What you don't seem to get is there is a very real difference between electrical discharge/projected electricity and actual lightning striking from the sky.
Even if he is blasting magic lightning or electricity, that doesn't mean it's at real deal lightning speeds.
Do you understand? You can't just say it's lightning speed when you can't prove it.
Originally posted by KingD19
Even if he is blasting magic lightning or electricity, that doesn't mean it's at real deal lightning speeds.Do you understand? You can't just say it's lightning speed when you can't prove it.
You can't ignore the feat without disproving it. Because evidence supports it. You need evidence now to debunk it. Understand?
Originally posted by ScreamPaste
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=e9KZOChSxvU
That's not even remotely as fast as lightning.
Heck, if anything that battle hurts your argument more then helps it because the magic balls that can be reflected are clearly different from the electric attack.
Originally posted by ares834
That's not even remotely as fast as lightning.Heck, if anything that battle hurts your argument more then helps it because the magic balls that can be reflected are clearly different from the electric attack.
I don't see how this hurts my argument, either, since I didn't claim Link did deflect it in that fight. The fight where it all comes together is the one in OoT. When Link doesn't have to deflect it, it behaves like full speed lightning.
Originally posted by ScreamPaste
Because he charges it? It still only takes 1 frame for it to travel across the entire screen. It's not there then it is.
A blatant lie.
And this is merely from me clicking start and stop. I'm undoubtedly missing some frames.
So yeah, way slower than real lightning.
Originally posted by ScreamPaste
I don't see how this hurts my argument, either, since I didn't claim Link did deflect it in that fight. The fight where it all comes together is the one in OoT. When Link doesn't have to deflect it, it behaves like full speed lightning.
Because he uses an attack that looks and acts in a similar method to Ganondorf's supposed "lightning". And that attack is completely different from the electric attack.
Originally posted by ScreamPaste
So Ganon.
No, Ganon possessing Anagrams body. It isn't the same thing.
Originally posted by ScreamPaste
It didn't even look like that when I watched it with the 3D on on the 3DS. Looks like a flash to me.
Not to me and ares. Why would there be a flash anyway? Is Ganon's hand just flashing? There isn't a flash whenever else he uses a magic attack.
Either way, its too ambiguous to prove either way. It relies completely on the viewers interpretation. Thus it cannot be used as evidence.
Originally posted by ScreamPaste
Read what I said.
"that OoT Link deals with consistent lightning from multiple enemies across two games,"
Goht and Barinade ring any bells? Ganondorf himself? It should be noted Phantom Ganon, who [b]actually does use something that is not lightning has none of Ganondorf's lightning animations or graphics tied to his fight. Those were made exclusively for Ganondorf himself.IE, in universe distinction between regular magical blasts and lightning blasts. [/b]
Goht's 'lightning' is green. 😬 And floats around its body in black clouds. Obviously not lightning.
Barinade uses static electricity of some sort that shoots out of it in slow moving columns and there isn't a point where Link has to react to it.
Ganon never uses actual lightning.
Originally posted by ScreamPaste
...😐 You're trying [b]really hard to ignore what the game is rendering here. [/b]
I'm trying really hard to explain the difference between magic and lightning to you, yes.
Originally posted by ScreamPaste
I didn't think I missed any. You've basically turned this into multiple different ways for you to say"This isn't lightning. That isn't. That either! They all just /look/ like lightning and use all the tell tale signs of electrocution."
I'm only saying it so many times because you keep posting examples that aren't actually lightning.
But you ignored how I pointed out that lightning rarely moves at its full speed in fiction. You've yet to prove why it is that this attack must be as fast as a real lightning strike. All you have ever said it 'this looks like lightning' without ever proving why it must follow on that its as fast as you say.
Cole uses lightning all the time, yet it isn't as fast as real lightning.
Azula throws actual lightning bolts around, which clearly are not actual lightning-speed.
Sasuke spams lightning jutsu constantly, yet its contrasted in the story with actual lightning as being vastly inferior in speed.
Etc etc.
As King said:
What you don't seem to get is there is a very real difference between electrical discharge/projected electricity and actual lightning striking from the sky.
Even if he is blasting magic lightning or electricity, that doesn't mean it's at real deal lightning speeds.
Do you understand? You can't just say it's lightning speed when you can't prove it.'
Originally posted by ScreamPaste
YouTube video
2:07. Like, y'know, lightning.
Oh mai gawd, like, this totally isn't lightning either. It, like, isn't even that fast and like, it totally flshes green, orange and purple. Totally magic.
Originally posted by ScreamPaste
u wot m8. No, this is not my opinion, it's very clear what it 'resembles'. You don't accidentally make lightning bolt graphics. Further more this can be said about any feat. Oh, it's only my opinion that Dante's weapon, Rebellion, looks like a big sword. It's actually a styrofoam wifflebat. See how effective that line of reasoning is? Not very.
Indeed, it very clearly resembles a magical spell of some sort and thats exactly what it is. It does not resemble a bolt of lightning. Its. F*cking. Sparkling. The colors are way off. Its covered in some black cloud of some sort. Its resembles fire at some points. Its obviously not lightning.
Originally posted by ScreamPaste
What does it resemble to you, then? Because all I can see there is lightning.
It looks like some crazy ass magical spell.
Originally posted by ScreamPaste
I'm interested in this too. Tell us what you think the artist rendered in this image. Explain why, using this image, you think that what Agahnim is or isn't what you say it is.
No-one is replying to this when they should be. Lightning doesn't sparkle people. Inform Scream of his lunacy so we can smother him with popular opinion!
Originally posted by ares834
A blatant lie.And this is merely from me clicking start and stop. I'm undoubtedly missing some frames.
So yeah, way slower than real lightning.
Because he uses an attack that looks and acts in a similar method to Ganondorf's supposed "lightning". And that attack is completely different from the electric attack.
Regardless, what's being rendered here is still fairly obvious.
No, Ganon possessing Anagrams body. It isn't the same thing.Uhm, wat? Just gonna ignore Ganon's own word on this, huh?
Not to me and ares. Why would there be a flash anyway? Is Ganon's hand just flashing? There isn't a flash whenever else he uses a magic attack.Even discounting this it's just tertiary. We still have art of Link doing it, it being in Ganon's powerset, and no counter to them playing tennis with it in OoT.Either way, its too ambiguous to prove either way. It relies completely on the viewers interpretation. Thus it cannot be used as evidence.
Goht's 'lightning' is green. erm And floats around its body in black clouds. Obviously not lightning.Barinade uses static electricity of some sort that shoots out of it in slow moving columns and there isn't a point where Link has to react to it.
Ganon never uses actual lightning.
I'm trying really hard to explain the difference between magic and lightning to you, yes.
I'm only saying it so many times because you keep posting examples that aren't actually lightning.
You have not once proven they are not lightning. If it looks like lightning it's what? Fish?
But you ignored how I pointed out that lightning rarely moves at its full speed in fiction. You've yet to prove why it is that this attack must be as fast as a real lightning strike. All you have ever said it 'this looks like lightning' without ever proving why it must follow on that its as fast as you say.
Cole specifically uses special attacks with lightning that behave in specific, non-arching-electricity ways.
I don't even know who Azula is
and we don't have anything in Zelda that shows Ganon's lightning as inferior to naturally occuring lightning.
So of your three examples out of this huuuuge phenomenon in fiction (lel) only one of these can't be easily accounted for off the top of my head, because I don't know who Azula is.
Not once is Ganon's lightning shown as being inferior in universe.
Oh mai gawd, like, this totally isn't lightning either. It, like, isn't even that fast and like, it totally flshes green, orange and purple. Totally magic.It came out of his hands, of course it is magic, but to sum up your argument:
"ZOMG IT FLASHES"
Uhm, yeah, lightning attack flashes.
It does not resemble a bolt of lightning. Its. F*cking. Sparkling. The colors are way off. Its covered in some black cloud of some sort. Its obviously not lightning.
It looks like some crazy ass magical spell.
Inform Scream of his lunacy so we can smother him with popular opinion!
Originally posted by Nephthys
How about no?
I see lightning in one picture, you see red in another. In one of them you argue that there is no lightning. We're essentially at the point where we're arguing what we see. We're basically at the point of something called qualia.
Prove the square is red.
Edit: Yes, I am technically aware that red can be proven to exist on the electromagnetic spectrum. But this is way simpler and more appropriate.
No the bare bones of our conflict is that you thinking 'Ok, so its magical lightning, and while magic by definition is unnatural and in many cases behaves strangely, I'm going to erroneously believe that magical lightning possesses the same natural properties as naturally-occuring lightning.'
The only time when we're disagreeing that it resembles lightning is in that last picture. Which doesn't look like lightning in the first place. Everything else I've said is magical lightning or possibly ball lightning in that OoT Ganon fight.
No the bare bones of our conflict is that you thinking 'Ok, so its magical lightning, and while magic by definition is unnatural and in many cases behaves strangely, I'm going to erroneously believe that magical lightning possesses the same natural properties as naturally-occuring lightning.'
The only time when we're disagreeing that it resembles lightning is in that last picture. Which doesn't look like lightning in the first place.
See, this doesn't compute to me, the first time I saw it my mind was like "hey, that's Link, Agahnim, and lightning." I just can't see anything else there.
'Ok, so its magical lightning, and while magic by definition is unnatural and in many cases behaves strangely, I'm going to erroneously believe that magical lightning possesses the same natural properties as naturally-occuring lightning.
You're assigning attributes to it that are not apparent.
Originally posted by ScreamPaste
So then you're agreeing it does resemble lightning in aLttP and OoT?
I've said where I agree it looks like lightning, except obviously with magical properties like being green.
Originally posted by ScreamPaste
See, this doesn't compute to me, the first time I saw it my mind was like "hey, that's Link, Agahnim, and lightning." I just can't see anything else there.
Its 3 different colors. And its got those bizarre sparkles. You call those sparks? They're giant sparkles. And it definately looks like fire at where it meets the floor. Also lightning wouldn't impact like that.
Originally posted by ScreamPaste
There's no instance of it behaving strangely here and it demonstrates the properties of actual lightning. It forks and arcs and electrocutes and it's hot and it's bright.You're assigning attributes to it that are not apparent.
I actually spluttered when I read this. You are the one assigning it attributes that are not apparent! I.E its ****ing speed. It magical lightning. You have to prove that its as fast as actual lightning. You can't just assume that it has it. Its magic, you can't assume anything. It doesn't move at lightning-speeds in the game. If we're really going by whats apparent, thats as apparent as it gets.
And what about when its shaped like a goddamn ball? You still act as if its as fast as a lightning bolt despite it actually resembling ball lightning.
Originally posted by Nephthys
I've said where I agree it looks like lightning, except obviously with magical properties like being green.Its 3 different colors. And its got those bizarre sparkles. You call those [b]sparks
? They're giant sparkles. And it definately looks like fire at where it meets the floor. Also lightning wouldn't impact like that.I actually spluttered when I read this. You are the one assigning it attributes that are not apparent! I.E its ****ing speed. It magical lightning. You have to prove that its as fast as actual lightning. You can't just assume that it has it. Its magic, you can't assume anything. It doesn't move at lightning-speeds in the game. If we're really going by whats apparent, thats as apparent as it gets.
And what about when its shaped like a goddamn ball? You still act as if its as fast as a lightning bolt despite it actually resembling ball lightning. [/B]
They certainly don't resemble glitter. Yes, it sets the floor on fire, because lightning is hot.
Wait, what? You're the one assigning attributes to it not inherent to lightning while discussing lightning. Looks like a duck, quacks like a duck. It's a duck. "It's magic so it's different" not only doesn't hold up if you can't support it, it actually ceases to make sense at all when you realize you're essentially arguing Ganondorf magically engineered slow lightning just to **** himself over. You do see the problem there, right?
And the only time it takes ball form is when the player has to deflect it, in gameplay. Do you want little sideways Z's flying across the screen? 😬
