Originally posted by Time-Immemorial
So you resort to trolling when you have nothing else to say.I found the story extremely interesting, this has nothing to do with a progressive agenda, and I would like to see your pee brain make an argument for that so I can knock it down, just like I did you.
Originally posted by psmith81992
That's not an easy question even on general principles. So the response would be, "there should be prisons for rehabilitation and prisons where we throw away the key."
Originally posted by Omega Vision
Except for the most serious offenders, I don't really see the point in making "throw-away-the-key" prisons. Other than psychotics, who are either kept in asylums or in special sections of regular prisons, pretty much anyone has the *potential* for rehabilitation. I think prisons should always be invested in the future of their inmates, not as much in their past or present. Granted, many inmates won't change no matter what opportunities you give them, but the opportunity should be there.
Not for murders (whether it's mass or first degree). No, I don't believe they in particular should have the opportunity.
Originally posted by psmith81992
Not for murders (whether it's mass or first degree). No, I don't believe they in particular should have the opportunity.
Originally posted by psmith81992
That's not an easy question even on general principles.
Note that the countries with the lowest reincarceration rates per captia have the best prisons. In Scandinavian countries prisoners have access to vocational education and training that yield the same credentials as the education available to the general public, so when they get out they can start working honestly and contribute to society by paying tax.
So he'd want to live under a government with the right to execute its citizens, or alternatively have the taxpayers provide food and housing for people convicted for murder for the rest of their lives?Basically what you're saying is that he's an idiot.
No, I'd rather live in your fantasy world where anyone can commit any sort of a crime and be "rehabilitated". Talk about idiotic.
Actually, it's a very easy question answer, just ask yourself whether you'd want a prisoner who have served his time or gotten out on parole rehabilitated when released?
Obviously a prisoner who has gotten out or is getting out fits the criteria of rehabilitation. That much was never in question. The argument was regarding everybody being eligible for rehabilitation or only a certain group of people.
So please, stop embarrassing yourself.
Note that the countries with the lowest reincarceration rates per captia have the best prisons. In Scandinavian countries prisoners have access to vocational education and training that yield the same credentials as the education available to the general public, so when they get out they can start working honestly and contribute to society by paying tax.
Originally posted by Omega Vision
I think there are lots of possible gradations even in first degree murder. For lots of young men who grow up in gang-infested areas they get indoctrinated into a gang culture and end up killing someone before they're even an adult. In some cases (not all, mind you), this is analogous to what happens to child soldiers in wartorn countries, and very few people would say that child soldiers, even ones who've committed war crimes, don't at least deserve a fair chance at rehabilitation.
Originally posted by psmith81992I won't get into the rest of this but he has demonstrated strong evidence by giving examples of countries where high access to rehabilitation has led to low retention in prisons.When you have strong evidence showing the strength of this correlation, then your argument will have merit.
We could also show a country the US where less access to these programs have lead to a high reincarceration rate for our prisoners.
Originally posted by Newjak
I won't get into the rest of this but he has demonstrated strong evidence by giving examples of countries where high access to rehabilitation has led to low retention in prisons.We could also show a country the US where less access to these programs have lead to a high reincarceration rate for our prisoners.
I'd like to see a breakdown by crimes, whether low retention happened first or was as a result of rehabilitation programs, etc. Further, we need to stop taking a country that has a correlation of some kind, and say "we should do what they're doing." It sounds ridiculous each time. Great, we have the most millionaires on the planet, everyone should do what WE do because it works! No.