Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
Wait. It was WORSE than IM3? Can't believe it.
It was a bigger disappointment, not worse. IM3 had too many force jokes, the Mandarin twist that wasted the entire build up, and a bunch of useless IM armor that did mostly nothing.
Age of Ultron had even more forced humor, a weak villain, too many characters handled poorly, jumbled fight scenes, messy plot, forced love, and too plot holes.
Originally posted by WhiteWitchKing
It was a bigger disappointment, not worse. IM3 had too many force jokes, the Mandarin twist that wasted the entire build up, and a bunch of useless IM armor that did mostly nothing.Age of Ultron had even more forced humor, a weak villain, too many characters handled poorly, jumbled fight scenes, messy plot, forced love, and too plot holes.
Ultron written correctly is a force that destroy the Avengers. It's an AI that can hack the worlds armaments and build a physical form that could content with the big guns of the Avengers. Yet, they nerfed him hard.
Why Ultron was a such a disappointment:
1. Ultron was too human for my taste. The whole Transformer face thing was unnecessary waste of money. Maybe they could have that for the early form. The prime could have been just like those drones and it would have been just fine. And why does Ultron even need teeth? He looked just out right stupid.
2. His built up was just lazy. He just went evil. His motivation wasn't there. His just wanted to end humanity after being born. They should have given him more time to flesh out his thoughts and motivation.
3. His plan was far fetch. Rockets to rip a city off the ground and drop it back on earth?
4. He didn't even bother to hack Iron Man at all. Not sure why that was.
5. His drones were even less of a threat than the Chitauris. I forget, did they even hurt anyone? The Chituaris at one point actually held down Hulk and hurt Cap.
6. Ultron was weak. I loved it when he used some kind of magnetic powers to pull Iron Man forward and blasted him. Aside from that, he barely did anything except acted like a brute. Being an advanced AI with Hydra weapon and vast knowledge, the writers could have given him sonics and disintigrator breams to play with. What we get is an Ultron that mostly displays brute force in weak shell. Did he even get a vibranium body? An Ultron that absorbed Thor's hammer strikes and lightning strike to power himself would have been scary. That fight between Hulkbuster and Hulk could have been taken out and replaced with a vibranium Ultron vs Hulk. That would have built Ultron's status that would require the Avengers to come up with a plan to beat. Anything like using the Mind Gem to destroy his conscience in his prime form, Wanda using her powers to destroy his inners, Tony and Vision hacking Ultron Prime, or a combination of these.
7. They killed Baron Strucker to make Ultron look badass. Wasted another good villain. Would have rather Strucker lived and Ultron managed to hack into one of those nuke facilities and nuked a city (or made up city). That would have raised the stakes and made Ultron scary. After that, the whole lifting of Sovoka into the skies wouldn't look so dumb.
Originally posted by DARTH POWER
Actually, yeah good point. Given Jarvis showed he was capable of operating multiple Iron Man suits in IM3. So there wasSpoiler:right there.
the AI controlled world peacekeeping force he wantedClearly Jarvis
Spoiler:
could only run a limited number of armored suits and he wanted this Ultron thing that could control an unlimited number of suits maybe?? But then that doesn't make perfect sense either given Jarvis was changing codes faster than Ultron could crack them.
Jarvis wasn't suited for the task of Earth's defense, tony had to create a more powerful and global AI.
Originally posted by DARTH POWER
Plus he didn't do a good job of handling all the characters. Hawkeyes was handled well this time but Thor was royally screwed this time.
How was Thor screwed? Thor's concerns are more of a universe nature than they are of a global nature. This movie
Spoiler:
put Thor in the frame of mind for Ragnorak and Thanos while every other hero will be busy bickering about earth civil war stuff. Also, Thor probably destroyed the most robots and had some of the sweetest action. And what many consider Thor being nerfed, is just Thor being a team player.
Originally posted by WhiteWitchKing
Ultron written correctly is a force that destroy the Avengers. It's an AI that can hack the worlds armaments and build a physical form that could content with the big guns of the Avengers. Yet, they nerfed him hard.Why Ultron was a such a disappointment:
1. Ultron was too human for my taste. The whole Transformer face thing was unnecessary waste of money. Maybe they could have that for the early form. The prime could have been just like those drones and it would have been just fine. And why does Ultron even need teeth? He looked just out right stupid.
2. His built up was just lazy. He just went evil. His motivation wasn't there. His just wanted to end humanity after being born. They should have given him more time to flesh out his thoughts and motivation.
3. His plan was far fetch. Rockets to rip a city off the ground and drop it back on earth?
4. He didn't even bother to hack Iron Man at all. Not sure why that was.
5. His drones were even less of a threat than the Chitauris. I forget, did they even hurt anyone? The Chituaris at one point actually held down Hulk and hurt Cap.
6. Ultron was weak. I loved it when he used some kind of magnetic powers to pull Iron Man forward and blasted him. Aside from that, he barely did anything except acted like a brute. Being an advanced AI with Hydra weapon and vast knowledge, the writers could have given him sonics and disintigrator breams to play with. What we get is an Ultron that mostly displays brute force in weak shell. Did he even get a vibranium body? An Ultron that absorbed Thor's hammer strikes and lightning strike to power himself would have been scary. That fight between Hulkbuster and Hulk could have been taken out and replaced with a vibranium Ultron vs Hulk. That would have built Ultron's status that would require the Avengers to come up with a plan to beat. Anything like using the Mind Gem to destroy his conscience in his prime form, Wanda using her powers to destroy his inners, Tony and Vision hacking Ultron Prime, or a combination of these.
7. They killed Baron Strucker to make Ultron look badass. Wasted another good villain. Would have rather Strucker lived and Ultron managed to hack into one of those nuke facilities and nuked a city (or made up city). That would have raised the stakes and made Ultron scary. After that, the whole lifting of Sovoka into the skies wouldn't look so dumb.
👆 Have to agree with this
Originally posted by WhiteWitchKing
Ultron written correctly is a force that destroy the Avengers. It's an AI that can hack the worlds armaments and build a physical form that could content with the big guns of the Avengers. Yet, they nerfed him hard.Why Ultron was a such a disappointment:
1. Ultron was too human for my taste. The whole Transformer face thing was unnecessary waste of money. Maybe they could have that for the early form. The prime could have been just like those drones and it would have been just fine. And why does Ultron even need teeth? He looked just out right stupid.
2. His built up was just lazy. He just went evil. His motivation wasn't there. His just wanted to end humanity after being born. They should have given him more time to flesh out his thoughts and motivation.
3. His plan was far fetch. Rockets to rip a city off the ground and drop it back on earth?
4. He didn't even bother to hack Iron Man at all. Not sure why that was.
5. His drones were even less of a threat than the Chitauris. I forget, did they even hurt anyone? The Chituaris at one point actually held down Hulk and hurt Cap.
6. Ultron was weak. I loved it when he used some kind of magnetic powers to pull Iron Man forward and blasted him. Aside from that, he barely did anything except acted like a brute. Being an advanced AI with Hydra weapon and vast knowledge, the writers could have given him sonics and disintigrator breams to play with. What we get is an Ultron that mostly displays brute force in weak shell. Did he even get a vibranium body? An Ultron that absorbed Thor's hammer strikes and lightning strike to power himself would have been scary. That fight between Hulkbuster and Hulk could have been taken out and replaced with a vibranium Ultron vs Hulk. That would have built Ultron's status that would require the Avengers to come up with a plan to beat. Anything like using the Mind Gem to destroy his conscience in his prime form, Wanda using her powers to destroy his inners, Tony and Vision hacking Ultron Prime, or a combination of these.
7. They killed Baron Strucker to make Ultron look badass. Wasted another good villain. Would have rather Strucker lived and Ultron managed to hack into one of those nuke facilities and nuked a city (or made up city). That would have raised the stakes and made Ultron scary. After that, the whole lifting of Sovoka into the skies wouldn't look so dumb.
Spoiler:
1. I agree, I wasn't a huge fan of his face. But that's a minor quibble.2. I thought they did alright considering the movie's length. If they wanted to make it over 3 hours long then sure.
3. I liked his plan acutally, and he gave good reason why he went that route several times. It was a STATEMENT. He could have come up with many other ways (in fact he tried to use nukes but was stopped by Jarvis). It was a statement killing/extinction event.
4. Second of your points I agree with. A minor quibble again though.
5. I likened the drones to the Chitari actually, they both seemed like cannon fodder for the heroes.
6. While I agree that I would have liked to see more advanced weaponry on him, he was FAR from weak. That's why they had him confront Thor, to show how strong he was. It was only the combined efforts of Thor, Vision and Iron man that ultimately weakened his final form to the point where he had to flee. (With a full dose of Vision's mind gem btw). Also, Ultron is still VERY young in this movie. He was just created, and I'm not entirely sure he's dead yet....
7. Yes, I agree that they shouldn't have killed Strucker, but again did you watch the movie? Ultron was TRYING to hack and use nukes, but he couldn't. Jarvis stopped him. So that point is irrelevant.
I agree with some of your quibbles but it's hardly enough to even slightly ruin the movie for me. I watched it again and enjoyed it the second time through much more.
Originally posted by CPT Space BombSpoiler:
1. I agree, I wasn't a huge fan of his face. But that's a minor quibble.2. I thought they did alright considering the movie's length. If they wanted to make it over 3 hours long then sure.
3. I liked his plan acutally, and he gave good reason why he went that route several times. It was a STATEMENT. He could have come up with many other ways (in fact he tried to use nukes but was stopped by Jarvis). It was a statement killing/extinction event.
4. Second of your points I agree with. A minor quibble again though.
5. I likened the drones to the Chitari actually, they both seemed like cannon fodder for the heroes.
6. While I agree that I would have liked to see more advanced weaponry on him, he was FAR from weak. That's why they had him confront Thor, to show how strong he was. It was only the combined efforts of Thor, Vision and Iron man that ultimately weakened his final form to the point where he had to flee. (With a full dose of Vision's mind gem btw). Also, Ultron is still VERY young in this movie. He was just created, and I'm not entirely sure he's dead yet....
7. Yes, I agree that they shouldn't have killed Strucker, but again did you watch the movie? Ultron was TRYING to hack and use nukes, but he couldn't. Jarvis stopped him. So that point is irrelevant.
I agree with some of your quibbles but it's hardly enough to even slightly ruin the movie for me. I watched it again and enjoyed it the second time through much more.
Originally posted by CPT Space BombSpoiler:
1. I agree, I wasn't a huge fan of his face. But that's a minor quibble.2. I thought they did alright considering the movie's length. If they wanted to make it over 3 hours long then sure.
3. I liked his plan acutally, and he gave good reason why he went that route several times. It was a STATEMENT. He could have come up with many other ways (in fact he tried to use nukes but was stopped by Jarvis). It was a statement killing/extinction event.
4. Second of your points I agree with. A minor quibble again though.
5. I likened the drones to the Chitari actually, they both seemed like cannon fodder for the heroes.
6. While I agree that I would have liked to see more advanced weaponry on him, he was FAR from weak. That's why they had him confront Thor, to show how strong he was. It was only the combined efforts of Thor, Vision and Iron man that ultimately weakened his final form to the point where he had to flee. (With a full dose of Vision's mind gem btw). Also, Ultron is still VERY young in this movie. He was just created, and I'm not entirely sure he's dead yet....
7. Yes, I agree that they shouldn't have killed Strucker, but again did you watch the movie? Ultron was TRYING to hack and use nukes, but he couldn't. Jarvis stopped him. So that point is irrelevant.
I agree with some of your quibbles but it's hardly enough to even slightly ruin the movie for me. I watched it again and enjoyed it the second time through much more.
We saw the same movie. Stark wanted an AI which he had in Jarvis. He built Ultron but Ultron couldn't even outhack Jarvis to access the nuke codes. So why did Tony need Ultron again? Jarvis is more than capable. He Utron been able to out hack Jarvis at least once from one of the facilities and managed to nuke a city he would have been more creditable and the asteroid plan wouldn't look so silly. For an AI that is suppose to do what Jarvis can't, he couln't outhack Jarvis even once. They never even explained how Tony and Bruce decide why Jarvis wasn't capable.
As for Ultron prime, Vision and Hulk easily knocked him back. At no point did Thor even unleash his full lightning. For all we know, it might not even take Vision and IM help if Thor hit him with a city busting attack. Thor looked weak against Ultron when both Vision and Hulk sent Ultron flying. This could have been so much more but they watered down Ultron pretty much.
Originally posted by WhiteWitchKing
We saw the same movie. Stark wanted an AI which he had in Jarvis. He built Ultron but Ultron couldn't even outhack Jarvis to access the nuke codes. So why did Tony need Ultron again? Jarvis is more than capable. He Utron been able to out hack Jarvis at least once from one of the facilities and managed to nuke a city he would have been more creditable and the asteroid plan wouldn't look so silly. For an AI that is suppose to do what Jarvis can't, he couln't outhack Jarvis even once. They never even explained how Tony and Bruce decide why Jarvis wasn't capable.As for Ultron prime, Vision and Hulk easily knocked him back. At no point did Thor even unleash his full lightning. For all we know, it might not even take Vision and IM help if Thor hit him with a city busting attack. Thor looked weak against Ultron when both Vision and Hulk sent Ultron flying. This could have been so much more but they watered down Ultron pretty much.
Hulk sent Ultron flying when Ultron was pretty busted up so I don't see how you can count that. That hit is understandable.
Originally posted by ares834
Few characters had a "truly memorable" scene this time around. Anyway, I thought Thor was handled far better this time around.
The IM vs Hulk and Cap vs Ultron were both pretty memorable.
Memorable scenes can just be some great action that stands out. Or it could be a scene he has with other characters.
In A1 there was loads for Thor. But he really needed something stand out in this one, considering Cap and IM were easily made the main characters.
Originally posted by DARTH POWER
The IM vs Hulk and Cap vs Ultron were both pretty memorable.Memorable scenes can just be some great action that stands out. Or it could be a scene he has with other characters.
In A1 there was loads for Thor. But he really needed something stand out in this one, considering Cap and IM were easily made the main characters.
Spoiler:
Well he did have that scene were he blew up a city sized chunk of earth
Spoiler:
I'll give you IM vs Hulk but that is really it from an actions set point. But I honestly think he has more memorable scenes than any other (albeit just not in any action). Like when he powered up vision or his joke about Hulk's victims.Honestly, I think Thor was handled far better in this film. Here he seemed easily the most powerful of the Core team. Ultron never really seemed a threat to him, his eye were fastened on the far more threatening Ragnarok. Plus the scene where he sorta went "ninja" on a bunch of the drones was awesome as was it when he blew up the island.
Finally, he seemed to just be "beyond" his teammates. The Avengers seemed focused on saving civilization whereas Thor is more focused on saving the cosmos. Only Vision who was "on the side of life" seemed to be on his level in that regard and the two sorta seemed to have a bromance going on. Heck, Vision emulates Thor when he creates his cape. Not to mention Thor is the only one to see the bigger cosmic picture and to notice the looming threat of Thanos.
Originally posted by ares834Spoiler:
I'll give you IM vs Hulk but that is really it from an actions set point. But I honestly think he has more memorable scenes than any other (albeit just not in any action). Like when he powered up vision or his joke about Hulk's victims.Honestly, I think Thor was handled far better in this film. Here he seemed easily the most powerful of the Core team. Ultron never really seemed a threat to him, his eye were fastened on the far more threatening Ragnarok. Plus the scene where he sorta went "ninja" on a bunch of the drones was awesome as was it when he blew up the island.
Finally, he seemed to just be "beyond" his teammates. The Avengers seemed focused on saving civilization whereas Thor is more focused on saving the cosmos. Only Vision who was "on the side of life" seemed to be on his level in that regard and the two sorta seemed to have a bromance going on. Heck, Vision emulates Thor when he creates his cape. Not to mention Thor is the only one to see the bigger cosmic picture and to notice the looming threat of Thanos.
nicely put 👆
Although i think they could have used Thor better or even made him a bit more powerful. To me it seemed like he was always holding back minus that "one scene"
Anyhow you are right in catching the fact that Thor's
Spoiler:
mind (after the scarlet witch tampering) was not on earth. It was on the bigger picture. Asgard, Ragnarok, Thanos, etc.