Originally posted by One Big Mob
What are you even talking about?
This feat applies to Roshi alone now, because of the skill he demonstrated against Jiren.
Originally posted by One Big Mob
What are you even talking about?
This feat applies to Roshi alone now, because of the skill he demonstrated against Jiren.
Originally posted by One Big Mob
How serious are you about this?
Pleading the fifth. 😎
I think it's a fair point, tbh. Any time you introduce a pre existing (presumably) "special talent" late on a franchise, like Roshi showing Goku how to move, it adds a money wrench into earlier showings.
It WOULD clear up a lot of contradictions, like Roshi just barely able to clear past kid Goku, yet somehow able to hold his own against Tien, who is in turn stronger then Taio Pie Pie, who wiped the floor with the same Goku Roshi could only squeek by.
I mean, I know Toriyama wouldn't have put nearly that kind of thought into it, or Roshi's sudden skill, but just saying.
Originally posted by Galan007
How so? Goku just started using UI during the ToP. Does that also 'muddy' all of his showings beforehand, iyo?Unless you have proof that Roshi was using this faux-UI prior to the ToP, then we do not assume he has always been doing so.
That's not how it works. MUI is a defined new ability, that earlier versions of Goku did not have. Roshi's ability to "move well" has no such narrative.
On the contrary, the dialogue from Roshi and Whis suggests this is a skill that comes with age and experience.
Lacking a definitive "unlocking" of his skill, we must assume it's something he was always able to do.
It's the same principle as bullet dodging feats, vs aim dodging, If someone fires a gun in one panel, and the next panel switch's to the hero dodging the bullet, how can you know if he moved faster then the bullets speed, or merely kept ahead of the gunmans aim? You can't.
If it wasn't a new ability for Roshi, then why was Goku(who has not only studied under Roshi since he was a child, but has also watched him fight numerous times) utterly shocked by Roshi's faux-UI?:
https://i.imgur.com/UrQk3sl.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/ecRZIN2.jpg
"What the!? Gramps... How were you moving like that!?"
Goku had clearly NEVER seen Roshi do anything like that before. Therefore we can absolutely infer that it was an ability Roshi had NEVER displayed prior to engaging Jiren in the ToP.
So like I said, that obviously isn't Roshi's default... Which means nothing is 'muddied'. 🙂
I still don't understand how you think snatching automatic bullets out of midair isn't a speed feat because 30 years later he was aim dodging punches. His hands have to react to every bullet and it shown shown in a wide spread. Him moving so well doesn't erase the fact that he has to be fast enough in the first place.
Originally posted by One Big Mob
I still don't understand how you think snatching automatic bullets out of midair isn't a speed feat because 30 years later he was aim dodging punches. His hands have to react to every bullet and it shown shown in a wide spread. Him moving so well doesn't erase the fact that he has to be fast enough in the first place.
For him, it's definitely a feat. I'm not trying to downplay catching bullets.
I'm just saying, the logical application of the feat onto, say, Goku or Krillin, isn't as strong an argument as it once was.
The simpler times of power levels equating to homogenous abilities allowed someone to say if Roshi can do X, a much stronger Krillin can do Y. Now, we have a Z factor, and no real context to place it.
Making Roshi himself a bit of an X factor. Hell, Roshi outright told Goku that strength isn't everything, so it's not like I'm pulling a narrative out of my butt.. Toriyama himself put it into the script. He had Roshi defeat characters with scouters, claiming his power level was laughably low.
Whether he intends to expand on it, or just threw it in there to forget about it later, I have no idea, but I'm kind of interested in knowing how the ability to "move well" relates to power levels, how long he's had this skill, whether it can be learned by other humans (Maybe make them relevent again?)
Roshi getting massive retcons doesn't retroactively apply a technique where his body moves on its own to a certain feat. Especially when all that technique would do is give him a speed feat. A speed feat that only you have had issues with posters bringing up to you.
As you yourself have stated, Roshi was capable of surpassing his limits in Dragonball, but he did so with raw power, not with his "unhittable technique". Had what you're saying been the case, he would have been portrayed a lot faster than the kids and Tien, and not portrayed as directly comparable in power. Hell, the ****ing guy died because he had no way to beat King Piccolo, but we're led to believe he had a technique back then that could have allowed him to dodge every attack?
Contrary to what Toriyama says, an explanation would be that Roshi was getting stronger throughout the series, as evidenced by King Piccolo skirmish. What I mean by that, is that it makes no sense at all for him to just die when he actually had enough power that he was holding back that could have murdered KP with a finger poke.
Among some other things, but basically blocking bullets doesn't equal some sort of technique where the body moves on its own, nor does Roshi's power increase necessitate this technique in motion when he got hit a lot in those fights.
Originally posted by Galan007So apparently the manga's rendition of the Broly arc will indeed begin this month... They aren't wasting any time.
So according to The Tokyo Skytree History of DB exhibit, the "long-awaited new chapter/storyline" of DBS starts in the extra-large issue of V-Jump, on sale November 21st.Wonder if it will be the Broly arc, or something else entirely... mmm
Too bad. I was hoping they'd have the ToP play out a bit longer.
