Originally posted by Sinious
Yes I know the planet was full of force sensitives, thats what brought Nihilus there in the first place. Yet they weren't in combat stance and defending against the attack.Tell me Ant, do you think Nihilus can drain the Father of Mortis as well?
If he can drain the planet before the Jedi could react, that's probably more impressive than if they did.
Originally posted by Sinious
Yes I know the planet was full of force sensitives, thats what brought Nihilus there in the first place. Yet they weren't in combat stance and defending against the attack.Tell me Ant, do you think Nihilus can drain the Father of Mortis as well?
And neither Vitiate's 8000 Sith Lords weren't.
I would answer,if you (perhaps) don't believe the popular myth that the Father is a Star Wars God. 😛
Originally posted by DarthAnt66
Except they specifically lured Nihilus there to fight him. They would have been prepared.Considering I don't recall even giving my thoughts on this fight, your statement is laughable.
Atris did, but I don't think she told the other Jedi. It is possible they were in on it as well, I can't recall. Do the Masters mention it?
Perhaps you are referring to this:
“Nathema was just the beginning,” Scourge agreed. “He will destroy world after world, his power and madness growing in concert until he alone is left, Emperor over an empty and lifeless galaxy.”
Meetra stared at the two in horror.
“You’ve been to Nathema,” Scourge said. “You felt the Void. You know what the Emperor is capable of.”
“She understands,” Revan said, reading her expression more accurately than Scourge. “That’s not it.”
“He’s quarantined Dromund Kaas,” Meetra said, trying to lead them to the same conclusion. “What if he’s preparing to do the same thing here that he did on Nathema?”
Scourge hadn’t considered that possibility, and it chilled him to his core.
“Is that possible?” he asked. “Nyriss told me the ritual on Nathema took days, if not weeks. And the Emperor had to trick hundreds of other powerful Sith into working with him so he could draw on their power.”
“He’s stronger now,” Revan said. “But even if it’s possible, I don’t think he’ll go that far. At least not yet. He is too patient, too careful. Dromund Kaas is the heart of his Empire and the seat of his power. He has too many valuable resources here to throw it all away. But once he is ready, there will be nothing left to stop him from launching his invasion of the Republic.”
@Sinious - Sources outright claim that they stripped her of her powers, lol, which is why she fails to lift the saber despite being on "a colossal geyser of dark side energy".
And that doesn't mean Vitiate knows a counter. Knowledge of the ancient Sith was destroyed in the Great Hyperspace War as well, and she was probably referring to Malachor ancient Sith.
Originally posted by SunRazer
@Sinious - Sources outright claim that they stripped her of her powers, lol, which is why she fails to lift the saber despite being on "a colossal geyser of dark side energy".And that doesn't mean Vitiate knows a counter. Knowledge of the ancient Sith was destroyed in the Great Hyperspace War as well, and she was probably referring to Malachor ancient Sith.
She was stepped of her powers I know but was that Force Push not a TK attack but drain? To me it seems like she was taken out first and then drained.
You claimed that Nihilus' technique of drain was different and I simply proved you wrong. Besides, Vitiate is an ancient sith and he is capable of draining as well. So what am I supposed to think here?
Right, but that doesn't have anything to do with my point, which is that deeper understanding of the Force counters Drain. And we're not entirely sure if she was Drained first, since there's no visual effects to tell us.
No, I didn't. I said the way Kreia described it meant that it was a possibility, so you didn't prove anything "wrong". For all we know, she was referring the ancient Sith who resided on Malachor V, which Vitiate didn't know of.
That logic doesn't work. Traya could Drain as well, but she also got Drained. If you're implying that Vitiate could Drain Nihilus, then his status as a Wound in the Force probably prevents that, although for once I do actually see a possible argument being made for otherwise.
And as I said earlier, even if a deeper understanding of the force by itself isn't enough, it will help Vitiate a lot since he has also superior power and won't be taken out by regular force attacks.
Kreia addresses this very issue and says he is using the same technique. Everytime Kreia mentions the ancient sith, she is talking about the main ones we know of and if she was talking about the sith in Malachor in this case, I think she would be more specific about who she is addressing.
No Nihilus obviously has an advantage in drain department. All I'm saying is it won't give him the victory.
Let me ask you the same question I asked Antboy. Do you think Nihilus could defeat the Father of Mortis?
That's quite vague. "Help a lot"? How so?
She refers to some of the ancient Sith who created Telos's holocrons, not just Sadow, Hord, Ragnos, etc.
That's the biggest red herring I've ever known, lol. For one, I said Vitiate wins, and secondly, the Father's apotheosis elevates him beyond all natural Force users, including Vitiate, who was a born natural Force user who simply became more powerful through a series of complex rituals.
Apocalypse raises the possibility that the Ones were formerly Celestials.
Originally posted by SunRazer
That's quite vague. "Help a lot"? How so?She refers to some of the ancient Sith who created Telos's holocrons, not just Sadow, Hord, Ragnos, etc.
That's the biggest red herring I've ever known, lol. For one, I said Vitiate wins, and secondly, the Father's apotheosis elevates him beyond all natural Force users, including Vitiate, who was a born natural Force user who simply became more powerful through a series of complex rituals.
Apocalypse raises the possibility that the Ones were formerly Celestials.
Well the way I see it, a non darksider would have a harder time against this technique compared to the supreme masters of the dark side and being more powerful overall will surely help him. Besides, Vitiate has TP that I never mentioned cause I don't know if Nihilus would be vulnerable to it. Take example. 😛
Aren't they all kinda from the same tribe? I mean you made it sound like Malachor Sith were a separate dynamic in Sith culture that had knowledge the other sith didn't. If that's the case, she would be more specific for sure.
I'm aware of all that you said about the Ones. I simply asked to understand what your point of view is on Nihilus. Some people don't even have him near top sith tier while others think he can drain whoever he encounters including the Ones.