Mr. Miyagi vs. Ip Man

Originally posted by h1a8
Miyagi casually caught an arrow. That requires tremendous reflexes and hand speed. To pretend it doesn't is trolling.

Miyagi broke 4 bottles of beer at their top without knocking over the bottles. That takes some speed of sound hand speed.

Ip Man has never taken hits from powerful foes without getting getting seriously messed up. His durability is very questionable.

But s that's irrelevant.

You are ignoring the fact that Miyagi WILL NOT ATTACK FIRST.
This will put the fight in his advantage.

When did IP Man get seriously messed up?

Originally posted by h1a8
Miyagi casually caught an arrow. That requires tremendous reflexes and hand speed. To pretend it doesn't is trolling.

Miyagi broke 4 bottles of beer at their top without knocking over the bottles. That takes some speed of sound hand speed.

Ip Man has never taken hits from powerful foes without getting getting seriously messed up. His durability is very questionable.

But s that's irrelevant.

You are ignoring the fact that Miyagi WILL NOT ATTACK FIRST.
This will put the fight in his advantage.

Catching an arrow has been done in real life and not even by martial arts masters. There's also the question of the bow's draw weight since some bows will shoot arrows a lot slower than others.

Breaking 4 bottles of beer is something that done regularly by martial arts masters. It's an impressive feat but by no means an indication of victory. It's one thing to strike at non-living objects that just sit there and allow you all the time in the world to perform your katas and preparations, quite another to fight a fast moving opponent.

Miyagi has no combat feats that can compare to Ip Man's.

Originally posted by Kotor3
In the words of IP Man's most famous student Bruce Lee: "Boards don't hit back".

When did IP Man get seriously messed up?

Everytime he was hit by a strong opponent.
Twister, against the Japanese master, against Mike Tyson.

It was clear that he couldn't take too many of those hits without going down.

"Boards don't hit back" philosophy gives Miyagi the advantage. Remember IP Man is the attacker, and Miyagi is the defender and counterer.
Ip Man attacks first, Miyagi easily parries and counters.

Ip took a beating from Frank(Tyson) and gave one back. He went even with a guy who launched someone 12 feet from a straight right punch while he had a boxing pad in front of him.

Also if you could show some evidence of Miyagi's speed, as Ip has plenty that show he's basically superhuman in reaction and fight speed. He's literally seen people moving in slow motion while he fights and has beaten the asses of dozens of people attacking all at once from every direction.

Originally posted by h1a8
Everytime he was hit by a strong opponent.
Twister, against the Japanese master, against Mike Tyson.

It was clear that he couldn't take too many of those hits without going down.

"Boards don't hit back" philosophy gives Miyagi the advantage. Remember IP Man is the attacker, and Miyagi is the defender and counterer.
Ip Man attacks first, Miyagi easily parries and counters.

IP Man won both fights, so your point is irrelevant. You are way off on the philosophy of the statement. If you continue to pick selected statements that I make to reply to while ignoring others I will take that as your concession.

In a previous statement I already proved why catching an arrow does not prove superior speed or reflexes. The Bruce Lee statement supports that.

I will take your constant repeating of the same point as your concession to this discussion since you have done nothing to answer or prove my statements as incorrect.

Originally posted by h1a8
Everytime he was hit by a strong opponent.
Twister, against the Japanese master, against Mike Tyson.

It was clear that he couldn't take too many of those hits without going down.

"Boards don't hit back" philosophy gives Miyagi the advantage. Remember IP Man is the attacker, and Miyagi is the defender and counterer.
Ip Man attacks first, Miyagi easily parries and counters.

I challenge you to a comparison of fighting feats, loser gets banned for 3 months.

Do you accept?

Originally posted by h1a8
Everytime he was hit by a strong opponent.
Twister, against the Japanese master, against Mike Tyson.

It was clear that he couldn't take too many of those hits without going down.

"Boards don't hit back" philosophy gives Miyagi the advantage. Remember IP Man is the attacker, and Miyagi is the defender and counterer.
Ip Man attacks first, Miyagi easily parries and counters.

I agree that Ip had trouble with Twister and Tyson. Thing is, Miyagi is nowhere near as strong or as heavy as those two. If I'm not mistaken he's even smaller than Ip Man.

Originally posted by FrothByte
I agree that Ip had trouble with Twister and Tyson. Thing is, Miyagi is nowhere near as strong or as heavy as those two. If I'm not mistaken he's even smaller than Ip Man.

He had trouble with Twister in the beginning, true.

However Frank is a legit superhuman and so was Cheung Tin-chi. Ip went even with Frank because time ran out, and he straight up beat Cheung, who in turn brutalized every other master to prove his Wing Chun was the best.

Also yeah, Miyagi would be the smallest person Ip has fought.

Why is this still going on?

Originally posted by FrothByte
Catching an arrow has been done in real life and not even by martial arts masters. There's also the question of the bow's draw weight since some bows will shoot arrows a lot slower than others.

Breaking 4 bottles of beer is something that done regularly by martial arts masters. It's an impressive feat but by no means an indication of victory. It's one thing to strike at non-living objects that just sit there and allow you all the time in the world to perform your katas and preparations, quite another to fight a fast moving opponent.

Miyagi has no combat feats that can compare to Ip Man's.

No it's not.
All the arrow catching I saw was fake. The arrow was shot very slow from a long distance. The arrow appeared to be traveling less than 80mph.

In reality, it's humanly impossible to catch an arrow. Arrows travel faster than 220mph.
Average human reactions are 0.215 of a second. This is not quick enough to catch an arrow from 30ft away. Miyagi showed SUPERHUMAN SPEED AND REACTIONS. Ip Man never showed superhuman speed or reactions.

Originally posted by juggerman
Why is this still going on?

Because Miyagi was proven to win and some still believe that Ip Man wins.

Originally posted by FrothByte
I agree that Ip had trouble with Twister and Tyson. Thing is, Miyagi is nowhere near as strong or as heavy as those two. If I'm not mistaken he's even smaller than Ip Man.

Originally posted by h1a8

Miyagi showed superhuman strength multiple times. For example, the beer bottle feat and the tree feat. I doubt any of those characters (Tyson and Twister) could duplicate either feat.

The beer bottle is not a strength feat. It is a skill feat. You don't need that much strength to smash bottles, you do need accuracy and precision to break off the necks cleanly.

That said, that's still no proof of Miyagi being anywhere near the strength of Twister or Tyson. And you failed to address the issue of size and mass.

Originally posted by juggerman
Why is this still going on?

Because H1 is still running from my challenge.

Originally posted by h1a8
Miyagi showed superhuman strength multiple times. For example, the beer bottle feat and the tree feat. I doubt any of those characters (Tyson and Twister) could duplicate either feat.

Originally posted by FrothByte
The beer bottle is not a strength feat. It is a skill feat. You don't need that much strength to smash bottles, you do need accuracy and precision to break off the necks cleanly.

That said, that's still no proof of Miyagi being anywhere near the strength of Twister or Tyson. And you failed to address the issue of size and mass.

According to the laws of physics, you need great velocity to achieve it. Its like pulling a tablecloth off without moving the dishes. Achieving such hand speeds requires tremendous strength or striking power.

Again Miyagi with the beer bottle feat proves he's stronger and Miyagi chopping a tree in half proves he's stronger.

Originally posted by h1a8
According to the laws of physics, you need great velocity to achieve it. Its like pulling a tablecloth off without moving the dishes. Achieving such hand speeds requires tremendous strength or striking power.

Again Miyagi with the beer bottle feat proves he's stronger and Miyagi chopping a tree in half proves he's stronger.

Do you need strength and accuracy to do that feat? Yes. Do you need tremendous amounts of strength? No. You just need to be able to concentrate your strength in a powerful and concentrated attack. That doesn't prove he's stronger than Twister or Tyson. I don't think you know what strength is nor the physics behind fighting. Strength isn't just about striking strength but overall strength.. unless you think Miyagi can out-push Twister?

It also doesn't prove that he can do the same strikes in the middle of a fight since you never see him deliver any blow of the same caliber while in a fight.

I don't recall the tree feat. You'll have to post a vid.

Originally posted by Solid47
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5sFYgt-rkNk

Fake feat. He pushed down with his weigh to break the high majority of the slabs. His weight > durability of a slab.

So Either those slabs were fodder material or they were already compromised (i.e. curved).

Originally posted by FrothByte
Do you need strength and accuracy to do that feat? Yes. Do you need tremendous amounts of strength? No. You just need to be able to concentrate your strength in a powerful and concentrated attack. That doesn't prove he's stronger than Twister or Tyson. I don't think you know what strength is nor the physics behind fighting. Strength isn't just about striking strength but overall strength.. unless you think Miyagi can out-push Twister?

It also doesn't prove that he can do the same strikes in the middle of a fight since you never see him deliver any blow of the same caliber while in a fight.

I don't recall the tree feat. You'll have to post a vid.

We are talking physics here, not voodoo ancient chinese secrets. To achieve that result requires tremendous hand speed, otherwise it will fail. It's impossible to achieve that feat with hand speed under 100mph.

F=ma
That means to generate great hand speed in a short amount of time takes lot's of force.

The tree feat was in karate kid 2 (near the end) when Sato got trapped under it in the storm. Sato thought Miyagi was coming over to kill him (as a coward) when Miyagi was trying to free him.

Originally posted by h1a8
We are talking physics here, not voodoo ancient chinese secrets. To achieve that result requires tremendous hand speed, otherwise it will fail. It's impossible to achieve that feat with hand speed under 100mph.

F=ma
That means to generate great hand speed in a short amount of time takes lot's of force.

The tree feat was in karate kid 2 (near the end) when Sato got trapped under it in the storm. Sato thought Miyagi was coming over to kill him (as a coward) when Miyagi was trying to free him.

Post a vid of the feat, then we can both criticize it properly.

I thought we were talking strength, why are you now talking about hand speed? We can talk hand speed later, let's concentrate on strength first.

The fastest strike ever recorded in human history is a boxer's jab. Note that even though it is the fastest, it is also the weakest punch. That proves that just because a strike is fast it doesn't mean it's strong. Try again.

Ip smacked a grown man in the ear with a feather duster a d he went sailing across the room.

Difference in Ip and Miyagi is that Ip displays his feats in combat. Miyagi has time to prepare a demonstration. H1, Wasn't it you who said Ivan Drago's 1400 psi punch couldn't be counted in a fight because he had to set up to throw it? Miyagi did that in all the examples you posted. The arrow, the bottles, the tree.