Star Wars TFA vs ANH

Originally posted by Nephthys
Right...... Except that Finn's plot through the movie has no equivalent in ANH. Nor does Rey's actually. Nor Poe's. Nor Kylo Ren's. Nor Han's. Maz has no equivalent in ANH either. So basically every major characters plotline differs significantly from ANH. Even BB-8's plot is pretty different. Theres no C3PO stand-in and instead of trying to get to Obi-Wan he's sticks with Rey mostly.

You're pointing out differences which are quite normal to have in a rehash. Do you really expect a Copy to be an Exact Copy?

Anyway Poe is playing Leia's role. Being chased by the FO, hides the plans in his droid. Sends droid off on his own with a mission to get those plans to the Resistance. Total commitment to the "Resistance" Gets captured tortured. Gets rescued by an odd "stormtrooper." But yes, very different to Leia as well, but from the beginning he was taking her place in this ANH revamp.

Rey was clearly Luke. No explanation needed.

BB8 was R2. Again no explanation needed.

Han was Old Ben. Mentor to the new younger heroes. Previous Father/Mentor figure to the Villain. Confronts him and dies.

Kylo Ren- Clearly Darth Vader from the opening scene (in fact the whole Opening sequence was a mirage of the ANH opening sequence). Ex-Jedi, betrayed his Fellow Jedi and murdered them.

Finn - He's the one big difference between ANH and TFA. Which is probably why he was the most refreshing character in the film.

Other "Minor" similarities to ANH:

First Order - The Empire.
Resistance - Rebellion.
Starkiller Base - Death Star.

^ These three things together just made the entire setting too similar to ANH that just made it difficult for them to avoid copying pretty much the same plot.

Originally posted by Nephthys
If you're talking about what I think you are, then I didn't say that your opinion was wrong I said that you were wrong about a specific thing in the movie. Which you were. You brought up your persecution complex so I corrected you about that.

The only one being a douche is CPT Space Bomb, because he's a dickhead, others are perfectly capable of debating the movie like always have done so. But from what I've seen you just moan about no one listening to you because its an echo chamber. Like you just did, despite no-one up till then saying TFA is better. You can say that you're open to differing opinions but your incredibly bitter comments suggest otherwise. I just think you should tone down on the complaining about bias when your own opinion is coloring your posts to heavily.

**** you for saying Finn doesn't matter though.

This big speech about how I'm the one with biases and that other opinions are totally accepted by everyone(except CPT, you threw him under the bus fast)...and then you end it with a **** you, this character is great and you're wrong.

In my entire conversation with most others regarding the film, Finn comes up almost none of the time. The conversations are usually regarding Ben as a villain, Rey as a Mary Sue(or rather if she is one, which she isn't technically), and how BB-8 is the best character. Finn is utterly ignored, at least in the conversations I've had.

Not that any of this is to discredit the actor. He did a fine job. But no, I don't care about Finn. Not one little bit. Don't hate him though. He's just nothing to me. Sorta like Boba Fett.

Originally posted by Darth Thor
You're pointing out differences which are quite normal to have in a rehash. Do you really expect a Copy to be an Exact Copy?

Anyway Poe is playing Leia's role. Being chased by the FO, hides the plans in his droid. Sends droid off on his own with a mission to get those plans to the Resistance. Total commitment to the "Resistance" Gets captured tortured. Gets rescued by an odd "stormtrooper." But yes, very different to Leia as well, but from the beginning he was taking her place in this ANH revamp.

Rey was clearly Luke. No explanation needed.

BB8 was R2. Again no explanation needed.

Han was Old Ben. Mentor to the new younger heroes. Previous Father/Mentor figure to the Villain. Confronts him and dies.

Kylo Ren- Clearly Darth Vader from the opening scene (in fact the whole Opening sequence was a mirage of the ANH opening sequence). Ex-Jedi, betrayed his Fellow Jedi and murdered them.

Finn - He's the one big difference between ANH and TFA. Which is probably why he was the most refreshing character in the film.

Other "Minor" similarities to ANH:

First Order - The Empire.
Resistance - Rebellion.
Starkiller Base - Death Star.

^ These three things together just made the entire setting too similar to ANH that just made it difficult for them to avoid copying pretty much the same plot.

You're missing his point. Yes, the character share the same superficial roles. But the characters themselves are almost entirely different.

Edit: And the plot is different. People get way to caught up with the similarities between Starkiller Base and the Death Star. The primary plot is about the search for Luke; Starkiller Base was merely a subplot.

Originally posted by Nephthys
The only one being a douche is CPT Space Bomb, because he's a dickhead, others are perfectly capable of debating the movie like always have done so.

Originally posted by AuraAngel
This big speech about how I'm the one with biases and that other opinions are totally accepted by everyone(except CPT, you threw him under the bus fast)...and then you end it with a **** you, this character is great and you're wrong.

In my entire conversation with most others regarding the film, Finn comes up almost none of the time. The conversations are usually regarding Ben as a villain, Rey as a Mary Sue(or rather if she is one, which she isn't technically), and how BB-8 is the best character. Finn is utterly ignored, at least in the conversations I've had.

Not that any of this is to discredit the actor. He did a fine job. But no, I don't care about Finn. Not one little bit. Don't hate him though. He's just nothing to me. Sorta like Boba Fett.

I wasn't seriously telling you to **** off. It was a joke.

I'm really surprised that you didn't care for Finn. He has a fantastic introduction setting him up sympathetically, he's funny and charming and in general he has a lot of earnestness and heart to him. People don't talk about him because theres not much else to say, imo. He's really cool and I've not seen much argument anywhere on that.

Originally posted by Nephthys
I wasn't seriously telling you to **** off. It was a joke.

Originally posted by Darth Thor
You're pointing out differences which are quite normal to have in a rehash. Do you really expect a Copy to be an Exact Copy?

Anyway Poe is playing Leia's role. Being chased by the FO, hides the plans in his droid. Sends droid off on his own with a mission to get those plans to the Resistance. Total commitment to the "Resistance" Gets captured tortured. Gets rescued by an odd "stormtrooper." But yes, very different to Leia as well, but from the beginning he was taking her place in this ANH revamp.

I don't see it. His role in the movie is totally different from Leia's and follows different plot beats.

Originally posted by Darth Thor
Rey was clearly Luke. No explanation needed.

Except her character arc is completely different from Luke's and theres not really much similar about them tbh. She has a totally different plot throughout the movie thats nothing like Lukes and she does completely different things from him the whole way through.

Originally posted by Darth Thor
BB8 was R2. Again no explanation needed.

Meh, superficially.

Originally posted by Darth Thor
Han was Old Ben. Mentor to the new younger heroes. Previous Father/Mentor figure to the Villain. Confronts him and dies.

Completely different character arc. Completely different plot line. Does completely different things.

Originally posted by Darth Thor
Kylo Ren- Clearly Darth Vader from the opening scene (in fact the whole Opening sequence was a mirage of the ANH opening sequence). Ex-Jedi, betrayed his Fellow Jedi and murdered them.

Completely different character arc. Completely different plot line. Does completely different things.

Originally posted by Darth Thor
Finn - He's the one big difference between ANH and TFA. Which is probably why he was the most refreshing character in the film.

Cool.

Originally posted by ares834
You're missing his point. Yes, the character share the same superficial roles. But the characters themselves are almost entirely different.

Edit: And the plot is different. People get way to caught up with the similarities between Starkiller Base and the Death Star. The primary plot is about the search for Luke; Starkiller Base was merely a subplot.

Originally posted by Nephthys
I wasn't seriously telling you to **** off. It was a joke.

I'm really surprised that you didn't care for Finn. He has a fantastic introduction setting him up sympathetically, he's funny and charming and in general he has a lot of earnestness and heart to him. People don't talk about him because theres not much else to say, imo. He's really cool and I've not seen much argument anywhere on that.

I know. I'm just self-conscious about my tiny package.

It's mostly cause of the bar scene. Mazz says something to the effect that he has the eyes of someone who wants to run and then he....proceeds to prove her correct lol. While it isn't one to one obviously, it does make me think of Han "leaving" at the end of a New Hope because he has zero reason to stay. Han comes back because he has grown fond of Luke(and Leia I suppose) while Finn sticks around to save Rey. It really comes down to their roles in the climax. Without Han, the Rebellion ends on Yavon. End of story. Finn on the other hand...well Rey was handling herself rather well. He really didn't know how to bring down the shields so the heroes needed to think of something else(can't recall if that was his plan or not). While he also gets to fight Ren, his biggest contribution there was ultimately getting the lightsabre in the right place for Rey to get it. He doesn't even get a proper ending, he's just out cold by the end. I wanted more was all.

Again I should stress that the cast of actors is fantastic. They're definitely doing their damndest and my only issues with the characters are in the writing.

I will give TFA one thing, and that is the main villains had more of a presence then Vader and the emperor in ANH

This is a peculiar observation given that the emperor wasn't in ANH and Ren and his angsty teenage temper tantrums don't come close to Vader's intimidation.

Originally posted by Nephthys
I don't see it. His role in the movie is totally different from Leia's and follows different plot beats.

He's got the swagger of a Han Solo, and he's obviously a pilot, not a Prince. But his role in the film closely resembles Leia's. He's the guy with the Resistance. He's the one who's on the mission to get these plans, and he's the one who hides them in his droid on a dessert planet, he's the one who gets captured and escapes with help.

Also like Leia, his character doesn't change during the film. He's the same person at the beginning that he is at the end, very unlike Han Solo, Luke Skywalker (ANH) and very unlike Finn and Poe in TFA.

Originally posted by Nephthys
Except her character arc is completely different from Luke's and theres not really much similar about them tbh. She has a totally different plot throughout the movie thats nothing like Lukes and she does completely different things from him the whole way through.

She (Rey) is without any parents on a dessert planet, but has a greater destiny with the Force which she's reluctant to accept when she first meets Han, until she's told her parents are not coming back. She loves ships and it a great pilot. The end of the movie comes down to her and Kylo on Starkillerbase, where she discovers the true power of the Force in herself.

He (Luke) was an Orphan on a dessert planet, but has a greater destiny with the Force which he's reluctant to accept when he first meets Old Ben, until he's seen his adopted parents are dead. He loves ships and is a great pilot. The end of the movie comes down to him and Vader where he discovers the true power of the Force in himself.

^ Pretty damn similar arc IMO.

Originally posted by Nephthys
Meh, superficially.

But same plot of him carrying the hidden plans.

Originally posted by Nephthys
Completely different character arc. Completely different plot line. Does completely different things.

Completely different character arc. Completely different plot line. Does completely different things.

Old Ben comes across Luke who is in trouble. Tells Luke of how Vader was once his pupil who betrayed and murdered the Jedi. Old Ben asks Luke to come with him and to join him. Old Ben confronts his former Apprentice and dies at his hands, but not before making sure the Tractor beam was out of commission so the Rebellion could destroy the Death Star.

Old Han comes across Rey who is in trouble. Tells Rey how Kylo Ren (his son) betrayed and murdered the Jedi. Old Han asks Rey to come with him and to join his crew. Old Han confronts his Son and dies at his hands, but not before making sure he implanted the explosives so the Resistance could destroy the Stakiller Base.

^ Sounds like pretty similar Character Arcs and Roles to me despite the differences in personalities and job descriptions that you're pointing out.

On top of that:

Resistance = Rebellion

First Order = Empire

Starkillerbase = Death Star

Plot revolving around hidden plans in a droid = Plot revolving around hidden plans in a droid

This film was a blatant rehash of ANH, just in a sequel format, and with some changes (obviously) including new personalities. And even people praising this movie are not denying that, so not sure why you are. It's a very fair criticism of the film tbh. Whether it bothers you or not is a different thing.

TFA is one of the highest rated Star Wars movies ever. And again, it has the chance to be the highest grossing movie ever. There is a whole lot of butthurt over this movie; it's quite entertaining.

None of that excuses the film of its faults that people find with its writing or criticism of how much it borrows from ANH. Just because a movie is financial successful doesn't mean is should be excused from this that are actually wrong with.

Originally posted by wakkawakkawakka
None of that excuses the film of its faults that people find with its writing or criticism of how much it borrows from ANH. Just because a movie is financial successful doesn't mean is should be excused from this that are actually wrong with.

TFA is an inferior remake of ANH.

Originally posted by jaden101
This is a peculiar observation given that the emperor wasn't in ANH and Ren and his angsty teenage temper tantrums don't come close to Vader's intimidation.

As for Vader he did have an intimidating look but did not come off as very intimidating to me, until ESB. Ren started off more intimidating. I agree that faded as they made him emotionally unstable.

Originally posted by Mindset
TFA is an inferior remake of ANH.

Originally posted by quanchi112
Nah, ANH is overrated. Even Lucas himself was greatly disappointed with it.

Originally posted by Mindset
And yet TFA is still an inferior remake.

Originally posted by quanchi112
You are crazy. The acting in ANH is awful. TFA is better across the board. It isn't close. Maybe you like shitty acting.