No level of natural athletics can compare to the enhancements the Force provides whatsoever, nor does any human naturally possess the physical ability to properly perform the sophisticated sequences of Jedi combat. Without the force they also lack their predictive abilities and heightened senses in general. All in all, a Jedi without the force trying to engage in lightsaber combat is pretty dangerous. To himself, mostly.
The closest case of it actually being possible is someone who doesn't practice physically impossible Jedi styles, has trained in using a lightsaber for decades without the force, and supplements himself with technology and additional weaponry; that's Pre-Vizsla. Even then, he can't best Ahsoka or Maul because he lacks the Force. Had Ahsoka or Maul lost their ability to use the Force, they wouldn't have even been a match for him; because they're reliant on the sensory aid of the Force. Not to mention how much of their arsenal would taken away by their physical incapability to perform the stunts that they do with the Force's aid.
Without the Force, the vast majority of Jedi are all but disarmed. Sure, they're still better off than most muggles, but the same can be said of Sidious--for a man of his years, at least.
I think they're right on Sheev's raw unaugmented physicality tbh.
They're hilariously wrong on his skill though. He's confirmed in numerous sources to be a master of lightsaber combat, a master of every form of lightsaber combat, etc. But they dismiss it because it's just too "unrealistic" for Sheev to have developed those skills and maintained them without practice. Darth Plagueis's training was ****ing intense, so yeah it makes sense for him to have developed those skills. As far as maintaining them goes, he's a ****ing Sith Lord. These people can do crazy mind related shit with the Force. ****in POD Bane was sifting through a Rancor's memories like it was nothing. I find it difficult to believe that the most powerful Sith ever can't hold knowledge of lightsaber combat in his mind despite a lack of practice.
Originally posted by NewGuy01
"Sidious is a master of every weapon and every style." -NG
"Sidious has a style that's constantly changing, but in a way
that you'll never get the better of him. The style is ambigious
- he'll fight less than you and draw you in. You're a sucker if
you think you're going to better him."
"Sidious' abilities are beyond anything we've experienced."
"Palpatine is ambidextrous with his saber. He's THAT good."
Originally posted by quanchi112
Ye of little faith. I'll burn the Internet to ashes to destroy your vaunted dark lord of the Sith to the superior Khan Noonien Singh. If you people thought Darth Ant is relentless wait until you get a load of me.
Nice speech, but it has nothing to do with what I said.
Originally posted by Fated Xtasy
Isn't that always the case for these guys? Save Antoine.
I didn't know two of them. I saw Jensaarai's Yoda vs Vader video though and haven't taken him seriously since. Youtubers are prone to overthink things though...
Originally posted by Trocity
You might legitimately be retarded.
Might?
Originally posted by NewGuy01
"Sidious is a master of every weapon and every style." -NG
See, this is why Jensaarai1 and co. are geniuses. They actually THINK! They use imagination, common sense and logic. They read between the lines. You idiot fanboys by contrast read one quote and immediately stop thinking. I guess it's too hard for you.
Yes Palpatine was "a master of every weapon and every style." Doesn't change the fact that he hasn't practised in decades. He's not a lightsabre enthusiast and even if he was he didn't have time to train and couldn't practise as he had to maintain his cover. Yes he trained Maul but that was before he even became a senator. Even then Palpatine wasn't really pushing himself.
This is just common sense. A "master" who doesn't train for decades will get rusty. Before anyone points to Ulic Qel-Droma, he was merely blocking Sylvar's attacks and giving ground, not trying to strike back or actually kill her. That's not unfeasible.
Likewise Cin Dralig was also "a master of every weapon and every style." Anakin still beat him with ease. "A master of every weapon and every style" is open to interpretation. Really it just means you know how to do the moves, not NECCESSARILY that you're good at applying them in combat. Dooku comments on this in "Labyrinth of Evil."
Just watch Palpatine in combat. They point out in the video that in his fight against the Zabrak brothers he does a ton of sloppy moves that only work because of Force augmentation. Likewise Kit Fisto, a guy who isn't as fast or as powerful as Palpatine and who uses a style that's weak in single combat against skilled Force-users, was still able to block a few strikes.
Again, THINK. Don't just ignore logic and common sense because of some quote.
Originally posted by cs zoltan
I didn't know two of them. I saw Jensaarai's Yoda vs Vader video though and haven't taken him seriously since.
Well that's dumb. A guy makes ONE bad call about one specific thing so you dismiss EVERYTHING else he says. Yeah, really dumb.
Plus in his more recent "Yoda vs. Darth Malak" video he apologises for the "Yoda vs Vader" one, admits that he let personal bias cloud his judgement and then gives a much more accurate assessment of Yoda's capabilities.