TPM vs TFA

Originally posted by The Ellimist
It's the exact opposite, actually, lawl.

He said that popular opinion doesn't relate to the "inherent goodness" of a movie. I was saying that it does, or at least it does to the most reasonable criteria we could establish. You're very confused, as always. 👆

Go into the Battle Bar. You act like this is the first time anyone has discussed the PT vs TFA.

Idc what arguments you guys made before; both of you were making declarative statements about the inherent quality of the movies just now, and that is what I am addressing. If you guys are contradicting your previous statements, that's not my problem.

Yeah, no one should have to write "in my opinion" at the end of every opinionated statement. It's obviously an opinion. This entire thread is.

Tempest's original point was that opinions don't matter next to the "inherent truth".

Nah, my point is that opinions in large quantities (or small for that matter) aren't necessarily right. I also said that just because a movie is creative and/or original doesn't mean it's a good movie.

Art criticism is subjective. The idea that a movie is good because lots of people say it's good is ridiculous.

While true, the idea that critical reception is meaningless or that numerous informed opinions should be easily dismissed is equally ridiculous imo.

Not that I'm saying thats what you're doing.

Originally posted by The_Tempest
Nah, my point is that opinions in large quantities (or small for that matter) aren't necessarily right.

That's what I said, lol.

Anyway, there's no way to objectively determine what degree of creativity outweighs what degree of execution/nostalgia/whatever, except for maybe how much it entertains, or even benefits, people.

And the plan seems to be for TFA to draw everyone back into the universe via nostalgia, and then for the subsequent films to try something new. Which makes sense IMHO.

Originally posted by The Ellimist
And the plan seems to be for TFA to draw everyone back into the universe via nostalgia, and then for the subsequent films to try something new. Which makes sense IMHO.

This was my thinking also.

Obviously TFA went as planned. This is about whether that plan is "good." Being shit on purpose doesn't really make the fact that it's shit better.

It arguably makes it more shit.

How is being nostalgic being shit? There are different kinds of films that can fulfill different purposes, and nostalgia is one of them. 😬

Yeah, the fact that an anthology film like Rogue One looks more promising than a numbered title that is supposed to be a sequel isn't what I envisioned when I heard of Star Wars becoming relevant again.

It would have been relatively easy to be nostalgic without copying the plot of ANH to a T; people like to joke about the Avatar-esque leak but they could have set the world up similar to how it is in LoK. Hell, at this point I'd settle for a film that explains it's own backstory. Like at all. Instead we're thrust into a galaxy far, far away with with the smallest bits of information, and even ANH set up the state of the galaxy better with a simple five minute conversation.

Rogue One looks very promising. 👆

But yeah, you can create a new storyline with pre-established elements to make the universe familiar to the casual fan...

...without doing what TFA did. 👆

It was shit.

I don't think it would've been as effective if it was done very differently, tbh.

Originally posted by The Ellimist

And the plan seems to be for TFA to draw everyone back into the universe via nostalgia, and then for the subsequent films to try something new. Which makes sense IMHO.

THANK YOU, you understand. That's my thought exactly. Obviously doing the movie plot very similar to ANH's is on purpose. And it does make sense imho, too.

And the fact that the movie isn't original does not mean by any means it is a bad movie, and whoever thinks it does mean that will be generally disappointed in cinema for the rest of his/her life.

I don't think anyone thinks they wrote TFA the way they did on accident, lel.

As to your latter point, you obviously didn't read any other replies in this thread if you think it being unoriginal is the problem.

Originally posted by FreshestSlice
I don't think anyone thinks they wrote TFA the way they did on accident, lel.

As to your latter point, you obviously didn't read any other replies in this thread if you think it being unoriginal is the problem.

Well, lack of originality isn't necessarily done purposefully. But yes, it's pretty obvious in this case.

And nah, I just read the replies on the first two pages, where people criticize TFA's lack of originality and praise the PT's abundance of it.

Summary? Pls?

lol

It's a new SW movie series helmed by someone other than Lucas, involving the original cast, and empowered by the all-powerful Mickey Mouse corporation. Pretty sure Episode 7 would have done just fine at the box office even if they hadn't rehashed ANH.

Jesus Christ, look at James Cameron's Avatar.

Do you dislike the Pocahontas remake?