Anakin vs Vader (sabers only)

Originally posted by DarthAnt66
Skywalker's performance against Dooku was better than Yoda's, in all honesty.

I see no reason to believe Vader can really even best Dooku in a duel, let alone do so with the same ease Anakin had.

What feat really stands out for Vader's superiority? Besting ANH Kenobi? Starkiller? 😬

Not in those passages you posted. When the duel becomes 1 on 1 Dooku easily unbalances Anakin and is all but ensured to win until Palpatine goads Anakin.

And like I said, Vader certainly wouldn't defeat Dooku as easily as Anakin had. But Anakin only did so by going into "teh z0ne" which is something, I've already stated, I think unlikely to happen here.

Vader would certainly best Dooku in a duel, KEK. Hard fought matchup, sure - but I see his own skill, in conjunction with a form advantage doing the Count in.

Originally posted by ares834
Not in those passages you posted. When the duel becomes 1 on 1 Dooku easily unbalances Anakin and is all but ensured to win until Palpatine goads Anakin.

And like I said, Vader certainly wouldn't defeat Dooku as easily as Anakin had. But Anakin only did so by going into "teh z0ne" which is something, I've already stated, I think unlikely to happen here.

The only thing that spared Dooku was Dun Moch, which isn't indication of skill and power, but rather Skywalker's emotional instability.

Of course Vader is defeating Count Dooku, but in a way even close to the dominant performance Anakin put in? Hell no, far lesser characters have given him decent or even hard fights before.

Darth Vader as of Operation Knightfall is so far beyond what Vader can unleash, his treatment of Drallig, whom Dooku surmises could handily defeat early Grievous, was absolute humiliation.

Dooku's lightning not gonna be a Problem? He's no mug with TK either...

"Anakin, as Skywalker, as a human being, was going to be extremely powerful,” he says. “But he ended up losing his legs and an arm and became partly a robot. So a lot of his ability to use the Force, a lot of his powers, are curbed at this point, because, as a living form, there’s not that much of him left." - George Lucas

Damn. Case closed. 👆

Originally posted by chingchangwalla
Dooku's lightning not gonna be a Problem? He's no mug with TK either...

Dunno what that has to do with a duel.....

Originally posted by AncientPower
Of course Vader is defeating Count Dooku, but in a way even close to the dominant performance Anakin put in? Hell no, far lesser characters have given him decent or even hard fights before.

Darth Vader as of Operation Knightfall is so far beyond what Vader can unleash, his treatment of Drallig, whom Dooku surmises could handily defeat early Grievous, was absolute humiliation.

"Lord Vader, your skills are unmatched by any Sith before you. Go forth, my boy. Go forth, and bring peace to our Empire." - Darth Sidious, Revenge Of The Sith

Knightfall Vader > All Sith before him in skill.

Lucas always did seem to suggest Anakin > Vader. But that's all changed under Disney.

They wasted no time to have him say he's grown more powerful in the Force just a few years after ROTS, and for Pablo to confirm Rebels Vader is Prime Vader, and for OT Vader to have the most beastly telekinetic feats, and to Solo entire Rebel fleets (something Skywalker never displayed), and for Rebels Maul to confirm he can't take Vader e.t.c e.t.c

Originally posted by AncientPower
"Lord Vader, your skills are unmatched by any Sith before you. Go forth, my boy. Go forth, and bring peace to our Empire." - Darth Sidious, Revenge Of The Sith

Knightfall Vader > All Sith before him in skill.

But not necessarily > OT Vader.

In fact New Disney-Canon has already clearly put Vader above Maul.

Mm I don't think Maul is the type of person to admit he can't take anyone in a duel, says a lot about Vader.

Originally posted by chingchangwalla
Mm I don't think Maul is the type of person to admit he can't take anyone in a duel, says a lot about Vader.

👆

He never said that about Dooku.

Knightfall Vader > Plagueis tho. 👆

^ OT Vader probably is too tbh.

Stick to Canon only debating Thor.

Originally posted by DarthAnt66
Except Skywalker was explicitly dominating and tearing Dooku apart, even before going in "teh z0ne" mode.

The only thing that spared Dooku was Dun Moch, which isn't indication of skill and power, but rather Skywalker's emotional instability.

In the first passage, Dooku was dueling both Kenobi and Skywalker. Anakin seems to have managed to catch Dooku on his back foot as the onslaught was immediately after Kenobi was knocked aside with the force. In the second passage, when it's actually 1 on 1, there is no evidence of domination. He seems to have been winning, but I don't get any sense that he easily besting Dooku there.

"Anakin, as Skywalker, as a human being, was going to be extremely powerful,” he says. “But he ended up losing his legs and an arm and became partly a robot. So a lot of his ability to use the Force, a lot of his powers, are curbed at this point, because, as a living form, there’s not that much of him left." - George Lucas

Potential. 🙂 He is talking about what Anakin "was" going to become.

So a lot of his ability to use the Force, a lot of his powers, are curbed at this point, because, as a living form, there’s not that much of him left.

There's no reason they have to be mutually exclusive.

Doesn't Vader himself say that he's greater than ever at points, though?

^ Still Lucas is clearly talking potential there.

But as I've already mentioned I think Lucas rated Anakin > Vader, but current Disney Canon certainly doesn't, and the novelisations (Lucas's original intentions) didn't either.

Vader's own statements are all made in a mindset that anything Jedi is weak, a much more truthful view point is when he realises he's lost his former power.