presented them to you, Janus, Nai, Beefy, and God knows who else. And I've done it for a while.
The fact of the matter is that the guy who wrote the damn book and contributed extensively to the game came out and explicitly confirmed my interpretation. That's utterly damning in the face of your implications.
tl;dr: my implications + confirmation > your implications + nothing.
Originally posted by Nephthys
That he didn't actually take over his mind is irrelevant. If he can cripple opponents so easily then he doesn't need to, or he can do so while they're writhing in pain. He still mentally pwned him with ease extremely quickly. It doesn't make sense that he can use his mental powers like that so easily and require prep and a ritual to corrupt.Scourge would have felt him preparing his power if that were true. 😬
According to your friend Karpyshan, its only a matter of will, right? So his will would have resisted him anyway, heh. Or tried to at least.
That he caused anguish to Scourge "easily" isn't proof that he can do it to anyone (including Windu) as much as the Emperor's repulsion of Vima Da Boda is proof that he can do that to anyone.
Originally posted by Nephthys
What arrogant bullshit. My interpretation is approved by the sources I've quotes and the arguments I've made, neither of which you so much as attempted to dispute. By his own admission, Karpyshans reply that Intrepid posted is non-official and non-canon. It is that which is irrelevant. Meanwhile the canon sources that support my argument are the only actually relevant factors.
What dishonest bullshit. Your interpretation is a collection of naked implications that in no way contradicts my own argument. It is approved by no one, otherwise you could just post the excerpt that says Yep, Vitiate can PWN ANYONE ANYWHERE ANYTIME LOL! and be done with it.
My argument is the product of quotes and passages from various texts that has been affirmed by the guy who wrote one and contributed to the game.
Originally posted by Nephthys
Also stop saying that the SWTORE and the codex are in-game without proof.
I'll upload a pic about the encyclopedia soon.
Originally posted by Nephthys
I have no idea what you're talking about. If I did make that argument, perhaps I just changed my mind on the subject. I'm allowed to do that.
Then I accept your concession about Palpatine's alleged Byss ritual.
No bro, Vitiate gets prep and thus annihilates the team.
Originally posted by The_Tempest
Asserting that I have nothing but Karpyshyn's say-so on the matter is a flat-out lie. I've been posting excerpts and passages from Revan and various texts wherein Vitiate's proclivity for using preparation, rituals, and traps to achieve his end have been emphasized. I've presented them to you, Janus, Nai, Beefy, and God knows who else. And I've done it for a while.
I said you had nothing but speculation and have offered no evidence, not just Karpyshan's say-so. And that Vitiate has a 'proclivity' for prep, says nothing about the actual subject we are discussing. On the subject of the actual technique you've offered nothing that I've seen or can recall. All you've done is deny canon sources and trump Karpyshans worthless opinion.
If, however, you do have something to base your theory on, nows the time I guess.
Originally posted by The_Tempest
The fact of the matter is that the guy who wrote the damn book and contributed extensively to the game came out and explicitly confirmed my interpretation. That's utterly damning in the face of your implications.tl;dr: my implications + confirmation > your implications + nothing.
Lol. 'Utterly damning'? Thats a mite strong. The guy bases this 'confirmation' on events that don't actually occur and contradicts what he himself has written. And he admits its not canon or official. It is meaningless and I pay it no mind whatsoever.
Originally posted by The_Tempest
That he caused anguish to Scourge "easily" isn't proof that he can do it to anyone (including Windu) as much as the Emperor's repulsion of Vima Da Boda is proof that he can do that to anyone.
Vima Da Boda could barely feel the Force, it faded away from her after her brush with the dark side, whereas Scourge is a powerful Sith Lord. Although I wonder if it would indeed affect others so strongly. After all, it doesn't seem to be the strength of his mind that hurts Scourge, but what he sees there:
"Scourge cried out in anguish as the Emperor’s mind brushed against his, then he collapsed to the floor, shaking like a child. The touch lasted less than a second, but in that time he witnessed indescribable horrors that dwarfed anything the dark side could conjure even in his worst nightmares. And beneath the formless terrors lurked the unbearable Void, the pure emptiness of total annihilation."
So I wonder, who could remain stoic in the face of that.
But you miss my point, which is that he's shown that he can invade anothers mind swiftly and without effort.
Originally posted by The_Tempest
What dishonest bullshit. Your interpretation is a collection of naked implications that in no way contradicts my own argument.
You're stressing the term 'implication' on my part. Quite hypocritical considering your own argument has little and less to go on than that. They're not even real implications, two sources confirm that all one needs do is get 'too close to him' for his corrupting influence to take effect. The fact that it takes only a fraction of his power to dominate Revan and Malak shows that he doesn't rely on rituals or prep. That he has 'incalculable powers of corruption', that its credited to 'His corrupting influence' and that its 'his power' that turns so many Jedi precludes a ritual and the way he is able to unleash his mind on Scourge and Revan without prep shows he doesn't need that either.
Oh, and all of that does contradict your argument.
Originally posted by The_Tempest
It is approved by no one, otherwise you could just post the excerpt that says Yep, Vitiate can PWN ANYONE ANYWHERE ANYTIME LOL! and be done with it.
I'd rather not. Like you, I think that if we were to take it that literally then its probably an exaggeration?
I will if you make me though. >:[ I may personally think its rather non-sensical and dumb, but who am I to argue with a canon quote?
(by 'make me' I mean by being a stubborn butt and not recognizing anything I say as valid, not as a general threat or something) >:[
And why does the matter of someone recognising that he can perform his mind attackz without a ritual or prep mean that I could post that excerpt? The two are rather unrelated in my mind.
Originally posted by The_Tempest
My argument is the product of quotes and passages from various texts that has been affirmed by the guy who wrote one and contributed to the game.
Maybe you should post those quotes then.
Originally posted by The_Tempest
I'll upload a pic about the encyclopedia soon.
Cool.
Originally posted by The_Tempest
Then I accept your concession about Palpatine's alleged Byss ritual.
I said maybe. I'm not saying anything that you can use against me in later arguments and I'm sick or you restarting past ones so you can b*tch me out over them. :C
:I
''The Sith Emperor has mastered the dark side’s power to become the most dominating Force-user the galaxy has ever seen. His corrupting influence is so complete that none can stand in his presence without succumbing to fear, anger and hatred. The Emperor can wither and ruin even the strongest Jedi’s connection to the light side. Jedi Master Tol Braga’s strike team was not the first group to succumb to the Sith leader’s oppressive influence. Hundreds of years ago, the Jedi Revan and Malak discovered Dromund Kaas and confronted the Emperor. They fell to the dark side and returned to Republic space as Sith Lords. Since then, dozens more Jedi have followed the same path into evil.'
