Originally posted by NaiGenesis, Borg Cube, Narada, multiple enterprise ships, UsS Vengeance, 5,000 plus mini Beyond ships, Vger and plenty of red matter.
Educate yourself:Two Death Stars, Starkiller Base.
Reaction time is a crucial element, if you want to use red matter to stop beams from Starkiller Base, that move so fast, that they cross half the Galaxy (Unknown Regions to Core Worlds) in minutes. They wouldn't even have time to prepare the stuff before Starkiller Base hits them from the other side of the Galaxy.
Educate yourself. Starkiller Base does, next to entire stars, harness Dark Matter from space surrounding it. The Death Star draws energy from hypermatter, apparently through a dimensional gate in the reactor.
Apparently we do. How else would a single ship with Red Matter protect the entirety of Star Trek from Starkiller Base? 😂
Yeah. They can "use" time-travel, with the exception of every application in which this would make sense, with unknown results, since that changes the Future. Great. They can adapt to weapons? The Borg can - and not to all weapons, but just phasers, which are pretty boring compared to SW weaponary. And yeah. There is red matter, crammed into a little containment cylinder on a single ship, that a single starfighter from the SW universe could easily take out. Wow. That's sooooo impressive. 🙄
See above. And after witnessing the destructive power of Starkiller Base or a Death Star, Star Trek - with exception of the Borg - would just give up.
They are powered by Dark Matter. So there is a limit: About 27 percent of the energy that exists in the observeable universe.
And yes. It got blown up, because somebody breached those shields on lightspeed. I would love to know, who in the Star Trek universe could possible reproduce that feat, provided that, flying with lightspeed, the distance between the shielding and the planets surfaces (roughly 500 kilometers), would give you a time frame of 0.001 seconds for getting out of FTL speed and stop your vehicle, before it hits ground after passing through the shields. For comparison: That's like attempting to land a jetfighter on a 10 cm long landing strip. Good luck with that.
@playa1258
If they would launch it through the shields at FTL speed, probably not. But then: Who knows if they can and what would happen? And they wouldn't even get the chance to do so, since Starkiller Base is still a moveable object capable of travelling faster than any ST ship. 😉
Red matter is going to take out Starkiller. That's the point. The base needs time to drain stars for five shots. Trek can also use shields or create black holes to stop the blasts with the red matter with the distance it has to travel.
Based on ? They are aware of the starkiller base just as the rebels became aware and quickly took it out before a second round of blasts could be fired.
Transport and red matter to starkiller base. A lot less has taken it out than a black hole.
Oh please all you have is gigantic lasers. Time travel. Assimilation. Adapting to frequencies and in Star Wars you have poor planets and the same old crap. Barren waste lands and shitty Stormtroopers. Klingons, Augments, Borg, Romulans, etc. Thousands of quick tiny ships so what's Star Wars going to do besides get worked ? Tie fighters and thirty some years later more tie fighters. We see the USS Vengeance three times faster than the Starfleet ships and twice the size within a few years. GTFO Wars. It can be handled by one man. Built solely for combat. That is called progression you Neanderthal. Yet we still see the ancient Millenium Falcon outmaneuver by some thirty year old Tie fighters. 😂
Are you kidding ? Genesis, red matter, Borg, etc. their weapons create black holes and down super novas but Wars still thinks destroying planets is awesome. GTFO. Super novas>>>>>planets.
Black hole. Red matter. Done. We see a few guys get on board and set things in motion to destroy the weapon easily. Quit ignoring the film and living in your own fantasy world.
Nice nerd calculations that are not relevant. 😂
Genesis, red matter.
🙂
Originally posted by quanchi112
Genesis, Borg Cube, Narada, multiple enterprise ships, UsS Vengeance, 5,000 plus mini Beyond ships, Vger and plenty of red matter.
"I have a list of stuff that I think is awesome, mom. I will post it on the internet!"
🙄
Red matter is going to take out Starkiller. That's the point. The base needs time to drain stars for five shots. Trek can also use shields or create black holes to stop the blasts with the red matter with the distance it has to travel.
Apparently, you're still not getting the point.
Starkiller Base could go anywhere in the Galaxy within hours. It's mobile with usual Star Wars speeds, by far exceeding anything Star Trek has to offer. Then they can shoot from anywhere at anything in the entire freaking Galaxy and will hit their target within minutes.
In Star Trek terms: They could fly to anywhere in the Delta Quadrant (which is a what? Hundred year journey for Federation ships?) and hit Earth from there within minutes. They can just sit anywhere and run rampant with their "giant laser", because no Trek ship will ever manage to reach them in time to stop them.
Star Trek doesn't have the technology to monitor an entire Galaxy, much like they don't have the technology to travel across it as fast as the Star Wars counterparts. Who, after all, have a Galaxy spanning government (the Republic) for "a thousand generations" (25,000 years) already.
Based on ? They are aware of the starkiller base just as the rebels became aware and quickly took it out before a second round of blasts could be fired.
The Resistance has the technical means to monitor a Galaxy. Star Trek has not. They also have the means to get to Starkiller Base rather fast. Star Trek has not. Just again, as comparison. The beams of the Starkiller Base crossed roughly 25,000 lightyears from the Unknown Regions to the Galactic Core in minutes. This is at least a year worth of travel (or 25 years, depending on the source) with Federation warp tech and months even with transwarp technology (or hours, if you have a transwarp hub installed already). Still: Compared to minutes.
Transport and red matter to starkiller base. A lot less has taken it out than a black hole.
You do still not realize, that Starkiller Base can easily avoid any Star Trek ship, because it travels much faster. Then you need to get inside the shielding of Starkiller Base - which just work if you go through them above speed of light.
Oh please all you have is gigantic lasers. Time travel. Assimilation. Adapting to frequencies and in Star Wars you have poor planets and the same old crap. Barren waste lands and shitty Stormtroopers. Klingons, Augments, Borg, Romulans, etc. Thousands of quick tiny ships so what's Star Wars going to do besides get worked ? Tie fighters and thirty some years later more tie fighters. We see the USS Vengeance three times faster than the Starfleet ships and twice the size within a few years. GTFO Wars. It can be handled by one man. Built solely for combat. That is called progression you Neanderthal. Yet we still see the ancient Millenium Falcon outmaneuver by some thirty year old Tie fighters. 😂
You still don't get the point.
Star Wars is so ridiculously far beyond Star Trek in terms of technology, that even if Star Trek evolves faster, it is still lightyears beyond Star Wars. Which is still a stupid point of view. In the matter of 30 years, Star Wars goes from building a moon-sized battle station (Note: Far beyond Star Trek capacities) to "turning an entire planet into a mobile weapon that drains stars".
You comment is on a level stating that, more than a century after the invention of cars, they pretty much look like they did before. You do realize that TIE-fighters now have a dedicated gunner (that wasn't there before) and guns that could fire in a 360 degree radius (that weren't there before)? Just asking.
Are you kidding ? Genesis, red matter, Borg, etc. their weapons create black holes and down super novas but Wars still thinks destroying planets is awesome. GTFO. Super novas>>>>>planets.
You do realize, that draining the entire power of a star and adding the power of dark matter on top of that, to put this into focused energy beams is >>>> a supernova, right?
Black hole. Red matter. Done. We see a few guys get on board and set things in motion to destroy the weapon easily. Quit ignoring the film and living in your own fantasy world.
Yup. That guys could travel far faster than anything in the Star Trek universe, and managed to breach the shields in an impossible move to land. Then they deactivated said shield and still needed to blow half a building up from the inside befor another pilot with insane skills managed to fly into that building and destroy it from the inside. Sounds easy.
Nice nerd calculations that are not relevant. 😂
"I don't understand that, mom. I will, therefore, ignore it!" Quanchi-style debating at its finest.
Genesis, red matter.🙂
Speed being multiple thousand times faster than anything in Star Trek and ability to erase targets half a Galaxy away in minutes.
🙂
Even without the novelizations, we see X wings travel the distance of Yavin IV to the Death Star in a matter of minutes. We even see Yavin Prime a Gas giant that''s over hundreds of thousands of Kilometers in diameter get traversed in seconds. That was their cruising speed, when they locked their S foils and went into Attack Position they accelerated their speeds, making them even faster. Capital Ships are able to strike them down as seen in ROTJ. In Empire Strikes Back we even see Star Destroyers chase down the Millennium Falcon who's also running away from the TIE fighters which are comparable to X wings in speeds. The Avenger was even able to dodge in the nick a time another Star Destroyer while chasing down the MF, and they even went to another Asteroid Field while at sub Light. There's also how the MF crossed into another Star System while at Sub Light speeds, but that could be an outlier.
That's just sub light speeds, with Hyperdrive they can cross the entire Galaxy in hours at most. Starkiiler Base shot the Hosnian System while in the Unknown Regions according to the Visual Dictionary, and they were quite literally half a Galaxy away when they did that. But the Starkiller Base is overkill, the Death Star can solo.
Hm...I completely forgot the S foils bit, though wouldn't this mean that fighter combat moves ridiculously fast and the pilots have insane reactions and reflexes? Which I mean I guess the targeting computer's do most of the work as shown, but the pilots themselves would still need to have some ridiculous reflexes if they are going into combat faster than their travel speed, which is noted as being only minutes from a planet.
Yeah, I edited and noted that the targeting computers would do most of that work. But I think they'd still have to have some pretty high reflex.
Hm...on a note, since this is the closest we'll get to a tech discussion.
But is there any reasoning as to why in space, fighters/freighters and the like move ridiculously fast. Yet in atmosphere they move extremely slow?
I get that they are space faring and all, but I can't really imagine with the tech level being as it is, that their engine power would be so horrendously low in atmospheric combat.
I could never really find any real answer, other than Sourcebooks which note at best 1k+ km/h.
The ICS seem to have a better gauge and since Leland confirmed the firepower to be accurate, I'd guess the speed would too...but I dunno.
While it's an assumption, believing that their computers do almost all of the work for them while in combat and flying and what-not is pretty reasonable. That or pilots just have crazy reflexes lol. I believe the former just to be clear.
I believe that the reason for the low speeds in an atmosphere is not because it'll damage the ship, rather it'd be a Superman situation in which going at the speeds they do in space would cause massive collateral damage. AFAIK nothing states that them exceeding their atmospheric flight would cause damage to the ships.
Originally posted by Zenwolf
But is there any reasoning as to why in space, fighters/freighters and the like move ridiculously fast. Yet in atmosphere they move extremely slow?
Slow?
Millenium Falcon lifts off at 2:06 an reaches outer space in 2:16. So he makes the run past the Kármán line in under 10 seconds, which would be 10 km/s or 36,000 km/h. Not my definition of "extremely slow" exactly. 😉
Nai I was more referring to the Sourcebooks on the atmospheric speeds, they list them as being so slow. Plus when leaving to go into space, sublight drives are activated so of course the Falcon would be moving faster as it's taking off to go into space.
Meaning that it's not activate during atmospheric traveling.
Originally posted by NaiSo I list various badass Trek forces, ships, etc. and you ignore them. Concession accepted. Your initial fanboyish claim was five shots from the starkiller base would destroy all of Star Trek. 😂
"I have a list of stuff that I think is awesome, mom. I will post it on the internet!"🙄
Apparently, you're still not getting the point.
Starkiller Base could go anywhere in the Galaxy within hours. It's mobile with usual Star Wars speeds, by far exceeding anything Star Trek has to offer. Then they can shoot from anywhere at anything in the entire freaking Galaxy and will hit their target within minutes.In Star Trek terms: They could fly to anywhere in the Delta Quadrant (which is a what? Hundred year journey for Federation ships?) and hit Earth from there within minutes. They can just sit anywhere and run rampant with their "giant laser", because no Trek ship will ever manage to reach them in time to stop them.
Star Trek doesn't have the technology to monitor an entire Galaxy, much like they don't have the technology to travel across it as fast as the Star Wars counterparts. Who, after all, have a Galaxy spanning government (the Republic) for "a thousand generations" (25,000 years) already.
The Resistance has the technical means to monitor a Galaxy. Star Trek has not. They also have the means to get to Starkiller Base rather fast. Star Trek has not. Just again, as comparison. The beams of the Starkiller Base crossed roughly 25,000 lightyears from the Unknown Regions to the Galactic Core in minutes. This is at least a year worth of travel (or 25 years, depending on the source) with Federation warp tech and months even with transwarp technology (or hours, if you have a transwarp hub installed already). Still: Compared to minutes.
You do still not realize, that Starkiller Base can easily avoid any Star Trek ship, because it travels much faster. Then you need to get inside the shielding of Starkiller Base - which just work if you go through them above speed of light.
You still don't get the point.
Star Wars is so ridiculously far beyond Star Trek in terms of technology, that even if Star Trek evolves faster, it is still lightyears beyond Star Wars. Which is still a stupid point of view. In the matter of 30 years, Star Wars goes from building a moon-sized battle station (Note: Far beyond Star Trek capacities) to "turning an entire planet into a mobile weapon that drains stars".You comment is on a level stating that, more than a century after the invention of cars, they pretty much look like they did before. You do realize that TIE-fighters now have a dedicated gunner (that wasn't there before) and guns that could fire in a 360 degree radius (that weren't there before)? Just asking.
You do realize, that draining the entire power of a star and adding the power of dark matter on top of that, to put this into focused energy beams is >>>> a supernova, right?
Yup. That guys could travel far faster than anything in the Star Trek universe, and managed to breach the shields in an impossible move to land. Then they deactivated said shield and still needed to blow half a building up from the inside befor another pilot with insane skills managed to fly into that building and destroy it from the inside. Sounds easy.
"I don't understand that, mom. I will, therefore, ignore it!" Quanchi-style debating at its finest.
Speed being multiple thousand times faster than anything in Star Trek and ability to erase targets half a Galaxy away in minutes.
🙂
That's fine as Trek can transport anywhere and we see it takes time to drain stars from whatever location it's at.
Minutes is too long for Trek to prepare for based on the red matter. Why can't trek assimilate the Star Wars tech via the Borg ? That's what they do you just want to ignore it. It's sad. They can also transport and these forces are going to be located within the same fictional galaxy.
Yes, they can especially when they join forces. Federation, Klingons, Romulans, Borg, Frontier, etc.
When did it avoid any ships ? When did it do anything you describe in the film ? Multiple ships boarded it quite easily. You seem to ignore the film and make shit up due to fanboyism.
Trek utilized red matter to stop a super nova. Wars builds a bigger base with a badder laser. Whooppty doo. Same shitty ships thirty years later. Trek outdid the Federation ships by three times the speed and twice the size manned by one ship. That's called progress not new tie fighters.
Prove it is greater than a super nova.
Red matter creates black hole and there it goes. They could do it way easier. If you believe it can resist a black hole then prove it.
You ignore the films portrayal left and right and cite numbers not indicative of the battle.
Red matter takes out all the bigger space stations.