SS4 Gogeta va All

Originally posted by juggerman
Where is the proof he used the same level as you claimed?

I provided evidence and backed it with canon examples from DBZ. Now back your claim

your vegeta example is void vegeta wanted krillin to hurt him he literally asked for it.

if theres no def proof that something has changed you cant say it changed

Originally posted by yungz22
your vegeta example is void vegeta wanted krillin to hurt him he literally asked for it.

if theres no def proof that something has changed you cant say it changed

It's not. Vegeta lowered his PL and he was easier to injure. Simple.

So you made a baseless claim and cannot back it up? He wanted to fight a SSJG and knew he would be. No reason at all to fight at the level he fought scrubs at. He was also exerting himself against Goku showing he was actually trying. Not something he did prior

Originally posted by yungz22
your vegeta example is void vegeta wanted krillin to hurt him he literally asked for it.

Tell me something will ya? Why did Vegeta need to lower his PL at all? You are arguing against my point that keeping your ki lower keeps your durability lower as well right? So why would he need to lower his ki if Krillin could do just as much damage with him keeping his ki up and just allowing himself to be hit?

Originally posted by juggerman
Tell me something will ya? Why did Vegeta need to lower his PL at all? You are arguing against my point that keeping your ki lower keeps your durability lower as well right? So why would he need to lower his ki if Krillin could do just as much damage with him keeping his ki up and just allowing himself to be hit?

i never said the cant lower the power level i said prove bills raised his before finding out goku was holding back

You said my example was flawed and the only reason you gave was Vegeta wanted to be harmed. So it seems as tho you don't agree that the lower the ki the lower the durability. Is that indeed the case?

Originally posted by juggerman
You said my example was flawed and the only reason you gave was Vegeta wanted to be harmed. So it seems as tho you don't agree that the lower the ki the lower the durability. Is that indeed the case?

i never said they couldnt lower their power level so no i said where is the 100% undoubtable proof that bills powered up before he fought goku

Originally posted by yungz22
i never said they couldnt lower their power level so no i said where is the 100% undoubtable proof that bills powered up before he fought goku

I'm taking about the Vegeta point where you said it was flawed and the only reason you gave was that he wanted to get hurt. So I'll ask you again. Are you of the opinion that Krillin could have harmed Vegeta the same if Vegeta kept his ki up. A simple yes or no will do if you don't wish you explain

Originally posted by juggerman
I'm taking about the Vegeta point where you said it was flawed and the only reason you gave was that he wanted to get hurt. So I'll ask you again. Are you of the opinion that Krillin could have harmed Vegeta the same if Vegeta kept his ki up. A simple yes or no will do if you don't wish you explain

i just said no vegeta literally dropped his ki level for the sole purpose of krillin mortally wounding him..... it doesnt apply to bills because like i said show me where he powered up before fighting goku

Originally posted by yungz22
i just said no vegeta literally dropped his ki level for the sole purpose of krillin mortally wounding him..... it doesnt apply to bills because like i said show me where he powered up before fighting goku

So exactly how is my Vegeta example flawed when it shows exactly what I said it did? That the lower the ki the lower the defense.

Originally posted by juggerman
So exactly how is my Vegeta example flawed when it shows exactly what I said it did? That the lower the ki the lower the defense.

vegeta specifically said he was going to lower his power level...... where did bills say anything about raising his power level before the middle of his fight with goku

Him wanting it or not doesn't affect my point at all.

Originally posted by juggerman
Him wanting it or not doesn't affect my point at all.

just because vegeta told krillin that he would allow krillin to hurt him has nothing to do and doesnt prove that bills lowered his power level so that vegeta could hit him.... because if that was the case then that would mean vegeta at no point surpassed goku because bills would have been fighting him at a lower level than when he fought ssj3 goku. bu that isnt the case because everyone said in that instant vegeta passed goku.

so where is the 100% undeniable proof without spec that bill raised his power level before he fought goku?

Originally posted by yungz22
just because vegeta told krillin that he would allow krillin to hurt him has nothing to do and doesnt prove that bills lowered his power level so that vegeta could hit him.... because if that was the case then that would mean vegeta at no point surpassed goku because bills would have been fighting him at a lower level than when he fought ssj3 goku. bu that isnt the case because everyone said in that instant vegeta passed goku.

so where is the 100% undeniable proof without spec that bill raised his power level before he fought goku?

I never said he lowered his power to fight Vegeta. I said he was at a lower power when Vegeta made him bleed than when he fought Goku for the second time

There isn't 100% proof either way. Just common sense

Originally posted by juggerman
I never said he lowered his power to fight Vegeta. I said he was at a lower power when Vegeta made him bleed than when he fought Goku for the second time

There isn't 100% proof either way. Just common sense

assumptions are not always fact

bills toyed with god goku just like he did vegeta until he realized goku held back...before then there was not a serious bone in his body

you have to remember bills is still ridiculously stronger than god goku at his best.

you have the burden of proof to support your claims otherwise their empty assumptions.

Originally posted by yungz22
assumptions are not always fact

bills toyed with god goku just like he did vegeta until he realized goku held back...before then there was not a serious bone in his body

you have to remember bills is still ridiculously stronger than god goku at his best.

Originally posted by yungz22
assumptions are not always fact

bills toyed with god goku just like he did vegeta until he realized goku held back...before then there was not a serious bone in his body

you have to remember bills is still ridiculously stronger than god goku at his best.

Again it cannot be proven 100% either way.

Bills toyed with him but that doesn't mean he used the same amount of power he used on Vegeta and honestly it wouldn't make sense for him to.

I understand that but Goku is still ridiculously stronger than Vegeta as well. It makes sense that Bills would need more power to tool Goku than Vegeta

Originally posted by yungz22
you have the burden of proof to support your claims otherwise their empty assumptions.

You cannot support your claim that he used the exact same amount of power since, as proven earlier, DBZ fighters can power up without visably seeming to. Another example of this is Frieza. He was using maybe 3% against Goku at first and then started using 50%. There was no visable power up or change that occured

Originally posted by juggerman
Again it cannot be proven 100% either way.

Bills toyed with him but that doesn't mean he used the same amount of power he used on Vegeta and honestly it wouldn't make sense for him to.

I understand that but Goku is still ridiculously stronger than Vegeta as well. It makes sense that Bills would need more power to tool Goku than Vegeta

You cannot support your claim that he used the exact same amount of power since, as proven earlier, DBZ fighters can power up without visably seeming to. Another example of this is Frieza. He was using maybe 3% against Goku at first and then started using 50%. There was no visable power up or change that occured

lol you cant suggest things with no evidence what type of debater are you lol you cant just pull things outta nowhere

Originally posted by yungz22
lol you cant suggest things with no evidence what type of debater are you lol you cant just pull things outta nowhere

I didn't suggest, you did right here:

Originally posted by yungz22
i just thought of something so are you saying that vegeta for a split second was stronger than god goku because goku didnt even make bills bleed from what i remember

Nice try tho. And again you cannot prove he used the exact same power he used against Vegeta.

Originally posted by Galan007
Gogeta wins, and comfortably so.