Originally posted by leonidasThus the need for tactile kinesis
the issue that seemed to be contradictory was the fact that the ig managed to push earth away without breaking the planet, while hype applied less force and the planet shattered. to me, that would indicate steve applied more than just 'physical' force to keep the planet from reaching earth.
The IG can do anything, I don't see why it couldn't preserve a planet that they want to preserve while also pushing it away
Originally posted by ODG
^ The Incursion ended. Earths are destroyed when Incursions end, as do their respective universes. The strain of Hyperion's resistance wasn't what destroyed the universes, lol. Of course, silly me. Among such venerable theories as "space cheese" and "cheetah speed" who could forget the compelling counter-argument of "balloons n' tanks"?Why limit it to Hyperion? Thor busted planets as collateral damage? Nope. Dem wuz clearly balloons. And Gorr was a M1 Sherman tank. Worldbreaker Hulk? Pssh, yea right. Dark Dimension's chock full of balloons n' tanks.
At least this is better than Phil's last attempt to lowball it, when he stated that the universes were only involved in the kablooey part
But balloons and tanks should be a universal accepted equation if it isn't by now
Originally posted by ODGAnyway, upon re-reading this, I wasn't being clear. So let me restate it more clearly. Hyperion's resistance didn't destroy the Earths. Had the Earths been destroyed, the incursion point of the universes would become unmoored thus sparing their respective universes. That's the rule. Reed explained it. Alternate Terrax explained that was what alternate Galactus did. Even Black Swan explained that many alternate Hank McCoys have done it, i.e., evacuating the Earth, then destroying it:
^ The Incursion ended. Earths are destroyed when Incursions end, as do their respective universes. The strain of Hyperion's resistance wasn't what destroyed the universes, lol.
But clearly in Hyperion's case, both universes were destroyed. Ergo, Hyperion couldn't have destroyed the Earths before the Incursion's time limit. Otherwise, both universes would have survived. For Hyperion to have circumvented this rule... he would have had to exert enough strength to not just destroy the Earths but also their respective universes. Hence, my loling, "The strain of Hyperion's resistance wasn't what destroyed the universes, lol."
Originally posted by ODGFor the purpose of explaining you as I would to to a mildly-mentally impaired puddle of illogical gramatical coherency, which you most certainly are, the balloons analogy suited just fine as far as illustrating what happened.
Hyperion did not hold two balloons apart.
Originally posted by ODGYes, Hyperion held two Earths apart.
He held two Earths apart. Along with their respective universes. What is not computing here?
No, Hyperion didn't stop the masses of the other two respective Universes. He held them apart, in the same way I held apart the tanks from advancing, while holding the balloons - i.e. not at all.
The Earths are the 'tip' of the Universes. Stopping them, doesn't mean stopping the whole Universes from advancing, for the simple fact that The Earths aren't durable enough to sustain the mass of two Universes pushing them from one side [say, for oversimplification, the North Pole], while they can't advance on the other side [say, the South Pole].
Even if the Earths were made from adamantium, they couldn't have supported that much mass.
And they didn't.
They crumbled, as it would be expected of them, and as it would be expected of balloons [Earths] that are pushed by tanks [Universes] from one side, while they can't advance from my [Hyperion] stopping them from the other side.
They get destroyed from the pressure.
So either you:
a). Agree with me that Hyperion is strong enough to stop two Earths from advancing, until the durability of the Earths gives in and they crumbled, and in this scenario Hyperion has to be strong enough to withstand as much pressure as the Earths can until they can't anymore [i.e. planetary level strength]
or
b). You stick to you guns. You say Hyperion stopped the mass of two entire Universes. In which case, you say that the Earths are durable enough to sustain two Universes. But wait? Why did they crumble? Because they can't sustain two Universes, like any even adamantium made Earths would? Shocking!
Be dumb or be right [but still be dumb. because there's no treatment for that, I'm afraid]
It's up to you.
Originally posted by ODGBecause Cap used the IG, an artifact that grants near-omnipotence, and not the palm of his hands.
And this is all, once again, ignoring the universal implications of what Incursions actually are. Reed stated it explicitly: Cap pushing against the Earth, was literally pushing against it's entire universe. You can deflect onto balloons all you want and collapsing weights all you want. Cap pushed against an Earth, and pushed the weight of its entire universe along with it, [b]WITHOUT the Earth collapsing. [/B]
I hope you're not implying that Cap shooting energy at the Earth was just him bombarding it until, what, it runs back taking its Universe with him? I mean, dumby, please, don't go double retard here on me.
Yes, if you're able to keep the Earth intact (i.e. use the Infinity Gauntlets and not the palm of your hands) and you have the power to move it back (i.e. use the Infinity Gauntlets and not the palm of your hands), then it's perfectly normal that it would move back.
That doesn't contradict anything. I mean, can you even follow the discussion?
If the balloons were:
a). durable enough to withstand the pressure put on by the palms of my hands and the tanks
b). I was suddenly Hulking out, and got tremendous strength.
Then, of course, I'd be pushing the balloons [and the tanks, subsequently] back.
That's obvious.
What's baffling, and frankly, leaning towards the inevitable "OneDumbGo really this dumb" is the fact that you..
...are equating...
Hyperion using the palms of his hands...
to Captain America using a weapon that grants near-omnipotence...
Originally posted by ODGThe materials the Earth is made of are vastly less durable than Hyperion's toenail. The analogy would be more like:
Holding apart two boulders being crushed to pieces around you by two tanks is a greater strength feat than moving around a boulder 1/4th the size.
What takes more force:
a). Having a round ball of 20kg of cotton crumble as you hold it apart with the palms of your hands from advancing, as it's being pushed by an external force.
b). Moving 5 kg of cotton at the speed of sound nigh-instantly.
Shall I begin posting the math, or is it too obvious [even for you]?
Wasn't a question about this Hyperion feat asked to Hickman on his FormSpring account? Didn't the guy also bring up the fact that the IG shattered when Captain America tried to use it to stop an incursion? Didn't he, Hickman, say it would be explained later how Hyperion did what he did?
I could have sworn TheGodKiller linked to it on these very forums.
Originally posted by zopzop
Wasn't a question about this Hyperion feat asked to Hickman on his FormSpring account? Didn't the guy also bring up the fact that the IG shattered when Captain America tried to use it to stop an incursion? Didn't he, Hickman, say it would be explained later how Hyperion did what he did?I could have sworn TheGodKiller linked to it on these very forums.
Originally posted by PhilosophíaI don't recall giving you permission to post on these forums again after the humiliating rape you were just subjected to. A few days isn't enough for you to begin walking straight again without a funny gait-
For the purpose of explaining you as I would to to a mildly-mentally impaired puddle of illogical gramatical coherency, which you most certainly are, the balloons analogy suited just fine as far as illustrating what happened.
... oh, wait. It's been three weeks already. Never mind. That's about right based on past discussions that have gone just as swimmingly for you.
Originally posted by PhilosophíaNo sh1t, Captain Obvious. Full stop.
Yes, Hyperion held two Earths apart.
Originally posted by PhilosophíaHyperion didn't hold two balloons apart against tanks anymore than Ultraman pushed a small balloon around a slightly larger balloon without any tanks in sight, you incomparable tool. I am glad though that the rest of your post is concerned with disproving the universal implications of Hyperion's feat. A much easier argument to sell. Especially since I've grown tired trying to convince you that holding apart two planetary masses from colliding was a superior strength feat to adjusting a smaller lunar mass orbiting a planetary one.
No, Hyperion didn't stop the masses of the other two respective Universes. He held them apart, in the same way I held apart the tanks from advancing, while holding the balloons - i.e. not at all.
Even h1a8 in his prime couldn't come up with enough mathematical gymnastics to justify that laffer.
Originally posted by PhilosophíaSo now we understand that this is a point completely separate from your retarded "balloons n' tanks" tripe that tried to paint Hyperion's feat lower than Ultraman's. But it is one that was already widely discussed. Stopping Earths means exactly stopping the universes from advancing during Incursions. Since Reed said, pushing against Earths during Incursions was "literally pushing an entire universe hidden from us." Read the comics.
The Earths are the 'tip' of the Universes. Stopping them, doesn't mean stopping the whole Universes from advancing, for the simple fact that The Earths aren't durable enough to sustain the mass of two Universes pushing them from one side [say, for oversimplification, the North Pole], while they can't advance on the other side [say, the South Pole].
Originally posted by PhilosophíaHyperion didn't stall two adamantium Earths anymore than he stopped two balloon Earths.
Even if the Earths were made from adamantium, they couldn't have supported that much mass.And [b]they didn't.
They crumbled, as it would be expected of them, and as it would be expected of balloons [Earths] that are pushed by tanks [Universes] from one side, while they can't advance from my [Hyperion] stopping them from the other side. [/b]
We've already seen Earths support such mass.
The Earths didn't crumble in either of the Hyperion or Cap scenes. How do we know for certain they didn't? Because had the Earths been destroyed by the simple strain of pushing against them, the respective realities would have been spared universal death via Incursion. Read the comics.
Originally posted by PhilosophíaThat would have saved both universes in the Hyperion scene. Those universes weren't saved. How did you miss such an obvious fact? Oh, right. Universal-sized buttthurt.
They get destroyed from the pressure.
Originally posted by PhilosophíaMathematics cannot scientifically measure the astronomical butthurt filling the rest of your irrelevant post since you forgot the one basic rule of law about Incursons: if you destroy the Earths yourself, you spare the rest of the respective universes. So your entire moronic theory that Hyperion ended up squashing the Earths with his strength because Earths would have popped like balloons under the pressure is already completely disproven by the facts of the scene in question. I needn't have proven the negative. But I basically just did. Because I paid attention to the rules and laws within the comic that were set up by Hickman.
Shall I begin posting the math, or is it too obvious [even for you]?
I discussed virtually the same thing with leonidas, who wasn't suffering the butthurt affliction you currently are. Feel free to educate yourself by reading that constructive discussion. Because at this point, you're just embarrassing yourself trying posting in this thread.
Learn to read English before addressing me again.
Originally posted by Golgo13Your unabashed optimism, that Ultraman will have superior feats -- which would have to involve juggling Earths during a multiversally systemic catastrophe -- is far more refreshing than it has any right to be.
Still too early to tell. I'd bet Ultraman getting the better overall feats after Forever Evil. Vs Hyperion in Hickman's run.
I salute you.
Originally posted by Golgo13No, they don't win battles alone. Unless the battle is about who has the higher feat. Which was what this thread ended up largely being about from page 1.
Don't be a dick. Feats alone don't win battles.
And which you unintentionally made a point of emphasizing since you made clear your hope that Ultraman starts topping Hyperion in the feats department.
Like I said, at least you recognize as much. 👆
Originally posted by ODG
No, they don't win battles alone. Unless the battle is about who has the higher feat. Which was what this thread ended up largely being about from page 1.And which you unintentionally made a point of emphasizing since you made clear your hope that Ultraman starts topping Hyperion in the feats department.
Like I said, at least you recognize as much. 👆
You nerds made into that thread, but it's a VS match. Not a feat war. I still stick by Ultraman having the OVERALL better feats. It's a prediction, which may be wrong, but I stick by it.
Originally posted by Golgo13Which is a refreshing attitude to take. At least you aren't trying to deny that Hyperion has the better feat between the two so far.
You nerds made into that thread, but it's a VS match. Not a feat war. I still stick by Ultraman having the OVERALL better feats. It's a prediction, which may be wrong, but I stick by it.
Less refreshing is the backhanded swipe at calling us nerds. On a comic book discussion forum. Which largely revolves around which fictional character would win a hypothetical (yet still imaginary) fight. A forum which you post on frequently.
.....
