Originally posted by riv6672👆 Straight up ignored his actually point not once but twice. Shit debating
The only reason it went from one feat to the other is thats the aspect you've chosen to fixate on, selectively ignoring certain facts/certain posts/ers.And i would never try and put words in your mouth. I'd have to find room, what with your foot having been in there since the first page and all...
Originally posted by cdtm
All of Shangs opponents fight to kill, though. And use weapons. Fu Manchu's Si Fan, his personal elite ninja group that includes members nearly as skilled as Shang, sport weapons from spiked nunchucks, to multi bladed weapons (Even a "tri bladed" weapon, one upping Darth Mauls horribly impractical double light saber by several decades. 🙂 ) He's also fought with characters that had ranged weapons, like a laser arm.And in terms of speed, does blade have any feats that compete with someone who sliced a bullet in half mid air? Because, Shang fought such an opponent, and while he was obviously outclassed, he also managed to make a fight of it and avoid taking a lethal blow, up until a plot device ended the confrontation. Shows he's high enough up the speed hierarchy, that you really need to be a solid bullet timer, and maybe a little bit beyond, to give him problems.
1. shang's opponents dont matter. very few of them have blade's combination of skill which is why we're having this thread.
2. fighting to kill matters when the two are evenly skilled.
3. blade has blocked multiple bullets and dodged multiple bullets after they were fired. so the answer to your speed question is yes.
so to summarize:
Blade is more than a solid bullet timer as he's casually dodged bullets before. You just admitted that type of speed can give Shang-Chi problems.
Shang Chi may have fought opponents that fight to kill, but they weren't as evenly skilled with him. In terms of swordsmanship, Blade is one of the best around.
There's no argument that Blade is stronger and more durable.
Blade has more going for him in his favor. Moreover, would you like to post the Gorgon fight? That fight is being used as the primary example of Shang-Chi winning here, even though he was clearly outmatched and never had a chance (he admits as much).
Originally posted by deathslash
👆 but don't downplay his fight with Gorgon. He basically beat on gorgon for eight pages straight while Wolverine and Elektra together barely beat him.
...Gorgon beat Shang Chi, Wolverine beat Gorgon (although Gorgon had Wolverine beat before trying to finish him off). It's clear that Shang-Chi did worse against the Gorgon than Wolverine did. Ironfist did much better than both of them.
Shang Chi did well, but the entire point of that fight was that sometimes training and skill don't matter when your opponent physically outclasses you in such a significant way.
Originally posted by Trackz
1. shang's opponents dont matter. very few of them have blade's combination of skill which is why we're having this thread.2. fighting to kill matters when the two are evenly skilled.
3. blade has blocked multiple bullets and dodged multiple bullets after they were fired. so the answer to your speed question is yes.
so to summarize:
Blade is more than a solid bullet timer as he's casually dodged bullets before. You just admitted that type of speed can give Shang-Chi problems.
Shang Chi may have fought opponents that fight to kill, but they weren't as evenly skilled with him. In terms of swordsmanship, Blade is one of the best around.
There's no argument that Blade is stronger and more durable.
Blade has more going for him in his favor. Moreover, would you like to post the Gorgon fight? That fight is being used as the primary example of Shang-Chi winning here, even though he was clearly outmatched and never had a chance (he admits as much).
Shang-Chi has also dodged bullets before.
He can also block bullets if need be.
Not voicing an opinion on the thread as such but just displaying Shang-Chi does have decent speed feats too.
He has also used his Chi to block a punch from Hiroim.
Here is the full fight (from what was saved on my PC, may have missed a scan, not too sure)
Originally posted by DarkSaint85
The Hiroim fight is also a decent speed feat. He's a good distance away, Hiroim is mid-punch (and, based on the power he uses, it's probably travelling at a fair clip too) and he still manages to get in under it.
Yep it is a good feat. Seems Shang-Chi isn't getting much respect here, or not as much as he deserves.
Like here he is taking on Asgardian trolls, better fighter than he is seen to be here.
Originally posted by One_Angry_Scot
Shang-Chi has also dodged bullets before.He can also block bullets if need be.
Not voicing an opinion on the thread as such but just displaying Shang-Chi does have decent speed feats too.
He has also used his Chi to block a punch from Hiroim.
Here is the full fight (from what was saved on my PC, may have missed a scan, not too sure)
I had seen those feats before, but he commented that casual bullet timers would give shang chi trouble, so was responding to that.
the chi block is impressive, but won't matter much as I'm not sure he's used chi to block a bladed weapon before.
Originally posted by Trackz
I had seen those feats before, but he commented that casual bullet timers would give shang chi trouble, so was responding to that.the chi block is impressive, but won't matter much as I'm not sure he's used chi to block a bladed weapon before.
There you are assuming that Shang-Chi couldn't so and I strongly bet he could do so. He probably hasn't used his chi to stop a piano falling on his head but it doesn't mean he couldn't.
And if it comes to it that he can't do so he has the reflexes as shown by the bullet dodging scan to avoid the hit from Blade.
Originally posted by One_Angry_Scot
There you are assuming that Shang-Chi couldn't so and I strongly bet he could do so. He probably hasn't used his chi to stop a piano falling on his head but it doesn't mean he couldn't.And if it comes to it that he can't do so he has the reflexes as shown by the bullet dodging scan to avoid the hit from Blade.
we can't just assume he can do things he hasn't, otherwise we can assume blade has other vampiric abilities he hasn't demonstrated yet.
either way, gorgon had no problem slicing through him in their fight.
they've both dodged bullets, saying because he could dodge bullets he could dodge blade is like me saying shang would never hit blade because he's dodged bullets. they're going to hit one another, blade will be hitting him with something more deadly.
Originally posted by One_Angry_Scot
There you are assuming that Shang-Chi couldn't so and I strongly bet he could do so. He probably hasn't used his chi to stop a piano falling on his head but it doesn't mean he couldn't.And if it comes to it that he can't do so he has the reflexes as shown by the bullet dodging scan to avoid the hit from Blade.
Blade has dodge bullets at close range from Deadpool. And Shang doesn't seem to have the endurance to use Chi on the same level as Iron Fist. Everytime I have seen him used chi he is immediately weaken thereafter.
And Blade has great reflexes too, even with just human stats he caught two blades thrown at him while blindfolded.
Originally posted by Trackz
we can't just assume he can do things he hasn't, otherwise we can assume blade has other vampiric abilities he hasn't demonstrated yet.either way, gorgon had no problem slicing through him in their fight.
they've both dodged bullets, saying because he could dodge bullets he could dodge blade is like me saying shang would never hit blade because he's dodged bullets. they're going to hit one another, blade will be hitting him with something more deadly.
Mentioning about Blade performing different vampiric feats is a completely different thing, one vampiric ability could be completely different from the other. Whereas Shang-Chi blocking a punch from Hiroim it is reasonable to suggest that he could use his chi to block a hit from a sword. It's a completely different debate on what you're saying with Blade both of the things don't correlate.
Gorgon having the capability to slice up Shang-Chi doesn't make much difference, Gorgon is a speed demon so it it's easy to presume that Shang-Chi couldn't always avoid the hits from someone like him.
Again your analogy is wrong. Given that he has dodged bullets it is fairly safe to assume that he will be able to dodge a sword coming at him. And like I have mentioned given he has dodged a point blank gunshot to the face it is reasonable to say he will dodge Blade now and then. Of course they were going to hit one another again I wasn't saying otherwise. Just mentioning a feat that he has performed.
Hitting is the key word it doesn't matter whether he was hitting him with a spoon or a sword speed was the discussion not the deadlines of the weapon.
Anyways like I said before I wasn't voicing an opinion on either Shang-Chi or Blades chances just sharing what I have stored on my PC of Shang-Chi so that people can see the feats he has performed.
Originally posted by Supermutant
Blade has dodge bullets at close range from Deadpool. And Shang doesn't seem to have the endurance to use Chi on the same level as Iron Fist. Everytime I have seen him used chi he is immediately weaken thereafter.And Blade has great reflexes too, even with just human stats he caught two blades thrown at him while blindfolded.
With the Chi feat I wasn't basing on him using it every time to no sell every hit, it was more of a case of him showing how if needed to i.e Blade was in the position to kill him like Shang-chi was on the ground he could use it albeit at the cost of his endurance to keep himself alive.
Again I wasn't belittling Blade in any way saying Shang-Chi would hit Blade every time, was just showing some feats to say it isn't as one sided.
Originally posted by One_Angry_Scot
Mentioning about Blade performing different vampiric feats is a completely different thing, one vampiric ability could be completely different from the other. Whereas Shang-Chi blocking a punch from Hiroim it is reasonable to suggest that he could use his chi to block a hit from a sword. It's a completely different debate on what you're saying with Blade both of the things don't correlate.Gorgon having the capability to slice up Shang-Chi doesn't make much difference, Gorgon is a speed demon so it it's easy to presume that Shang-Chi couldn't always avoid the hits from someone like him.
Again your analogy is wrong. Given that he has dodged bullets it is fairly safe to assume that he will be able to dodge a sword coming at him. And like I have mentioned given he has dodged a point blank gunshot to the face it is reasonable to say he will dodge Blade now and then. Of course they were going to hit one another again I wasn't saying otherwise. Just mentioning a feat that he has performed.
Hitting is the key word it doesn't matter whether he was hitting him with a spoon or a sword speed was the discussion not the deadlines of the weapon.
Anyways like I said before I wasn't voicing an opinion on either Shang-Chi or Blades chances just sharing what I have stored on my PC of Shang-Chi so that people can see the feats he has performed.
it's not at all since most standard vampires share common abilities like changing into mist and what not. we don't say blade can do those things since he hasn't before. similar to shang-chi here, blocking a blunt force is much different than blocking an object meant to pierce.
You're missing my point about gorgon slicing. It was evidence that Shang Chi has been sliced by a sword before and didn't use chi to defend himself.
You're missing my point again. Shang-Chi dodging bullets isn't evidence that Blade won't be able to tag him with the sword. Blade has dodged point blank bullets as well. Every speed feat Shang has, Blade has. So to say he'll dodge him because he's dodged bullets can easily be flipped on its head.
It DEFINITELY matters what they're hitting each other with. If they have comparable speed and comparable skill, it comes down to damage soak. Not only is Blade more durable, but he has a weapon that will put Shang down with one hit (his sword). The deadliness of the weapon is a huge advantage for Blade here.
Originally posted by One_Angry_Scot
With the Chi feat I wasn't basing on him using it every time to no sell every hit, it was more of a case of him showing how if needed to i.e Blade was in the position to kill him like Shang-chi was on the ground he could use it albeit at the cost of his endurance to keep himself alive.Again I wasn't belittling Blade in any way saying Shang-Chi would hit Blade every time, was just showing some feats to say it isn't as one sided.
fair enough
The problem is you're making assumptions about Chi you don't know it's a point we can't really debate on as it's never been shown but it's perhaps reasonable to assume he can. The argument can work both ways.
And like I said I agreed with you about Gorgon I never mentioned Chi, and like I said to Supermutant.
It was just something I was bringing up to say if he was pressed into a dangerous situation i.e Blade knocked him to the ground he could save his own life. Like I said again with Gorgon it wouldn't matter whether Shang-Chi had the capability or not. Gorgon is so fast I doubt Shang-Chi could ever block a hit even if he wanted to.
You said this to me "Shang-Chi dodging bullets isn't evidence that Blade won't be able to tag him with the sword."
I never said Shang-Chi would dodge every single hit Blade threw at him I said it was reasonable to presume he would dodge a hit from Blade now and then and you can't disagree with that. I would never say Shang-Chi goes into the fight dodging every hit thinking Blade needs to sharpen up on his skills.
The only reason I said what he was using to attack didn't matter was the discussion between us was for the majority on speed, whatever the weapon was wouldn't matter until x character hits x character.
Sure Blade probably could decapitate Shang-Chi in one hit. And I agree with you that it is a plus for him was just stating that speed was more of a focus.
Again I would like to reiterate with my original post if you read it I never once made an argument saying Shang-Chi stomps 10/10 or Blade stomps 10/10. In fact you will notice I even posted the fight in which Shang-Chi got humiliated so everyone on this thread could see it, therefore gaining better knowledge of Shang-Chi's abilities so they could make an opinion.
My post was completely neutral, never stated a side either way. I intended to have that post as a benchmark for people to say.
"Oh I never knew Shang-Chi had dodged a bullet a bullet at point blank range, this makes the fight more even".
Originally posted by juggernaut74
One of the best speed feats I've seen recently was the one Blade performed when Deadpool was trying to hit him. It's even more impressive if you view it on the motion comic.
Is it okay if you could share the issue number please? Would be interested in checking it out.