Superman and Black Adam vs The Runner...

Implied power wont work with the Superman camp here. You better have a concrete feat or its an easy win for Superman. I dont buy the weakened Surfer theory either, but its here nor there. I will never believe that Superman (even with Adam) can beat the Runner.

Its a shame that Marvel allowed Gruenwalds silly story to even be published. All he was doing was stroking his love for Barry Allen (Buried Allen, yeah takes a real sleuth to figure that out) and low balling the Runner in it. I hold that story with about as much faith as I do a story like She-Hulk beating the Champion cause she worked out, or Spiderman beating up Firelord. Yeah, it was good for a laugh or two, but everybody should know better.

he didn't lowball him. the race was for running, not full flight speed. runner set up the rules so that competitors would be disqualified if their feet didn't hit the ground every 50,00 feet or something like that, for him that crossed the line into flight. the point is, runner has no issue catching surfer, skimming the "skin of galaxies", or that thanos incident when his rules don't apply.

him being relegated to sub-light speed running doesn't mean all his speed is the same, proof being when makkari learned the means to run at light speed to win the race, he was locked in hyper speed and only the runner and grandmaster 9time manip powers) could perceive him. makkari only gained that after he hit light speed, something he was unable to do prior, but runner had no issue with it.

Originally posted by psycho gundam
he was seemingly able to make moondragon immune to walking on a star(?)

Holy crap! Good find.

The runner one shots adam then gives supermans cape the density of a neutron syar and speed blitz' him into dust

Originally posted by h1a8
ABC logic doesn't fly here. Not only do characters job (both Champion and Surfer job) but it is how you beat a character that matters and not the fact that you beat them.

Runner out muscled Surfer. This isn't a good feat because there are lots of heralds stronger than Surfer. Also Surfer was said to be weakened. You can't ignore that.

Beating Surfer in that way has no bearing on how Superman would beat him solo.

First, off, it's not ABC logic. Secondly, he didn't "out muscle Surfer" so you argument there is invalid. It was not a test of strenght, it was a test of power. If it were a test of strength, Surfer would have simply enhanced his strength. You need to get to know the character. Surfer can be as strong as he needs to be, but in this cases it was a comparison of power.

Originally posted by Blue Area Vet
First, off, it's not ABC logic. Secondly, he didn't "out muscle Surfer" so you argument there is invalid. It was not a test of strenght, it was a test of power. If it were a test of strength, Surfer would have simply enhanced his strength. You need to get to know the character. Surfer can be as strong as he needs to be, but in this cases it was a comparison of power.

Originally posted by LeonBuco666
i agree, surfer tried to blast golden boy of his bored when the runner played abit of baseball with him(surfer was the ball and his board was the bat) and he didnt even flinch lol but i disagree that surfer could enhance his strength all he wants, the rummer would always be above him
power primordial >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> power cosmic

"Power Primordial" wasn't enough to stop them from being eaten by Galactus (who is Power Cosmic).

As for Runner/Surfer. Surfer definitely wasn't in his right mind and he could have done a whole lot more (and it would definitely have affected Runner - Sufer's taken down more powerful opponents) but, Runner has him matched/beaten in speed, has him beaten in physical power and (so long as Surfer's jobbing) in intellect.

The elders nearly replaced the cosmic abstracts and reformed 616, imho power primordial > power cosmic
the runner out muscled surfer, out powered him and all in all, owned him the whole 'state of mind' thing is BS, the runner didnt even exert himself while surfet gave it his all and then got whooped

Originally posted by LeonBuco666
The elders nearly replaced the cosmic abstracts and reformed 616, imho power primordial > power cosmic
the runner out muscled surfer, out powered him and all in all, owned him the whole 'state of mind' thing is BS, the runner didnt even exert himself while surfet gave it his all and then got whooped

Individually they're all over the place, from feeble old men like Gardener (clubbed by Savage Hulk, then robbed of his staff and gem) to paper tigers like Grandmaster (KO/killed by Rulk) and that cosmic cretin Champion.

Aside from Runner and maybe Ego (selective showings), they really are an embarrassment.

The Power Cosmic is far and away superior, it's the same source that fuels "Insane" Genis, that empowered Korvac and that makes Galactus the omniversal threat he is.

And re the "BS" about Surfer not being in his right mind, he even says so during the fight with Runner. That he should be angry, should hate him but can't help liking him.

It's part of Runner's powerset, but Surfer would be able to deal with it, if he was aware of it.

Still, I'm not saying Surfer would win many, just that he would make a proper fight of it.

Fair do's my man!

Yeah, the House of Odin and the House of El have en-camped on KMC VF.

The Church of Thanosianity is the religion of the locals and Speedblitz is the favoured local ale...

The Power Cosmic needs some representation, from time to time... 😖hifty:

There is another aspect to all of this that would go in the Runner's favor. The elders LIVE for challenges. Superman and BA would be a challenge for Runner, one that he would eat up.

I seriously dont think adam would propose any sort of threat at all, and considering everything the runner is capable of, hebwould more thank likely end superman

The Runner should win this.

Just to chime in.
Surfer was pretty upset with Runner toying with him

http://m20.photobucket.com/albumview/albums/voltronforce/runnersurfer3.jpg.html

Originally posted by Inhuman
Just to chime in.
Surfer was pretty upset with Runner toying with him

http://m20.photobucket.com/albumview/albums/voltronforce/runnersurfer3.jpg.html

picture was messed up :/
lets try again.

As a rule of thumb, the more upset the Surfer is, the less he talks about it.

That's just his standard issue "you vile fiend! I shall smiii... oops, forgot, the footy's on, bye"...

Originally posted by janus77
As a rule of thumb, the more upset the Surfer is, the less he talks about it.

That's just his standard issue "you vile fiend! I shall smiii... oops, forgot, the footy's on, bye"...

Originally posted by Inhuman
picture was messed up :/
lets try again.

LMAO at the panel of him jacking Surfer's board.

Epic trolling right there lol