Vader vs Grievous

Originally posted by FreshestSlice
I'll look again, but you mind explaining how you doubt Vader could do something defensive Kenobi did without any effort?

EDIT: He says Grevious was only a first step. Unless you think he meant a step backwards, Karbin is supposed to be an improvement. Considering he hasn't gotten the upper hand on Vader at all, quite the opposite, he's obviously not comparable to Vader.

Not that I think Grievous would beat Vader. But that could very well be Cylo jerkin off his own work, and it says nothing about the difference in lightsaber skill between Grievous and Karbin.

@Freshest: Grievous overloaded Kenobi's defense - his victory was hardly without effort.

I'm not seeing how that scan confirms Karbin > Grievous...

He literally just decided Grevious was hitting him too much so he chopped his arm off. 😬

Because it's flat out said?

Originally posted by |King Joker|
@Freshest: Grievous overloaded Kenobi's defense - his victory was hardly without effort.

I'm not seeing how that scan confirms Karbin > Grievous...

Tell me at which point during the fight exactly does Grievous overload Kenobi's defense?

@Freshest: At the very least it's implied that Karbin is technologically more sophisticated - but nowhere is it stated or implied he's more skilled than Grievous.

@Valerian: After all, he had often walked unscathed through hornet-swarms of blasterfire, defended only by the Force's direction of his blade; countering twelve blows per second was only difficult, not impossible. His blade wove an intricate web of angles and curves, never truly fast but always just fast enough, each motion of his lightsaber subtly interfering with three or four or eight of the general's strikes, the rest sizzling past him, his precise, minimal shifts of weight and stance slipping them by centimeters.

Grievous, snarling fury, ramped up the intensity and velocity of his attacks-sixteen per second, eighteen-until finally, at twenty strikes per second, he overloaded Obi-Wan's defense. So Obi-Wan used his defense to attack. A subtle shift in the angle of a single parry brought Obi-Wan's blade in contact not with the blade of the oncoming lightsaber, but with the handgrip. -slice-

The blade winked out of existence a hairbreadth before it would have burned through Obi-Wan's forehead. Half the severed lightsaber skittered away, along with the duranium thumb and first finger of the hand that had held it. -Revenge of the Sith Novelization

Originally posted by |King Joker|
@Freshest: At the very least it's implied that Karbin is technologically more sophisticated - but nowhere is it stated or implied he's more skilled than Grievous.

@Valerian: After all, he had often walked unscathed through hornet-swarms of blasterfire, defended only by the Force's direction of his blade; countering twelve blows per second was only difficult, not impossible. His blade wove an intricate web of angles and curves, never truly fast but always just fast enough, each motion of his lightsaber subtly interfering with three or four or eight of the general's strikes, the rest sizzling past him, his precise, minimal shifts of weight and stance slipping them by centimeters.

[b]Grievous, snarling fury, ramped up the intensity and velocity of his attacks-sixteen per second, eighteen-until finally, at twenty strikes per second, he overloaded Obi-Wan's defense. So Obi-Wan used his defense to attack. A subtle shift in the angle of a single parry brought Obi-Wan's blade in contact not with the blade of the oncoming lightsaber, but with the handgrip. -slice-

The blade winked out of existence a hairbreadth before it would have burned through Obi-Wan's forehead. Half the severed lightsaber skittered away, along with the duranium thumb and first finger of the hand that had held it. -Revenge of the Sith Novelization [/B]

Yeah I highly doubt Karbin > Grievous, if Grievous is even being described as the first step. He was trained in and mastered multiple forms of lightsaber combat by one of the greatest duellists of the age, if not history, and built on that with innumerable engagements with elite Jedi.

Having a better design (if that's even the case, this Mon Cal chicken looks pretty dumb) isn't going to grant Karbin Grievous' level of skill, experience or ingenuity. In fact I'd question if he's trained in the classic forms at all, Cylo doesn't exactly have any holocrons.

EDIT: And isn't this Legends Grievous? If so the Canon Vader comic isn't even applicable.

Meh. Karbin hasn't impressed me as much as I was hoping.

Originally posted by |King Joker|
@Freshest: At the very least it's implied that Karbin is technologically more sophisticated - but nowhere is it stated or implied he's more skilled than Grievous.

@Beni: Even if you say it is Legends Grievous, you'd have to go through the trouble of explaining why Vader would have anymore trouble than Obi-Wan did in RotS or TCW; it obviously wasn't his amazing Soresu that pulled that win.

Originally posted by |King Joker|

@Valerian: After all, he had often walked unscathed through hornet-swarms of blasterfire, defended only by the Force's direction of his blade; countering twelve blows per second was only difficult, not impossible. His blade wove an intricate web of angles and curves, never truly fast but always just fast enough, each motion of his lightsaber subtly interfering with three or four or eight of the general's strikes, the rest sizzling past him, his precise, minimal shifts of weight and stance slipping them by centimeters.

[b]Grievous, snarling fury, ramped up the intensity and velocity of his attacks-sixteen per second, eighteen-until finally, at twenty strikes per second, he overloaded Obi-Wan's defense. So Obi-Wan used his defense to attack. A subtle shift in the angle of a single parry brought Obi-Wan's blade in contact not with the blade of the oncoming lightsaber, but with the handgrip. -slice-

The blade winked out of existence a hairbreadth before it would have burned through Obi-Wan's forehead. Half the severed lightsaber skittered away, along with the duranium thumb and first finger of the hand that had held it. -Revenge of the Sith Novelization [/B]

So... He overloaded Kenobi's defense for mere seconds before getting his hand cut off... In the novelization, which is lower canon than the movie. In the movie, we can see it doesn't take Kenobi that much effort to cut off Grievous's attack, tbh.

^ You can't really see how easy or difficult it was for Kenobi. We only see how long it took him to defeat Grievous.

But then counting the wider Canon (TCW), it's obvious Grievous certainly isn't easy pickings for him (Yes I know Kenobi had improved by ROTS but so had Grievous).

If anything, it looked like Kenobi was straining even if he cut off Grievous's arms quickly.

Maybe, but straining for like ten seconds before absolutely destroying him. Movie or novelization, it's noticeable that Grievous was not the biggest of challenges for Kenobi. He had a lot more trouble with guys like Maul, Ventress or Savage.

Originally posted by FreshestSlice
@Beni: Even if you say it is Legends Grievous, you'd have to go through the trouble of explaining why Vader would have anymore trouble than Obi-Wan did in RotS or TCW; it obviously wasn't his amazing Soresu that pulled that win.

Also please size your photos properly. 🙂

Originally posted by Beniboybling
I never said Grievous would win, merely that he's better than Karbin.

Also please size your photos properly. 🙂

Originally posted by EmperorSidious2
What makes you think Grevious would win easily IYO?

Well that was mostly to get that response out of Freshest but basically Grievous is faster, more agile equal or greater in endurance, strength and durability and is likely more skilled given he stalemated Mace whilst hindered.

Vader's Force powers would easily overwhelm Grievous.

Originally posted by Col. Valerian
Vader's Force powers would easily overwhelm Grievous.

Yeah but this is sabers only is it not?

Right, forgot about that.