Anakin Skywalker and Savage Opress vs. Obi-Wan Kenobi and Darth Maul

Originally posted by Mizukage Yoda
-snip-

Being floored and facing the floor with weapons deignited is hardly an advantageous position in a fight. In fact even having your back facing your opponent is a very dangerous position to be in a fight.

So from what we saw Opress was winning getting in those Powerful TK blows. Whilst Skywalker and Kenobi were not getting any blows on Opress whatsoever.

Of course Maul's no Yoda or Sidious in his acrobatics, but when I see him fight more like an Opress type brute, then it's natural to think either the Environment was limiting him due to his size, or he wasn't in peak form yet.

I don't see how Kenobi having an unfamiliar Saber is supposed to put him at more of a disadvantage than Maul who had unfamiliar legs, and was 10+ years out of practice. Also Maul was also using his half Saber, not the weapon he was accustomed to 10+years ago.

I strongly disagree that Kenobi would edge out Maul in an all out. I see him possibly edging out Maul in Sabers, but honestly that's it. Maul seems to be more powerful in the Force and I'd give him the majority in an all out.

Originally posted by Nephthys
Tempest has a sig???

Not sig, I meant his Sidious pic.

Originally posted by DARTH POWER
Being floored and facing the floor with weapons deignited is hardly an advantageous position in a fight. In fact even having your back facing your opponent is a very dangerous position to be in a fight.

I strongly disagree that Kenobi would edge out Maul in an all out. I see him possibly edging out Maul in Sabers, but honestly that's it. Maul seems to be more powerful in the Force and I'd give him the majority in an all out.

Not sig, I meant his Sidious pic.

But didn't you actually point out a bit where Obi-Wan had Maul in the same position and likely could have killed him? Is that different from the Savage example?

Ah.

Originally posted by Nephthys
But didn't you actually point out a bit where Obi-Wan had Maul in the same position and likely could have killed him? Is that different from the Savage example?

.

Yeah I've admitted in Revenge where Kenobi had Maul in the same position he probably would have won if not for having to look out for Ventress.

If not he was at least outfighting him and in the winning position.

Where I disagree is him kicking Maul in Revival being the same thing. Just kicking someone back is not necessarily winning at all. In fact it was just a move used to separate Maul from him, and it served it's purpose in that scenario.

Originally posted by DARTH POWER
Being floored and facing the floor with weapons deignited is hardly an advantageous position in a fight. In fact even having your back facing your opponent is a very dangerous position to be in a fight.

So from what we saw Opress was winning getting in those Powerful TK blows. Whilst Skywalker and Kenobi were not getting any blows on Opress whatsoever.

Of course Maul's no Yoda or Sidious in his acrobatics, but when I see him fight more like an Opress type brute, then it's natural to think either the Environment was limiting him due to his size, or he wasn't in peak form yet.

I don't see how Kenobi having an unfamiliar Saber is supposed to put him at more of a disadvantage than Maul who had unfamiliar legs, and was 10+ years out of practice. Also Maul was also using his half Saber, not the weapon he was accustomed to 10+years ago.

I strongly disagree that Kenobi would edge out Maul in an all out. I see him possibly edging out Maul in Sabers, but honestly that's it. Maul seems to be more powerful in the Force and I'd give him the majority in an all out.

Not sig, I meant his Sidious pic.

Jedi have FTL reaction speeds and can move at a speed that makes them untraceable to the untrained eye, and you expect me to believe that they couldn't turn around and block a lightsaber strike? I highly doubt that.

Originally posted by DARTH POWER
Yeah I've admitted in Revenge where Kenobi had Maul in the same position he probably would have won if not for having to look out for Ventress.

If not he was at least outfighting him and in the winning position.

Where I disagree is him kicking Maul in Revival being the same thing. Just kicking someone back is not necessarily winning at all. In fact it was just a move used to separate Maul from him, and it served it's purpose in that scenario.

That this is still being discussed is slowly draining what little faith in humanity I have left.

Karpyshyn's confirmation to Intrepid37 of my 2 year interpretation of Vitiate is proof enough that when it comes to discerning facts from this bullshit, I am the Master.

Those who oppose me are wise to lay down their arms and accept my infallibility.

Nah.

Dat infallibility biscuits

Originally posted by Mizukage Yoda
Dat infallibility biscuits

Being right all the time can be burdensome.

You have no idea how amusing I found it that the object of worship for the SWTOR cult ended up confirming my interpretation.

It'd be like conservative Christians finding out Jesus was pro-choice.

I've always said that Karpyshan is a sub-par writer.

Originally posted by Nephthys
I've always said that Karpyshan is a sub-par writer.

That's putting it delicately.

BTW, you actually agreed with me on Vitiate and the ritual stuff a long while back; do you remember?

Shame you jumped ship from my luxury cruise liner to the sinking SWTOR galleon. That's not quite what I meant when I told you to go down. uhuh

And yet you gave Revan a 7/10 when you first read it. he

Yeah. I debated with you against Legend as I recall. I changed my mind.

Hey, gotta give Karpyshyn points for singlehandedly driving the Revan bandwagon off a cliff.

Yeah. And went from right to wrong just like that. Maybe you shouldn't have gotten so enamored with the character and the game. 😂

While still claiming he's more powerful than Nihilus.

The games great. I don't see why you hate it when its literally Kotor except bigger.

From a certain point of view.

Because rather than do something truly original and interesting with the unexplored timeframe and extraordinary budget, it desperately clutches to the vastly more important story of the films in a gratuitous and offensive way.

Don't insult KotOR by comparing it to TOR.

Karpyshan wrote KotOR and the Jedi Knight campaign in TOR. awepeach

They're pretty comparable. Both Bioware games, nearly the same setting, numerous call-backs to Kotor, companions and lots of other things you liked in Kotor!

Karpyshyn nailed KotOR. Everything else he's touched absolutely sucks, though.

I'm sure TOR isn't completely irredeemable. But the central storyline blows. A complete waste of time, money, and "talent."

There are 8 central storylines. If you don't like Vitiate, play as a Consular or an Agent. 😛

Originally posted by The_Tempest
Being right all the time can be burdensome.

You have no idea how amusing I found it that the object of worship for the SWTOR cult ended up confirming my interpretation.

It'd be like conservative Christians finding out Jesus was pro-choice.

Jesus was pro-choice

Originally posted by Mizukage Yoda
"This weapon is your life."
A lightsaber is often compared to a limb of a Jedi. They spend a great amount of time crafting it to be an extension of themselves. So when you just give them some rando lightsaber it is not nearly the same for dueling.

So Kenobi and Skywalker were at a huge disadvantage when facing Dooku in AOTC?

It's not ideal but I don't think it's the huge disadvantage your making it out to be. Kenobi was actually fighting better when he had Ventress's Saber. Kenobi probably gave the best performance of his career with his and Adi Gallia's Saber. Not to mention Barriss Offee gave Skywalker hell with Ventress's Lightsabers.

And like I've already brought up, Maul wasn't accustomed to his cut up weapon. So by that argument both Maul and Kenobi were facing that same disadvantage. In fact Maul never made his own Lightsaber again for the rest of TCW. So was he at a huge disadvanatge the whole time?

Originally posted by Mizukage Yoda
Jedi have FTL reaction speeds and can move at a speed that makes them untraceable to the untrained eye, and you expect me to believe that they couldn't turn around and block a lightsaber strike? I highly doubt that.

I am not arguing that. I am trying to point out the ridiculousness of comparing Savage's feat to Kenobi's.

Not saying they don't have the speed feats to do it. Not even saying it was a guaranteed win. But being knocked around tends to make one react slightly slower. Besides Opress can also move/react that fast, but he wasn't facing the disadvantage of having his Saber off, being floored and having his back towards his opponents.
Besides if your not buying this theory, then why are you claiming Kenobi was winning the fight in Revenge before he helped Ventress?

It's really not that ridiculous. Considering Opress was actually facing more powerful opponents (since Skywalker is clearly the most powerful of these guys), and Kenobi didn't have anyone else trying to kill him. So the chances of a result (disabling one of them) was obviously higher in Kenobi's situation.

And whilst Kenobi showed clear superiority in Saber Prowess over his opponents, Opress showed clear superiority in Force Power over his opponents. And whilst the Brothers put Kenobi on his ass twice in the Revival fight(including the end of the fight) Skyaalker/Kenobi didn't manage to lay any hit on Opress at all, let alone leaving him on his ass.