Writer's Intent: Hulk vs Doomsday

Originally posted by Epicurus
Franklin's gene is the result of Celestial manipulation of the human genetic code. In fact in a Galacta😄aughter of Galactus comic, it was implied that all mutants' X-genes warp reality to some extent, and it was also referred to as Celestial hardware. Doomsady's adaptive evolution powers don't work in such a manner anyways.

Doomsday's powers don't work that way...because as far as the writer was concerned, it didn't need to.

If the writer's intent was to create a being that could kill the Hulk, and have a giant mid-90s storyline that would make the news, then yes, it would.

Hulk wins. Writer's intent was to make every other Marvel character cry (bar Surfer, naturally).

Hulk = Strongest One There Is.
Doomsday = (Not Really) Able to kill Superman.

Writers clearly had greater ambitions for Hulk.

Although, I do see Hulk becoming the strongest there is - but through potential.

Otherwise, he would win EVERY fight he's ever been in. Even if it was against a giant gorilla 😈

Hulk was holding back, the gorilla's actually a descendant of Henry McCoy's from the far future 😕.

Hulk basically only loses through plot device or PIS, nowadays.

I don't care about your 'context' or 'plot' sneer

Lol

Why do Hulk fans argue as if Banner has the Power Gem in every thread? His "infinite strength" is never truly infinite. He just has unlimited potential. He's been beaten many times before ever even getting to WBH levels. Strength isn't the end all be all people tend to make it seem. Hulk has most of his eggs in one basket in a forum fight imo.

Originally posted by janus77

Hulk basically only loses through plot device or PIS, nowadays.

Which one would you consider his fight with Thanos? Plot device or PIS?

Originally posted by Odekahn
Which one would you consider his fight with Thanos? Plot device or PIS?

I take it you're itching to troll, again.

Originally posted by janus77
What fight with Thanos?

I take it you're itching to troll, again.

I don't troll, I just state my opinion. I'm not trying to upset anyone, I'm just trying to have a discussion.

The fight in Infinity 6.

Originally posted by Odekahn
The fight in Infinity 6.

You do a marvellous impression of a troll.

Originally posted by janus77
You mean the one where a special weapon [the spear], somehow - still unexplained - changed Hulk back into Banner?

You do a marvellous impression of a troll.

Yes, Proxima's weapon turned him back into Banner (something we have seen Surfer do on a whim). It's self explanatory.

And you are the one who is name calling, yet somehow I'm the troll? Stop the personal attacks and stick to the topic.

Originally posted by janus77
You mean the one where a special weapon [the spear], somehow - still unexplained - changed Hulk back into Banner?

You do a marvellous impression of a troll.

👆

The Hulk hate in that guy is strong.

Originally posted by carver9
👆

The Hulk hate in that guy is strong.

I don't hate Hulk lol

Originally posted by -Pr-
Because both conflict with each other.

If Doomsday had been made in Marvel to fight the Hulk, then it wouldn't have mattered how strong Hulk got. It wouldn't matter how powerful he got.

Why?

Because the ENTIRE POINT of the Doomsday character is that he's a foil for a particular hero. He's the hero killer. If Doomsday had been created to fight the Hulk, the Hulk would be dead. Same goes for any other character.

You can't argue writer intent when you're going to blatantly ignore things like PIS.

Rabid Hulk "fans" aren't arguing writer intent. So this thread is getting to the point where it will just be closed.

Originally posted by Brockalizer
Feats help to determine the difference between writers intent and hyperbole. Blanket statements become hollow and meaningless without feats to corroborate them. Would you believe that Flash was truly "the fastest man man alive" if there were just veiled references rather than citable feats to back them up? Simply writing something isn't enough. If you want something to be believed then you have to demonstrate it.

Originally posted by Branlor Swift
I agree, I simplified it, but the basic premise holds true.

Doomsday's intent is to adapt at a high level, but the intent was never for infinity. He was basically intended to be the antithesis to the greatest hero ever. To kill him. To be the ultimate danger for him, etc. And then his adaption was intended to take on the threats he faced, but it wasn't meant to be a counter for all the strength ever. And Doomsday would have to deal with that specifically in a battle built upon the thought processes of thousands of Hulk fangirls' wet dreams. All the hyperbole used in Hulk threads? There's the character.

Simply put, arguing characters not "Gods" in their respective specialties will have them losing to Hulk in writers intent battles. It'd be like putting Superman in fights with the writer's intent being Greatest Heroes Ever against anyone. It's just not happening.
Flash is the fastest being ever. Superman is the greatest hero ever. Wolverine is the best at what he does, and Hulk is the strongest one there is. That's just how it is. You have to get into specific "counter" characters to go against those except for Hulk I guess.

Originally posted by h1a8
I don't think "Hulk is the strongest one there is" is writer's intent.

"Is" is present tense while Hulk theoretically could be the strongest one there is (which is future tense). What's theoretical isn't always practical.

Now it's writer's intent that Hulk theoretically be the strongest there is. But Hulk would never achieve this potential for many reasons. Writers know this. That's why Hulk got his ass beat so many times.

Originally posted by Brockalizer
One thing that I have noticed in my years at KMC is that whenever HP Doomsday is involved in a thread, someone throws around the words "writers intent" in an effort to make Doomsday nigh unbeatable. So, I plan to test that theory by posing the following question. In a match-up between Doomsday and the Hulk who would win based solely on writers intent and feats?

Writers Intent "Doomsday can evolve to beat any opponent".

Evidence: Doomsday has tanked the OE and the Guardian blast. He has faught and beaten some of DC's most powerful heroes, including but not limited to Superman, Wonder Woman, Orion. Doomsday is the only being to physically beat Superman to death. Doomsday has adapted to attacks from powerful beings such as Radiant, Waverider, and Superman+Motherbox. Doomsday has been stated by the writer in more than one issue to be able to adapt to any opponent.

Writers Intent "Hulk is the strongest there is".

Evidence: Hulk has survived damage that would kill most other heroes or villains. Throughout his nearly 50 year history this claim has been made by multiple writers in a small libraries worth of issues. Hulk has torn through "indestructible" objects as if they were moist tissue paper. When encounter a physically equal or superior opponent he has consistently been able to power up an beat those opponents, unless there is a plot device involved. Hulis battles have resulted in the shattering of reality and the breaking of worlds. Hulk has been shown to be powerful enough to punch through time.

Let the debate begin.

DD would win since it's writers intent that Hulk could be stronger than anyone provided he had the opportunity. The problem is Hulk won't get that opportunity against DD, the same way he didn't get the opportunity with Zeus and other characters.

^ Except that he was holding back heavily, right? Are we going to forget this fact again just to satisfy ourselves again?

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
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Although saying that, Doomsday would NOT be Doomsday anymore i.e. he would have a different powerset. He'd be given the kind of adapt on the fly evolution h1a8 could only dream about, which is to say instantaneous, like a Darwin or Nemesis Kid. And against Hulk, that would be....another Hulk. But with a faster dynamic strength level.

Pretty much.

Originally posted by Branlor Swift
No arguments here. It's all about the surroundings for these intended powers.

Agreed.

Originally posted by carver9
Darwin almost died from a single hit. Crazy thing about this is, Darwin body tried to find a defense against Hulk and the only thing it could come up with was a self bfr. Adaptation would have to be above Darwin's ability imo...especially going by their confrontation.

http://i160.photobucket.com/albums/t173/EndlessMike9/Hulk/hulkvsxmen9.jpg

the point went right over your head, didn't it.

Originally posted by Brockalizer
Feats help to determine the difference between writers intent and hyperbole. Blanket statements become hollow and meaningless without feats to corroborate them. Would you believe that Flash was truly "the fastest man man alive" if there were just veiled references rather than citable feats to back them up? Simply writing something isn't enough. If you want something to be believed then you have to demonstrate it.

Except that a lot of the time, feats can flat out contradict writer's intent, or how things "should be".

You want to argue feats? Go right ahead. Trying to argue it in the context of writer intent, though, is only going to frustrate you. Unless you're going to cherry pick.