Dragon Ball Discussion Thread

From here on, I guess I'm just gonna refer to the new Cell as Bio-Cell; as in Bio-Broly, a bastardized version of the original.

Anyway, apparently Norio Wakamoto voices Bio-Cell, who was Cell's Japanese VA in the original anime... If the english version is just the same voice as 2nd form Cell or something though, I'll still detest it. Plus, will have to see whether he gets any substantial lines to begin with beyond yelling like when he was crying to Vegeta before absorbing 18.

That's another complement to the 1st form and Perfect form though, they had good unique voices.

https://twitter.com/matoirisu/status/1535796166368997381?s=21&t=BzC17pLAq0-D1cQ5ahp5og

😂

Ran out of time to edit my post (the 15 minute limit has always been a dogshit feature of this site), but apparently the Super movie was written before the Granolah arc, when you had Granolah wishing to become stronger. That makes Piccolo wishing for it even worse, since he was the first one to do it I guess.

Every facet of this movie sounds like complete dogshit, tbh. Seems like a massive downgrade from the Broly movie.

Also it is mentioned that in TOP the gap between the saiyans and Jiren wasnt that Big he had the advantage on them mainly because of his meditation technique and calmness through out the fight...haermm

Originally posted by Galan007
Every facet of this movie sounds like complete dogshit, tbh. Seems like a massive downgrade from the Broly movie.

I might actually hate Super Hero more than Resurrection F, and that was pretty disappointing coming after Battle of the Gods.

Originally posted by Estacado
Also it is mentioned that in TOP the gap between the saiyans and Jiren wasnt that Big he had the advantage on them mainly because of his meditation technique and calmness through out the fight...haermm

Toriyama has to have some form of dementia or something. He's pretty open about his forgetfulness, which goes for his own series and just everything around him, but his team and protege should be reminding and correcting him on what's what as far as what had been established. It seems though they just follow through together on things on a whim without much planning or thought, and so you get all this goofy retcon shit, which fans see right through.

If one were to make a list on things Toriyama has forgotten, it would be pretty long. During production of Battle of the Gods, he accidentally drew 18's hair purple instead of blond. Just even little things like that he forgot at first, it would be a hell of a list. I think it's both just forgetting and not really giving a shit though. Feels like he just brought Dragon Ball back when he did out of obligation because of the series' popularity, not so much because he wanted to. Dragon Ball Evolution you could argue being a factor in Tori's hand being forced too, as Japan didn't want that film to be the last thing the series was remembered for. It's just... interesting how we've gotten to this point with the series regardless.

Yup Jiren was hyped up for his raw power nothing else they mentioned nothing about his meditation technique.

Also we dont even know how Strong is Orange Piccolo or Final Gohan.....they only fight gamma 1 and 2 we have no idea how Strong those guys are or how tough Cell Max is....

I cant even recall how Strong they were in TOP compared to Blue Goku for example...

Spoiler:
Final Gohan literally does nothing in the movie besides taking a punch from Cell Max and knocking him down after he kills hÃ_m with special beam canon. His screen Time is barely a minute.

Watched the camrip. I'd probably put this above RoF, but below BoG and obviously Broly.

Spoiler:
-At least Goten/Trunks finally aged-up.
-I actually enjoyed all of the new characters aside from Cell Max(who is basically just a giant red version of Semi-Perfect Cell, which was painfully stupid.)
-Like Esta mentioned, it's virtually impossible to know how strong Golden Piccolo and Gohan the Grey are... Though I'd imagine they are at least comfortably in the same tier as SSB Goku/Vegeta, given their wank. /shrug
-I really hope the abuse of wishes from the Dragon does get addressed in future stories... That's one thing GT did right.

Dub trailer.

YouTube video

Even got BvS Doomsday vibes at the end with that giant sphere thing I assume the big red monster comes out of.

Gotta love how Gohan fans say:

Final Gohan=MUI=Ultra ego...

The base of this is being his sparring with Goku Blue...making Ultimate Gohan=SSB in their mind...

My question is what did Gohan do to earn this power. With Z you saw his progression and how he got to each form, and Goku & Vegeta in DBS from them training with gods and angels for years. The Final Gohan form just happened because.. he got mad again?

Future Trunks in the anime got his new form the same way admittedly, but he was never on the sidelines like Gohan and was always fighting. Hell, that arc would have been the right time for Gohan to get back into action when Trunks warned him about the future again, but instead Gohan just sat there carefree while eating ice cream. Even ToP Gohan was a disappointment (though not as much in the manga). Him suddenly being on the level of Goku and Vegeta again is just shoehorned. Dont care what Toriyama says, who doesnt remember most of his own series anyway.

When has Gohan ever done anything to get the power he has though? Besides training with Gokou in the Spirit and Time Room, and going from one of the weakest to the strongest person alive in one year, Gohan has never done anything to achieve his power. As a coddled baby, he was above Raditz. He had his power unlocked on Namek and was able to at least get to 2nd form Freeza level for no reason. SSJ2 needed a death from someone he didn't even know. Ultimate Gohan, just another power unlock. And anger has always been a trigger for Gohan to do more.

The rage boosts was mostly when Gohan was a kid though. The child rage shtick wasn't really there when he became an adult.

The SSJ2 wasn't triggered just by 16's death, but that on top of his family and friends being slowly killed by the Cell Jr's. If Gohan had something that painful happen to him again which triggered the "Final Gohan" form, I would've been more fine with it, but from what I understand with the movie, he kinda just gets the form out of nowhere.

Final Gohan unlocks when ..

Spoiler:
he sees Cell max beating Piccolo and for a few seconds the eyes of him turn blank making Gohan think he got killed which causes him to snap. The animation is almost exactly the same as when he went Ssj2 first time.
Its pretty much impossible to get an estimation of his power cause all he does is take take a punch from Cell max without any effect after he knocks him back and kills him with special beam canon while Piccolo holds him in place. Also the beam is aimed at Cell Max weak point. His appearance in the movie is not even a minute long...

Also this is Gohan with university scholar power up...imagine how Strong Goku would have been if he attanded university...uhuh

As Galan said going by common sense at Best Final Gohan is around Ssb level maybe a bit above definetly not as Strong As KKx10 Blue or Evolution.

Originally posted by Ridley_Prime
The rage boosts was mostly when Gohan was a kid though. The child rage shtick wasn't really there when he became an adult.

The SSJ2 wasn't triggered just by 16's death, but that on top of his family and friends being slowly killed by the Cell Jr's. If Gohan had something that painful happen to him again which triggered the "Final Gohan" form, I would've been more fine with it, but from what I understand with the movie, he kinda just gets the form out of nowhere.

But it was 16's death that set him off. His friends were getting beaten up and killed before that, and the sad outweighed the anger.

Also, as was said, there is a trigger for Gohan's final form. It was basically ssj2 Gohan scene redone.

Also, gotta love how Cell Saga, too big of muscles and you get slow. Super Hero, hey lets have Piccolo get huge muscular form and not lose speed or power.

Also, next saga, Vegeta and Gokou wish for their power to be unlocked. 😆 Just watch.

Originally posted by Estacado
As Galan said going by common sense at Best Final Gohan is around Ssb level maybe a bit above definetly not as Strong As KKx10 Blue or Evolution.

Yeah, I guess that's what I get for questioning how Gohan gets the new form before seeing the whole movie, even if it is mostly all an imitation of the Cell Games as I suspected.

The power weighted forms (becoming slower as a result of big muscles) never made much sense to begin with. With Piccolo though it could argued that the rest of his body more proportionally adjusts to compensate for the muscles. Or is just weird Namekian magic.

Besides that, if just having big muscles makes you slower in Dragon Ball, then Broly (either version) would've become slower once reaching LSSJ, Jiren would've become slower when he bulked up near the end of the ToP, etc.

The one point where it makes sense that someone is slower is Oozaru form, and that's a size thing, not muscles. Frieza's "final form" at 100% makes more sense as a bulky form too, since it comes at the cost of stamina instead of speed.

The power weighted forms of the Cell saga themselves are just arbitrarily slow, which only certain users had like Trunks and Perfect Cell. If those forms increased their strength in every way though at the cost of speed and agility, would using any ki based moves (Kamehameha, etc) be stronger in those forms too as a result? Or is it just punches that are made stronger? Begs the question since we didn't really see Trunks use a big ki move when bulked up.

Originally posted by Kento
Well, I mean it was still a thing though. Just growing up keeps him from just flying off in a rage. That's why it was harder for the ssj2 transformation, and why he couldn't do it against Fat Buu. But when Videl got hurt, the anger power boost was still there. Just needed more of a trigger.

But it was 16's death that set him off. His friends were getting beaten up and killed before that, and the sad outweighed the anger.

Also, as was said, there is a trigger for Gohan's final form. It was basically ssj2 Gohan scene redone.

Also, gotta love how Cell Saga, too big of muscles and you get slow. Super Hero, hey lets have Piccolo get huge muscular form and not lose speed or power.

Also, next saga, Vegeta and Gokou wish for their power to be unlocked. 😆 Just watch.

Well, movie versions haven't shown the Evolution or KKx10 Blue. And as the movies are their own continuity combining and removing things that are manga or anime only, it's totally possible that White Haired Gohan is above Gokou and Vegeta movieverse. Piccolo has seen, and sensed Gokou and Vegeta going all out, and says Gamma 2 is almost at the saiyans level, and Ultimate Gohan/Orange Piccolo were above the Gammas. So, at best, Gohan is above Broly movie Gokou and Vegeta, and trying to find out where he fits into the anime or manga in power is futile.

Oo didn't know Piccolo said that about the androids...although its pretty stupid someone could easily create Ssb level threats imo..

In that case since Blue is the highest level for Goku and Vegeta in the movies Final Gohan should definetly be stronger Than those versions...

The best part of the movie is Piccolo yelling at Gohan for being a bad parent. 😆

The movie was ok. Extremely random though. With little to no reason for the actions taken.

How about this weeks manga? Not sure I fully understand what happened lol