Originally posted by darthgoober
When has it ever been possible for someone to do all that Surfer can do? Never. So you can't really say it's NEVER been enough.
But he has never done it. So no, it isn't your imagination running wild here in Surfer's body.
Marvel Earth and real world Earth are radically different. The question posed is in regards to this thread involves OUR Earth so you can't use Marvel Earth as a basis when Marvel Earth has an actual established history of super beings that our Earth lacks. It's a totally theoretical question with nothing to base it on except logic and common sense.
No, its not. And marvel earth hadn't been that littered with super powered humans in 60s.
Keep throwing red herrings though.
Surfer can transmute matter and energy, adamantium is matter. If you're claiming that Adamantium is an exception to the rule you need something to suggest it.
Except he can't. Not all matter and adamantium is the likely the toughest metal of them all.
If Lobo and GL can enter into combat range, grab someone by the throat, and throw them with such speed that they're totally unseen then they're speedsters too.
Funny thing, Lobo has actually blitzed someone and GLs have actually punched someone at FTL speeds. Like here Alan punches Hal while travelling from Earth to Oa.
Or Lobo blitzing superspeed style.
Neither are speedsters.
Grabbing someone and throwing them at superspeed is superspeed. Grabbing ANYTHING stationary while moving at lightspeed is super speed. Fighting at superspeed is superspeed.
Hahaha, you are still stuck at those little arguments? They are merely flight speed showings for Surfer.
Why don't you show Surfer without his board actually doing something on his own? All you are showing are either flight speed or a burst of reflexes. Where is Surfer maintaining a superspeed scene?
There is a very large difference between Superman and Surfer in terms of speed. Deal with it. Or not, its not my concern.
But don't come here trying to post your shitty logic again and again.
You're being silly here. See, this is why I said it was silly to try to convince you, all you do is plug your ears and ignore reason.
You are being an idiot here. Not that you don't do that everytime.
I didn't say it was a big thing, just pointing out that he's reacted to bullets too.
Haha, he hasn't.
Batman is Batman. Guys like him and Cap do stuff that goes above and beyond common sense and the suspension of disbelieve all the time. He's also snuck up on Superman and grabbed the Flash, that doesn't mean someone else sneaking up on Supes or grabbing Flash is any less of a feat.
He is as much of a speedster that Surfer is. Aka not really. And what a shitty cop out.
Again one is infinitely more than zero, which is what you claimed. And two definitely is.
Its still not in his character as you claimed. Five is of course more than one or two.
I'm not trying to make the rules, you're trying to twist the rules compartmentalize feats to hurt any character who's not your boy. It's in character for Surfer to BFR, however he chooses to do it, period.
No, it isn't. Try again.
Originally posted by zopzop
What did we say that you disagree with Abhi? On panel he's done the following : raised the dead,
Never did.
healed injured beings, transmuted matter on a planetary scale,
Standard herald level showings.
search the entire planet in the time it took Strange to finish a sentence, destroyed planets,
The first is strictly a travel speed showing. Second is a standard herald level showing.
created life and then evolved it several million years,
He didn't create life.
traveled forward AND backward through time, displayed planetary level TP, etc...
And?
He's easily the best man for the job going by ON PANEL evidence.
No, he really isn't. And he isn't some mini CCU either.
Originally posted by abhilegend
But he has never done it. So no, it isn't your imagination running wild here in Surfer's body.
Of course the scenario is totally theoretical. It's set on OUR Earth.
Originally posted by abhilegend
No, its not. And marvel earth hadn't been that littered with super powered humans in 60s.Keep throwing red herrings though.
There weren't nearly as many as there are now, but there were still plenty. There was the FF of course, the X-Men, the Avengers, Spider-Man, all the golden age heroes, and all the villains that went with all those heroes. Plus guys like Galactus touching down on Earth.
Originally posted by abhilegend
Except he can't. Not all matter and adamantium is the likely the toughest metal of them all.
Again, based on what other than you personally wanting to restrict his abilities? Do you have something to suggest that Adamantium is resistant to being manipulated on the atomic level or not?
Originally posted by abhilegend
Funny thing, Lobo has actually blitzed someone and GLs have actually punched someone at FTL speeds. Like here Alan punches Hal while travelling from Earth to Oa.Or Lobo blitzing superspeed style.
Neither are speedsters.
Lobo has superspeed. It's not showcased often but it doesn't have to be to be recognized as a power. And your scene with Alan is just him flying at someone with his fist held strait out, that's a far cry from him grabbing someone and throwing them without them even being able to see him.
And before you start again with outright denial of Surfer having super speed, take a close look at Pr's ruling here...
...most notably the part where he says "super speed is part of Surfer's powerset. Get over it."
Originally posted by abhilegend
Hahaha, you are still stuck at those little arguments? They are merely flight speed showings for Surfer.Why don't you show Surfer without his board actually doing something on his own? All you are showing are either flight speed or a burst of reflexes. Where is Surfer maintaining a superspeed scene?
There is a very large difference between Superman and Surfer in terms of speed. Deal with it. Or not, its not my concern.
But don't come here trying to post your shitty logic again and again.
It's not all flight speed abhi, again moving your arms at super speed IS super speed. But go ahead and keep on plugging your ears, it's not as if you're the first guy to ignore on panel evidence and logic and you won't be the last(though you may be the loudest).
Originally posted by abhilegend
You are being an idiot here. Not that you don't do that everytime.
Yeah, actually interpreting on panel evidence with logic and common sense is totally idiotic... oh wait, no it's not.
Originally posted by abhilegend
Haha, he hasn't.
Sure he has, he absorbed them.
Originally posted by abhilegend
He is as much of a speedster that Surfer is. Aka not really. And what a shitty cop out.
He's Batman, that's pretty much all the explanation DC ever gives. Surfer doesn't have the Bat aura protecting him or aiding him in his feats, he just has powers.
Originally posted by abhilegend
Its still not in his character as you claimed. Five is of course more than one or two.
Sure it is. He's BFR'd multiple opponents when it suited him, ergo it's in character for him to do so.
Originally posted by abhilegend
No, it isn't. Try again.
Of course it is. Have we already reached the point in the debate when you cease even pretending to try to provide a rational argument and just rely on "Nuh uh"?
Originally posted by abhilegend
Never did.
Standard herald level showings.
The first is strictly a travel speed showing. Second is a standard herald level showing.
He didn't create life.
And?
No, he really isn't. And he isn't some mini CCU either.
Originally posted by darthgoober
Of course the scenario is totally theoretical. It's set on OUR Earth.
No, it's based on the actual events from a comic.
There weren't nearly as many as there are now, but there were still plenty. There was the FF of course, the X-Men, the Avengers, Spider-Man, all the golden age heroes, and all the villains that went with all those heroes. Plus guys like Galactus touching down on Earth.
None of them except FF actually mattered in his attempts to stop war.
Again, based on what other than you personally wanting to restrict his abilities?
His transmutation isn't as powerful as you think.
Do you have something to suggest that Adamantium is resistant to being manipulated on the atomic level or not?
Do you have anything to suggest Surfer can actually transmute it? You made the claim that he can do it of course.
Lobo has superspeed. It's not showcased often but it doesn't have to be to be recognized as a power.
Of course it needs to. That right there is more than anything Surfer has ever done.
Heck, Hercules has blitzed hulk
Hercules is a speester too, eh?
Everyone in comics has superspeed if we use your criteria.
And your scene with Alan is just him flying at someone with his fist held strait out, that's a far cry from him grabbing someone and throwing them without them even being able to see him.
Hahaha, what? Alan is punching Hal in the face.
And no, surprising someone isn't superspeed.
And before you start again with outright denial of Surfer having super speed, take a close look at Pr's ruling here...
...most notably the part where he says "super speed is part of Surfer's powerset. Get over it."
[/quote]
He is at slightly enhanced human level speed as noted in several marvel bios as well. Technically that's superspeed too.
Far below the likes of Spider-Man though who can blitz him at will.
👆
It's not all flight speed abhi, again moving your arms at super speed IS super speed. But go ahead and keep on plugging your ears, it's not as if you're the first guy to ignore on panel evidence and logic and you won't be the last(though you may be the loudest).
But Alan doing it is him just flying with his arm out, eh?
😂
He is not moving his arm with the same speed as his board. Just like a jet pilot isn't moving his arm at Mach speed.
Yeah, actually interpreting on panel evidence with logic and common sense is totally idiotic... oh wait, no it's not.
If only you could do that.
Sure he has, he absorbed them.
That's not reacting to bullets. Are you really that desperate?
Not even a single bullet feat? Damn.
He's Batman, that's pretty much all the explanation DC ever gives. Surfer doesn't have the Bat aura protecting him or aiding him in his feats, he just has powers.
😂
What about the likes of Robins and Deathstroke or random Street leveler heroes doing that?
Everyone is protected, eh? Poor Surfer.
Sure it is. He's BFR'd multiple opponents when it suited him, ergo it's in character for him to do so.
Or when he gets his shit kicked in. Durok, Millenius etc.
And almost always physically.
Of course it is. Have we already reached the point in the debate when you cease even pretending to try to provide a rational argument and just rely on "Nuh uh"?
What else can you do to someone this dense?
Originally posted by zopzop
He didn't raised dead. He healed them.
Don't be foolish.
Ok, show me any other herald mentioned in the OP doing this. I want to know where Wonder Woman transmuted matter on a planetary scale. How about Superman? Show me them healing other beings.
Superman and Wonder Woman don't have those powers, so can't use them that way.
It's like asking showing Surfer able to tow away earth and declaring him weaksauce.
Green Lanterns have transmuted entire planets. Warlock has done so. Even Black Hand has done so.
Ditto for healing others.
Show me Wonder Woman or other heralds in this thread destroying planets or scanning the planet before someone finishes a sentence.
Destroying planets? Green Lanterns have done it, Superman has done it.
Superman has scanned entire Phantom Zone which is limitless in before a statement.
That's not creating life. Here is something better as not able to control his own power.
Originally posted by abhilegend
Kyle and Kilowog create ecosystem of Thanagar and move the planet away from the sun and stabilize its orbit.
What do you mean "and"? How is the ability to travel forward and backward through time not going to be handy here?
No. How is it going to affect anyone?
Yes, he really is. [/B]
Surfer isn't even the most powerful Herald of Galactus and both Thor and Superman are more powerful in Herald category.
Lulz @ him being a mini cosmic Cube.
Originally posted by abhilegend
No, it's based on the actual events from a comic.
I'm reasonably sure psycho is talking about the real world conflict here on our Earth, not something that happened in a comic. Though I suppose we can ask him for clarification if you like.
Originally posted by abhilegend
None of them except FF actually mattered in his attempts to stop war.
Originally posted by abhilegend
He wasn't able to transmute Johnny's flame when it was magically altered. There is a clear limitations on his power. And even pretty powerful magic has been unable to transmute Logan's bones.His transmutation isn't as powerful as you think.
Keyword "magically". He couldn't transmute something that had already basically been magically transmuted. Magic's a powerful thing, that's why you'll never see me saying he could transmute something like Thor's hammer.
Originally posted by abhilegend
Do you have anything to suggest Surfer can actually transmute it? You made the claim that he can do it of course.
Originally posted by abhilegend
Of course it needs to. That right there is more than anything Surfer has ever done.Heck, Hercules has blitzed hulk
Hercules is a speester too, eh?
Everyone in comics has superspeed if we use your criteria.
Not everyone, but lots of characters have some level of superspeed, yes.
And no, characters powers remain part of their powerset even if they don't showcase them frequently.
Originally posted by abhilegend
Hahaha, what? Alan is punching Hal in the face.And no, surprising someone isn't superspeed.
No he's bullrushing him with his arm outstretched. That's in no way equal to Surfer grabbing a character with superspeed by the throat and throwing them so fast that he's totally unseen.
Originally posted by abhilegend
He is at slightly enhanced human level speed as noted in several marvel bios as well. Technically that's superspeed too.Far below the likes of Spider-Man though who can blitz him at will.
👆
If he'd meant that, he wouldn't have simply said that Surfer has superspeed. But if you really think that's what he meant, go ahead and ask him for clarification. I'd do it myself, but whenever I ask him to correct you he tells me I should just ignore your nonsense. A direct request from you might net some results though.
Originally posted by abhilegend
But Alan doing it is him just flying with his arm out, eh?😂
He is not moving his arm with the same speed as his board. Just like a jet pilot isn't moving his arm at Mach speed.
If the jet pilot grabs someone by the throat and throws them and is mistaken for an energy blast, he's moving his arm really, really fast even if it's not as fast as the jet itself is moving.
Originally posted by abhilegend
If only you could do that.
It's what I have been doing. You're just in denial.
Originally posted by abhilegend
That's not reacting to bullets. Are you really that desperate?Not even a single bullet feat? Damn.
If you choose to absorb a bullet that's shot at you, it's absolutely reacting to the bullet. Not that I'm trying to make the feat out to be a big deal, you seem to think I'm trying to push the bullet feat. I simply made an offhand comment about it as an after thought to me saying that Surfer doesn't need to catch bullets.
Originally posted by abhilegend
😂What about the likes of Robins and Deathstroke or random Street leveler heroes doing that?
Everyone is protected, eh? Poor Surfer.
Hey show me Robin casually blocking stuff like Surfer has and you'll have a point. Much less of a point with Deathstroke though, that guy's speed has given Flash and Superman issues too so either he's a true "speedster" even by your definition or he's got his own aura going for him.
Originally posted by abhilegend
Or when he gets his shit kicked in. Durok, Millenius etc.And almost always physically.
Who cares if he does it after he gets beat on for a while. I'm not saying he'll do it right out of the gate necessarily, just that he can do it.
Originally posted by abhilegend
I've already provided several instances where he carried the characters away. Your response" Well, he teleported that robot once. So he will do it everytime. "
He's not allowed to carry them away in a forum fight abhi, that would be self bfr which isn't allowed. But since he's inclined to bfr and has the ability to bfr WITHOUT carrying them away then he'll do so. That's one of the reasons I pointed out earlier that comic fights don't meet the conditions of forum fights.
Originally posted by abhilegend
What else can you do to someone this dense?
Present an actual case that's based on something other than lowballing and otherwise ignoring forum rules.
Originally posted by darthgoober
I'm reasonably sure psycho is talking about the real world conflict here on our Earth, not something that happened in a comic. Though I suppose we can ask him for clarification if you like.
I'm reasonably sure that Surfer is a fictional character and thus we can only use his success in those fictional settings to determine how he fares here.
You're trying to shift the topic. You acted as if there weren't a lot of superhumans running around in the 60s, I pointed out that there actually were.
That wasn't my intention. Just to point out none but a handful of them mattered in Surfer attempting to end wars.
Keyword "magically". He couldn't transmute something that had already basically been magically transmuted. Magic's a powerful thing, that's why you'll never see me saying he could transmute something like Thor's hammer.
Magically altered flame doesn't becomes magical as well. Mjolnir doesn't hits you with magic unless it's energized with lightning.
Surfer has well defined limits. It's not like he can transmute anything willy nilly.
Yes, he can transmute matter on an atomic level and adamantium is simply matter composed of atoms.
That's as idiotic reasoning as anything I've ever seen.
What's the toughest thing Surfer has ever transmuted? Answer that and you'll know why he can't transmute adamantium.
Can he transmute Cap's shield though? Must be easy for him, right?
Not everyone, but lots of characters have some level of superspeed, yes.
Yeah, Surfer is below Hercules and Lobo in speed. Glad we agree.
And no, characters powers remain part of their powerset even if they don't showcase them frequently.
Not if they aren't even supposed to have that power. Nobody thinks Hercules has superspeed because he blitzed Hulk that one time.
No he's bullrushing him with his arm outstretched.
He punched Hal. He didn't tackle Hal. What a load of rubbish.
That's in no way equal to Surfer grabbing a character with superspeed by the throat and throwing them so fast that he's totally unseen.
Yeah, it's far superior. Alan hit him with the same speed at which he traveled from Earth to Oa.
That's a speed Surfer can only dream about. And Surfer surprised Nova, that's why he couldn't see him.
Later he had no issues tracking him or even hitting him.
Your desperation is laughable.
If he'd meant that, he wouldn't have simply said that Surfer has superspeed. But if you really think that's what he meant, go ahead and ask him for clarification. I'd do it myself, but whenever I ask him to correct you he tells me I should just ignore your nonsense. A direct request from you might net some results though.
Why would I do that? I don't need a mod ruling to know Surfer has shit superspeed.
He might be slightly faster than an average peak human though.
If the jet pilot grabs someone by the throat and throws them and is mistaken for an energy blast, he's moving his arm really, really fast even if it's not as fast as the jet itself is moving.
Not if its by surprise. If someone slaps you from behind while moving in a 40 mph vehicle, he doesn't gets superspeed of 40 mph.
And seriously, is that the only showing you have? Your whole argument is Surfer surprising Nova?
It's what I have been doing. You're just in denial.
Hahaha, the sheer denial here is palpable.
If you choose to absorb a bullet that's shot at you, it's absolutely reacting to the bullet. Not that I'm trying to make the feat out to be a big deal, you seem to think I'm trying to push the bullet feat. I simply made an offhand comment about it as an after thought to me saying that Surfer doesn't need to catch bullets.
But its not a reaction speed. Surfer's durability means that the bullets will lose all momentum upon contact and he can absorb them easily.
You don't have a single bullet catching feat? Pitiful.
Hey show me Robin casually blocking stuff like Surfer has and you'll have a point. Much less of a point with Deathstroke though, that guy's speed has given Flash and Superman issues too so either he's a true "speedster" even by your definition or he's got his own aura going for him.
Ask and you shall receive.
That's infinitely more impressive than Surfer.
And this one is with a broken leg.
Cue massive hand waving about how Nightwing bullrushed HV.
Who cares if he does it after he gets beat on for a while. I'm not saying he'll do it right out of the gate necessarily, just that he can do it.
Not if he gets punched or blasted to sleep and loses.
He's not allowed to carry them away in a forum fight abhi, that would be self bfr which isn't allowed. But since he's inclined to bfr and has the ability to bfr WITHOUT carrying them away then he'll do so. That's one of the reasons I pointed out earlier that comic fights don't meet the conditions of forum fights.
That's not self BFR if both opponents leave the battlefield.
Are you really this dense?
Present an actual case that's based on something other than lowballing and otherwise ignoring forum rules.
Originally posted by abhilegend
I'm reasonably sure that Surfer is a fictional character and thus we can only use his success in those fictional settings to determine how he fares here.
No that's not how it works. By the same token if a thread was created asking if Dr. Doom(or some other character) could permanently take over OUR Earth, we wouldn't automatically say that he couldn't because he never managed to permanently take over Marvel Earth. This is a purely theoretical scenario set on THIS Earth.
Originally posted by abhilegend
That wasn't my intention. Just to point out none but a handful of them mattered in Surfer attempting to end wars.
Yes but their simple existence changed the way people thought. People on our planet don't have any of those types of experiences.
Originally posted by abhilegend
Magically altered flame doesn't becomes magical as well. Mjolnir doesn't hits you with magic unless it's energized with lightning.Surfer has well defined limits. It's not like he can transmute anything willy nilly.
I'm not saying he can transmute anything willy nilly, I'm saying he can transmute anything lacking an on panel or at least logical resistance to it.
Originally posted by abhilegend
That's as idiotic reasoning as anything I've ever seen.What's the toughest thing Surfer has ever transmuted? Answer that and you'll know why he can't transmute adamantium.
Can he transmute Cap's shield though? Must be easy for him, right?
No it's logic and forum standards at work. We don't assume characters powers fail unless proven otherwise, we assume they succeed unless there's an on panel or logical reason that they don't.
I'm honestly unsure about Cap's shield, it gets treated a bit weird. There's been times when it was even shown to be immune to Magneto's powers back in the day, plus that time where Molecule Man noted how it's make up was even more bizarre than Surfer's board or Thor's hammer.
Originally posted by abhilegend
Yeah, Surfer is below Hercules and Lobo in speed. Glad we agree.
Absolutely not, neither of them have feats as impressive as Surfer.
Originally posted by abhilegend
Not if they aren't even supposed to have that power. Nobody thinks Hercules has superspeed because he blitzed Hulk that one time.
Herc DOES have some level of superspeed. And Surfer has even more.
Originally posted by abhilegend
He punched Hal. He didn't tackle Hal. What a load of rubbish.
I didn't say he did tackle Hal, I said he flew at him with his fist outstretched, that's a bulrush. You could build a human sized shaped statue in Alan's pose and launch him at someone at such speed that it would be invisible to the naked eye. On the other hand, you'd have to build a a complex robot type with impressive speed to manually grab the guy and throw him away without being seen.
Originally posted by abhilegend
Yeah ,it's far superior. Alan hit him with the same speed at which he traveled from Earth to Oa.That's a speed Surfer can only dream about. And Surfer surprised Nova, that's why he couldn't see him.
Later he had no issues tracking him or even hitting him.
Your desperation is laughable.
Alan was a dart, Surfer took a complex action. He went at Nova head on and took the action without even being seen. That's impressive speed.
Originally posted by abhilegend
Why would I do that? I don't need a mod ruling to know Surfer has shit superspeed.He might be slightly faster than an average peak human though.
The Mod ruling has already been made I'm saying you should seek clarification of the ruling... I mean unless you're afraid of the answer.
Originally posted by abhilegend
Not if its by surprise. If someone slaps you from behind while moving in a 40 mph vehicle, he doesn't gets superspeed of 40 mph.And seriously, is that the only showing you have? Your whole argument is Surfer surprising Nova?
Surfer didn't attack from behind, he attacked from in front. If you're traveling fast enough to be invisible from the front, grab someone, and throw them without being seen... that shows superhuman arm speed. It's superhuman speed against a regular person, let alone someone who has superhuman speed/reflexes themselves. For that matter, if the car's moving so fast that it's invisible to the naked eye and you can slap someone as you pass even from behind... that's super speed too cause humans don't have that kind of reactions. A human couldn't do that if the car was moving 300 miles an hour, let alone the speed Surfer was traveling
Originally posted by abhilegend
Hahaha, the sheer denial here is palpable.
I know, with every post I've thought you've exhibited as much of it as is humanly possible but you just keep showing more and more.
Originally posted by abhilegend
But its not a reaction speed. Surfer's durability means that the bullets will lose all momentum upon contact and he can absorb them easily.You don't have a single bullet catching feat? Pitiful.
If that were the case they'd reflect off or(far less likely) fall to the ground. If he's absorbing them while they're still in contact with him before they reflect off or fall... that's super speed/reflexes too. And again, I'm not actually making that much of the feat because it was one of those things that took place in a single panel and is therefore ambiguous, you seem to be really fixating on something that I just threw in there as an afterthought.
Originally posted by abhilegend
Ask and you shall receive.That's infinitely more impressive than Surfer.
And this one is with a broken leg.Cue massive hand waving about how Nightwing bullrushed HV.
That's not the same thing at all. In my example Surfer was standing stationary with his arms at his side while we see Ikaris's eyeblast in the air and then Surfer raised his hand to casually block them. Keeping ahead of targeting IS common among street level guys, actually reacting when the laser is 100% on target and in motion isn't.
Originally posted by abhilegend
Not if he gets punched or blasted to sleep and loses.
Surfer's got the speed and durability to keep that from happening before he decides to use a BFR.
Originally posted by abhilegend
That's not self BFR if both opponents leave the battlefield.
Are you really this dense?
If he's choosing to voluntarily leave the battlefield it IS self bfr. Mod's made that kind of thing clear when they said that Supes wasn't allowed to drag his opponent to the sun so he could sundip.
Originally posted by abhilegend
Present a case based on something. Not from your own imagination.
I have been. My case is based on on panel showings and logic.
Originally posted by darthgoober
No that's not how it works. By the same token if a thread was created asking if Dr. Doom(or some other character) could permanently take over OUR Earth, we wouldn't automatically say that he couldn't because he never managed to permanently take over Marvel Earth. This is a purely theoretical scenario set on THIS Earth.
Because you say so? Doom has taken over the marvel earth and subjugating other persons is far easier than letting them decide if they want to end war. Surfer can kill everyone to stop the war. Easily done.
Yes but their simple existence changed the way people thought. People on our planet don't have any of those types of experiences.
People will adapt. That's what they do here too.
I'm not saying he can transmute anything willy nilly, I'm saying he can transmute anything lacking an on panel or at least logical resistance to it.
So now you think he can't transmute everything? What happened with "Atoms"
And yes, Adamantium is quite tough I hear.
No it's logic and forum standards at work. We don't assume characters powers fail unless proven otherwise, we assume they succeed unless there's an on panel or logical reason that they don't.
And yes, we do. That's what is called law of averages. Hercules isn't going to blitz someone in a thread.
I'm honestly unsure about Cap's shield, it gets treated a bit weird. There's been times when it was even shown to be immune to Magneto's powers back in the day, plus that time where Molecule Man noted how it's make up was even more bizarre than Surfer's board or Thor's hammer.
But its made of atoms and hence Surfer can easily transmute it right? How about Infinity Gauntlet? Made of atoms only, eh?
Absolutely not, neither of them have feats as impressive as Surfer.
They both have actually blitzed characters which Surfer has never done.
Herc DOES have some level of superspeed. And Surfer has even more.
Haha, no. Even Marvel doesn't think Surfer has superhuman reflexes.
Enhanced human reflexes and Warp level speed.
I didn't say he did tackle Hal, I said he flew at him with his fist outstretched, that's a bulrush.
No, it is not. He punched him in the mouth after reaching there. He didn't fly from Earth with his arm stretched. What an idiocy.
You could build a human sized shaped statue in Alan's pose and launch him at someone at such speed that it would be invisible to the naked eye. On the other hand, you'd have to build a a complex robot type with impressive speed to manually grab the guy and throw him away without being seen.
No, it is certainly not that way. When Surfer can actually do that without element of surprise, do let me know.
Alan was a dart, Surfer took a complex action. He went at Nova head on and took the action without even being seen. That's impressive speed.
Alan actually punched Hal in the mouth. Surfer took Nova by surprise.
Alan actually showed combat speed. Surfer only showed flight speed.
The Mod ruling has already been made I'm saying you should seek clarification of the ruling... I mean unless you're afraid of the answer.
No ruling is done on what level of speed he is at. Even enhanced human level speed is superhuman.
What, you afraid to argue on actual comics?
Surfer didn't attack from behind, he attacked from in front. If you're traveling fast enough to be invisible from the front, grab someone, and throw them without being seen... that shows superhuman arm speed.
Its by surprise. Elektra and Wolverine have both done so.
http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/7/72524/4060350-7936719477-Elekt.jpg
She actually took his gun so fast he didn't notice.
http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/9/99065/3551367-5622805782-wolve.jpg
http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/9/99065/3551368-1147074731-fastt.jpg
Now those are actual complex speed feats. As Nova wasn't prepared, he is basically human level reflexes level.
It's superhuman speed against a regular person, let alone someone who has superhuman speed/reflexes themselves. For that matter, if the car's moving so fast that it's invisible to the naked eye and you can slap someone as you pass even from behind... that's super speed too cause humans don't have that kind of reactions. A human couldn't do that if the car was moving 300 miles an hour, let alone the speed Surfer was traveling
That's why he is slightly enhanced human level. As I was saying from start.
I know, with every post I've thought you've exhibited as much of it as is humanly possible but you just keep showing more and more.
Oh the irony here.
If that were the case they'd reflect off or(far less likely) fall to the ground.If he's absorbing them while they're still in contact with him before they reflect off or fall... that's super speed/reflexes too. And again, I'm not actually making that much of the feat because it was one of those things that took place in a single panel and is therefore ambiguous, you seem to be really fixating on something that I just threw in there as an afterthought.
What an idiocy. He isn't shown reacting to bullets, just absorbing the bullets.
And once again, he is shown stopping bullets with a force field and unable to react to bullets.
That's not the same thing at all. In my example Surfer was standing stationary with his arms at his side while we see Ikaris's eyeblast in the air and then Surfer raised his hand to casually block them.
Yes, its more impressive as Batman is actually using superspeed to traget Nightwing. And HV is stated to move at lightspeed and there is no mention of Ikaris' eyebeam speed.
Surfer merely blocked the energy attack which is Batman level speed.
http://i289.photobucket.com/albums/ll223/darknight2k/batvsheatvision2.jpg
Keeping ahead of targeting IS common among street level guys, actually reacting when the laser is 100% on target and in motion isn't.
Of course it is. Even Katana did it recently.
https://i1.wp.com/thefanboyseo.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/10/Suicide-Squad-2016-003-009.jpg
Deathstroke did it too recently.
Surfer's got the speed and durability to keep that from happening before he decides to use a BFR.
No, he doesn't.
If he's choosing to voluntarily leave the battlefield it IS self bfr. Mod's made that kind of thing clear when they said that Supes wasn't allowed to drag his opponent to the sun so he could sundip.
Not if both the opponents leave the battlefield. And its in his character, even if it is a loss for him.
Superman doesn't drags characters to sun in character.
I have been. My case is based on on panel showings and logic.
crylaugh
Originally posted by abhilegend
Because you say so? Doom has taken over the marvel earth and subjugating other persons is far easier than letting them decide if they want to end war. Surfer can kill everyone to stop the war. Easily done.
No because that's the forum standard. This a theoretical thread involving a real conflict on OUR Earth. Thus, we go by how people on OUR Earth will react.
Originally posted by abhilegend
People will adapt. That's what they do here too.
I'm sure they will... eventually. But they're not going to continue fighting WHILE they adapt to the sudden presence and interference of a godlike being. Where or not they resume fighting later is irrelevant to the thread because psycho wasn't ask for permanent peace.
Originally posted by abhilegend
So now you think he can't transmute everything? What happened with "Atoms"And yes, Adamantium is quite tough I hear.
I never said that he could transmute everything. I said an on panel or at least logical reason why something would have a resistance. Just being extremely dense isn't a logical resistance when we're talking about transmutation on an atomic level.
Originally posted by abhilegend
And yes, we do. That's what is called law of averages. Hercules isn't going to blitz someone in a thread.
No we don't. Powers are assumed to work unless there's a justifiable reason that they wouldn't.
Originally posted by abhilegend
But its made of atoms and hence Surfer can easily transmute it right? How about Infinity Gauntlet? Made of atoms only, eh?
As I said, I could see Cap's shield going either way depending on who's writing it because it's sometimes seen as an especially unique item. If Surfer ever transmutes it by rewriting it's atomic structure I certainly wouldn't push it as some huge feat for Surfer, and if he failed I wouldn't be trying to call BS either. When the premier matter manipulator in comics specifically notes just how crazy it's make up is and then screws up putting it back together(as revealed in a later arc) it's totally justifiable to say that Surfer might not being able to transmute the thing.
Originally posted by abhilegend
They both have actually blitzed characters which Surfer has never done.
Sure he has, you're just threatened by Surfer so you lowball him whenever you can.
Originally posted by abhilegend
Haha, no. Even Marvel doesn't think Surfer has superhuman reflexes.Enhanced human reflexes and Warp level speed.
Bios... really? Celey is going to be thrilled lol.
Originally posted by abhilegend
No, it is not. He punched him in the mouth after reaching there. He didn't fly from Earth with his arm stretched. What an idiocy.
You have any proof of that cause all I see is Alan flying into him with his fist outstretched.
Originally posted by abhilegend
No, it is certainly not that way. When Surfer can actually do that without element of surprise, do let me know.
It's absolutely that way, you're just like to lowball Surfer.
Originally posted by abhilegend
Alan actually punched Hal in the mouth. Surfer took Nova by surprise.Alan actually showed combat speed. Surfer only showed flight speed.
Keep telling yourself that abhi. Alan's feat could be accomplished with a statue and a giant slingshot.
Originally posted by abhilegend
No ruling is done on what level of speed he is at. Even enhanced human level speed is superhuman.What, you afraid to argue on actual comics?
And you definitely don't want clarification on what he meant... right?
I'm arguing based on comics, you've just fallen back into your pattern of lowballing.
Originally posted by abhilegend
Its by surprise. Elektra and Wolverine have both done so.She actually took his gun so fast he didn't notice.
Now those are actual complex speed feats. As Nova wasn't prepared, he is basically human level reflexes level.
That feat clearly shows that Electra has some level of super speed, nothing more. Totally acceptable because Electra has other superhuman abilities as well. And why was she able to do it? Because she's FASTER than the Punisher. By the same token, Surfer's FASTER than Nova who himself has actual "speedster" type super speed.
Your Wolverine example falls short though. He obviously didn't move so fast that he was invisible because they knew he just did something. They just didn't know what because there was no immediate effect.
Originally posted by abhilegend
That's why he is slightly enhanced human level. As I was saying from start.
It would only require slightly enhanced speed to do it at 300 mph, it would take far more to do it at the speeds Surfer travels at.
Originally posted by abhilegend
What an idiocy. He isn't shown reacting to bullets, just absorbing the bullets.
You're using an example where his powers are quite obviously on the fritz in the very scans you post?! Could you be anymore desperate to lowball Surfer?
Originally posted by abhilegend
Yes, its more impressive as Batman is actually using superspeed to traget Nightwing. And HV is stated to move at lightspeed and there is no mention of Ikaris' eyebeam speed.Surfer merely blocked the energy attack which is Batman level speed.
OMG, Batman's not doing the same thing at all. He's being attacked by a continuous, visible stream of heat vision and he holds up a mirror to intercept when it reaches him. That's not the same as reacting as Surfer did at the outset of the blast. By the same token, if you see a stream of automatic gunfire is about to reach you it's entirely possible to hold up a shield to block it. That doesn't mean that you'd be able to raise a shield to intercept even a single bullet after it's been fired.
Originally posted by abhilegend
Of course it is. Even Katana did it recently.Deathstroke did it too recently.
We don't see the eyeblast on actually on course to hit Katanna and then see Katanna raise her sword to block it there. That IS one of those ambiguous feats that street level guys get. That's more like the time Surfer blocked Firelord's eyeblast from close range, which I don't make out to be a big deal because of the ambiguous nature of it. In the instance with Ikaris however, it's plain as day that the blast is in the air on it's way toward Surfer while he stands there with his hands at his sides, and then Surfer raises his hand to block it.
Originally posted by abhilegend
No, he doesn't.
Sure he does. If he can take shots from the likes of Hulk, Thor, and Millinius he's not getting one shotted by the General.
Originally posted by abhilegend
Not if both the opponents leave the battlefield. And its in his character, even if it is a loss for him.Superman doesn't drags characters to sun in character.
Yes it's still self BFR, as I said the mods already declared that kind of thing long ago when certain people would talk about Supes dragging his opponents to the sun the way he did against DS and WW. I don't fault you for not knowing about it because it was before you were a member, but it's the way it is.
And really... you're saying that Surfer's going to intentionally forfeit the match? That's ridiculous even by your standards.
Originally posted by abhilegend
crylaugh
*Edit- I had to delete the link from your scans because they put my response over the 10,000 character limit.
Originally posted by darthgoober
No because that's the forum standard. This a theoretical thread involving a real conflict on OUR Earth. Thus, we go by how people on OUR Earth will react.
Based on how successful Surfer is on marvel earth. So not very much.
I'm sure they will... eventually. But they're not going to continue fighting WHILE they adapt to the sudden presence and interference of a godlike being. Where or not they resume fighting later is irrelevant to the thread because psycho wasn't ask for permanent peace.
Yeah, that's rubbish. Permanent peace is only thing which stops a war.
I never said that he could transmute everything. I said an on panel or at least logical reason why something would have a resistance. Just being extremely dense isn't a logical resistance when we're talking about transmutation on an atomic level.
In comics? It is. Why don't you show me Surfer transmuting something as tough as adamantium? Oh right, you don't have anything.
No we don't. Powers are assumed to work unless there's a justifiable reason that they wouldn't.
Maybe you don't. But you're an idiot, so no harm there.
One time showings are pretty much discarded for the same reason. Law of averages.
As I said, I could see Cap's shield going either way depending on who's writing it because it's sometimes seen as an especially unique item. If Surfer ever transmutes it by rewriting it's atomic structure I certainly wouldn't push it as some huge feat for Surfer, and if he failed I wouldn't be trying to call BS either. When the premier matter manipulator in comics specifically notes just how crazy it's make up is and then screws up putting it back together(as revealed in a later arc) it's totally justifiable to say that Surfer might not being able to transmute the thing.
Same with Adamantium. It's only slightly less tough than his shield.
Sure he has, you're just threatened by Surfer so you lowball him whenever you can.
Why don't you show me Surfer blitzing someone like that? Flying on his board isn't blitzing.
Bios... really? Celey is going to be thrilled lol.
Great retort. It's more reliable than your idiocy though.
You have any proof of that cause all I see is Alan flying into him with his fist outstretched.
You can always see the first scan. It's hard I know.
It's absolutely that way, you're just like to lowball Surfer.
"I can't prove it, you're just a hater. "
LMAO.
Keep telling yourself that abhi. Alan's feat could be accomplished with a statue and a giant slingshot.
"I refuse to see anything, just take my word on it."
Oh you poor fool.
And you definitely don't want clarification on what he meant... right?
Why would I do that? I don't need mod rulings to determine a character's power level.
It's the most pathetic level of debating.
I'm arguing based on comics, you've just fallen back into your pattern of lowballing.
"I have no proof, you're just a hater. "
LMAO.
That feat clearly shows that Electra has some level of super speed, nothing more. Totally acceptable because Electra has other superhuman abilities as well. And why was she able to do it? Because she's FASTER than the Punisher. By the same token, Surfer's FASTER than Nova who himself has actual "speedster" type super speed.
But he is not. He just surprised Nova.
Later on Nova had no issues seeing or hitting Surfer.
Nova only has human level reflexes when caught by surprise after all.
°Your Wolverine example falls short though. He obviously didn't move so fast that he was invisible because they knew he just did something. They just didn't know what because there was no immediate effect.
Surfer is as fast as Elektra or Wolverine? I can get that.
It would only require slightly enhanced speed to do it at 300 mph, it would take far more to do it at the speeds Surfer travels at.
And what speed is that? Even Dawn Greenwood could do that on his board.
FTL humans?
You're using an example where his powers are quite obviously on the fritz in the very scans you post?! Could you be anymore desperate to lowball Surfer?
The bullet stopping by force field was before his powers were drained by High Evolutionary. I just posted second set of scans for teh Lulz.
Cry more, would you?
OMG, Batman's not doing the same thing at all. He's being attacked by a continuous, visible stream of heat vision and he holds up a mirror to intercept when it reaches him.
OMG, that's not a continuous HV blast. Those are separated blasts.
That's not the same as reacting as Surfer did at the outset of the blast. By the same token, if you see a stream of automatic gunfire is about to reach you it's entirely possible to hold up a shield to block it. That doesn't mean that you'd be able to raise a shield to intercept even a single bullet after it's been fired.
You're an idiot.
We don't see the eyeblast on actually on course to hit Katanna and then see Katanna raise her sword to block it there.
Yes, Zod just blasted Katana on her sword. What an idiot.
That IS one of those ambiguous feats that street level guys get. That's more like the time Surfer blocked Firelord's eyeblast from close range, which I don't make out to be a big deal because of the ambiguous nature of it. In the instance with Ikaris however, it's plain as day that the blast is in the air on it's way toward Surfer while he stands there with his hands at his sides, and then Surfer raises his hand to block it.
This is entirely the same. How about Logan actually doing the same.
Oh look, Cap deflected the rays while they are in mid air too.
Sure he does. If he can take shots from the likes of Hulk, Thor, and Millinius he's not getting one shotted by the General.
Thor has oneshotted Surfer and beat the shit out of him along with Adam Warlock.
General will beat the ****ing shit out of Surfer if he got his hands on him. Dude manhandled Superman and Orion together.
Surfer isn't shit compared to that.
Yes it's still self BFR, as I said the mods already declared that kind of thing long ago when certain people would talk about Supes dragging his opponents to the sun the way he did against DS and WW. I don't fault you for not knowing about it because it was before you were a member, but it's the way it is.
Both time it was out of character.
Surfer doing it is in character, so Nope.
And really... you're saying that Surfer's going to intentionally forfeit the match? That's ridiculous even by your standards.
In character? Why not?
Laugh if you want, but it's obvious to everyone but you. And actually it's probably obvious to you too, it's just not in your nature to ever concede anything in Surfer's favor.
"I can't prove it, you're just a hater. "
LMAO.
*Edit- I had to delete the link from your scans because they put my response over the 10,000 character limit.
Good.
Wow KMC is having some serious issues right now, for some reason I can't even quote your post, the box is totally blank when I try. I'll still do my best to respond properly for now, hopefully the thing will be working again tomorrow.
No NOT based on how he does on Marvel Earth because there are extreme differences between Marvel Earth and OUR Earth.
Read the opening post again abhi, he's asking for CONFLICT RESOLUTION not a permanent state of peace. Even a temporary cease fire qualifies as resolving the current conflict. Do we really need to get psycho to clarify this point?
No it's not. Again you're making a claim about the limits of his power based off of literally NOTHING.
There are just no words... Hey if you personally believe that all powers are assumed to fail until proven otherwise then that's on you.
No it's not just the same with adamantium because adamantium doesn't have those showings and nothing in those showings suggest such a carry over.
Him being on his board doesn't take away from his arm speed.
Alan leaves the planet with his hands down, that doesn't mean he didn't stretch out his hand before the panel he appeared on with Hal. I'm not saying he made the whole trip in that pose lol
I have proven it. There's a difference between proving your point and getting a concession from someone who simply refuses to admit defeat. Face it, at best I'm Odin and you're Thanos.
You obviously DO need a Mod to clarify a ruling that's so obvious to EVERYBODY else.
lol... Oh just keep telling yourself that abhi, Nova only had human level reflexes when Surfer threw him... that's rich(no pun intended).
He had a forcefield up because he was in combat. That doesn't mean he was worried about being able to dodge the bullets specifically lol
You're kidding right? You can actually see the HV cutting a path along the ground as it heads towards Bats while he's reaching for the mirror.
In the scan you posted he spends multiple panels continuously blasting her sword. So either he's just that dumb OR he thought he'd be able to blast through it/overpower it.
Wolverine's not doing the exact same thing. He's blocking them in the same panel we see them headed towards him. Same thing with Cap
I'd like to see this instance of Thor one shotting Surfer, because I'm totally unaware of it. If you're talking about B&T then Surfer had already taken shots in the fight before Thor KO'd him. Hell he was in close quarters combat for an unspecified amount of time off panel RIGHT before Thor KO'd him.
They said nothing about it being out of character, they said it'd be self bfr.
Because characters are trying to WIN forum fights, that's the whole point. No character just decides to forfeit a thread.
Again, I have proven it. You've just reached the point where you plug you ears.
Originally posted by darthgoober
Wow KMC is having some serious issues right now, for some reason I can't even quote your post, the box is totally blank when I try. I'll still do my best to respond properly for now, hopefully the thing will be working again tomorrow.
Excuses, excuses.
No NOT based on how he does on Marvel Earth because there are extreme differences between Marvel Earth and OUR Earth.
But Surfer doesn't exist here and only through his success rate in Marvel earth, it can be decided. So nope.
Read the opening post again abhi, he's asking for CONFLICT RESOLUTION not a permanent state of peace. Even a temporary cease fire qualifies as resolving the current conflict. Do we really need to get psycho to clarify this point?
Conflict resolution means exactly that. Not temporary truce by force.
No it's not. Again you're making a claim about the limits of his power based off of literally NOTHING.
And you're using no limit fallacy. It's not my onus to prove he can't transmute Adamantium.
There are just no words... Hey if you personally believe that all powers are assumed to fail until proven otherwise then that's on you.
Except you haven't proven anything remotely that Surfer can transmute Adamantium. Just because he can manipulate atoms doesn't means he can transmute anything.
So get on to it.
No it's not just the same with adamantium because adamantium doesn't have those showings and nothing in those showings suggest such a carry over.
It has its own beastly showings.
https://m.reddit.com/r/respectthreads/comments/2xvj89/respect_ultron/
Go there if you want.
Him being on his board doesn't take away from his arm speed.
Of course it does. How fast was his arm moving?
Alan leaves the planet with his hands down, that doesn't mean he didn't stretch out his hand before the panel he appeared on with Hal. I'm not saying he made the whole trip in that pose lol
So you can't prove it but somehow I have to accept he just outstretched his arm and clothesline Hal?
Sorry pal, contact a mod and have him make a ruling.
I have proven it. There's a difference between proving your point and getting a concession from someone who simply refuses to admit defeat. Face it, at best I'm Odin and you're Thanos.
You've proven nothing at all. Repeating yourself with zero proofs isn't proving anything.
You're simply getting curbstomped like Blood and Thunder Silver Surfer.
You obviously DO need a Mod to clarify a ruling that's so obvious to EVERYBODY else.
Of course not. I don't need a ruling at all to know Surfer has enhanced human reflexes.
lol... Oh just keep telling yourself that abhi, Nova only had human level reflexes when Surfer threw him... that's rich(no pun intended).
Concession accepted. When you have something of worth, let Pr know.
He will make a ruling for you!!!!
He had a forcefield up because he was in combat. That doesn't mean he was worried about being able to dodge the bullets specifically lol
No, but he knew he can't catch the bullets from hurting others.
A Speedster would just pluck the bullets out of the air.
You're kidding right? You can actually see the HV cutting a path along the ground as it heads towards Bats while he's reaching for the mirror.
He is stopping for a quick burst of HV. Can you read at all?
In the scan you posted he spends multiple panels continuously blasting her sword. So either he's just that dumb OR he thought he'd be able to blast through it/overpower it.
Or she blocked it as it happened. She is just that good.
http://i409.photobucket.com/albums/pp176/Strafe_Prower/BlockingbeamsofLight.jpg
She is specifically redirecting several beams of light and they are fired in the same panel!
I want to know what will be the excuse now!
Wolverine's not doing the exact same thing. He's blocking them in the same panel we see them headed towards him. Same thing with Cap
So, we are counting panels now, eh? How much time passed between one panel to another?
Surfer merely raised his hand. Logan swung his whole arm and batted the blast away. Unless you think Cap had his shield raised the whole time that is.
It is far more impressive than Surfer's feat.
I'd like to see this instance of Thor one shotting Surfer, because I'm totally unaware of it. If you're talking about B&T then Surfer had already taken shots in the fight before Thor KO'd him. Hell he was in close quarters combat for an unspecified amount of time off panel RIGHT before Thor KO'd him.
There was a substantial gap between the first fight where Thor just slapped Surfer aside. Then Surfer stopped holding back and got KTFO in one hit.
Later in Warlock 23, Thor again KTFO him in two-three attacks.
They said nothing about it being out of character, they said it'd be self bfr.
Link please.
Because characters are trying to WIN forum fights, that's the whole point. No character just decides to forfeit a thread.
If characters are as idiotic as Surfer, why not?
Again, I have proven it. You've just reached the point where you plug you ears.
Originally posted by abhilegend
Excuses, excuses.
😆
Originally posted by abhilegend
But Surfer doesn't exist here and only through his success rate in Marvel earth, it can be decided. So nope.Conflict resolution means exactly that. Not temporary truce by force.
No we use logic, common sense, and knowledge of people on OUR Earth to decide it. It's a totally theoretical question because it's set HERE, not Marvel Earth.
So we do need to ask psycho to clarify? Ok I'll PM him and ask.
Originally posted by abhilegend
And you're using no limit fallacy. It's not my onus to prove he can't transmute Adamantium.Except you haven't proven anything remotely that Surfer can transmute Adamantium. Just because he can manipulate atoms doesn't means he can transmute anything.
So get on to it.
I've never said it's an ability without limits. I specifically pointed out that I'd never say he could transmute Thor's hammer and that Cap's shield could go either way. There just needs to be SOMETHING to suggest that an item/substance would have such a resistance.
And yes, if you're claiming a character's established power won't work you need some kind of proof to base it on.
Originally posted by abhilegend
It has its own beastly showings.https://m.reddit.com/r/respectthreads/comments/2xvj89/respect_ultron/
Go there if you want.
He never resisted transmutation there.
Originally posted by abhilegend
Of course it does. How fast was his arm moving?
Too fast for a speedster like Nova to see even though it was right in front of him 😉
Originally posted by abhilegend
So you can't prove it but somehow I have to accept he just outstretched his arm and clothesline Hal?Sorry pal, contact a mod and have him make a ruling.
That's just it abhi, it's ambiguous and therefor not a definitive showing of combat speed. And mods don't rule on specific panels that are open to interpretation.
Originally posted by abhilegend
You've proven nothing at all. Repeating yourself with zero proofs isn't proving anything.You're simply getting curbstomped like Blood and Thunder Silver Surfer.
Sure I have, just ask the onlookers.
Originally posted by abhilegend
Of course not. I don't need a ruling at all to know Surfer has enhanced human reflexes.
So if I were to look around I'd be totally unable to find any quotes from you saying Surfer doesn't have super speed?
Originally posted by abhilegend
Concession accepted. When you have something of worth, let Pr know.He will make a ruling for you!!!!
Pr just tells me I should ignore you lol
Originally posted by abhilegend
No, but he knew he can't catch the bullets from hurting others.A Speedster would just pluck the bullets out of the air.
Wasn't there a scene where Supes was unable to catch some bullets being fired at some soldiers?
Originally posted by abhilegend
He is stopping for a quick burst of HV. Can you read at all?
Again, you can clearly see the HV cutting a path along the ground in the panel where Batman is stopped and reaching for the mirror.
Originally posted by abhilegend
Or she blocked it as it happened. She is just that good.http://i409.photobucket.com/albums/pp176/Strafe_Prower/BlockingbeamsofLight.jpg
She is specifically redirecting several beams of light and they are fired in the same panel!
I want to know what will be the excuse now!
It's the same as the scene with Logan. Impossible to determine because it's all taking place in the same panel. Again, that IS the kind of feat that street level guys get all the time. The feat with Surfer/Ikaris ISN'T. That's why you don't seem to be able to find any scans of street level guys doing it.
Originally posted by abhilegend
So, we are counting panels now, eh? How much time passed between one panel to another?Surfer merely raised his hand. Logan swung his whole arm and batted the blast away. Unless you think Cap had his shield raised the whole time that is.
It is far more impressive than Surfer's feat.
The multiple panels are what remove ambiguity from Surfer's feat because we specifically see the blast headed towards him while his arms are down in one and then him block it before it hits in the next. With Wolverine and Cap we don't have that kind of knowledge.
Originally posted by abhilegend
There was a substantial gap between the first fight where Thor just slapped Surfer aside. Then Surfer stopped holding back and got KTFO in one hit.Later in Warlock 23, Thor again KTFO him in two-three attacks.
No there wasn't a "substantial gap". It was all one fight, ergo Surfer wasn't "one shotted".
Originally posted by abhilegend
Link please.
It was years ago, I didn't save the link lol.
Originally posted by abhilegend
If characters are as idiotic as Surfer, why not?
Because that's not how things work in a forum fight. Characters in forum fights are trying to WIN. They don't try to reason with their opponents or just throw the fight. They fight to win.
Originally posted by abhilegend
Haha, sure. Tell me again how fast Surfer is. I'm going to enjoy wrecking you again.
Only in your eyes abhi, only in your eyes 😆
Originally posted by darthgoober
😆
I know right.
No we use logic, common sense, and knowledge of people on OUR Earth to decide it. It's a totally theoretical question because it's set HERE, not Marvel Earth.
Still measured by his success in Marvel earth. Surfer doesn't exists in real life.
So we do need to ask psycho to clarify? Ok I'll PM him and ask.
Yeah, run away to someone again. That's your whole schtick.
I've never said it's an ability without limits.
So what's the limit?
I specifically pointed out that I'd never say he could transmute Thor's hammer and that Cap's shield could go either way. There just needs to be SOMETHING to suggest that an item/substance would have such a resistance.
Yeah, Adamantium is just slightly less dense than Cap shield. That's in itself is enough.
And yes, if you're claiming a character's established power won't work you need some kind of proof to base it on.
I don't need to. You don't ask why Spider-Man can't break Adamantium.
You need to prove he can transmute it. Not the other way around.
He never resisted transmutation there.
Yeah right. One Adamantium ultron casually shrugged off attacks from Surfer and dozens of heavy hitters with Kang.
Too fast for a speedster like Nova to see even though it was right in front of him 😉
Surprise attack. Even Alan has moved so fast that Wally himself couldn't see him when he caught him by surprise.
And Nova is at the bottom level of speedsters. He can't even maneuver at Mach speeds lol.
That's just it abhi, it's ambiguous and therefor not a definitive showing of combat speed. And mods don't rule on specific panels that are open to interpretation.
No, it is not. You are always welcome to run to Pr though.
Sure I have, just ask the onlookers.
Who cares about others?
So if I were to look around I'd be totally unable to find any quotes from you saying Surfer doesn't have super speed?
Sure, go ahead.
Pr just tells me I should ignore you lol
So run away like the sissy you are.
👆
Wasn't there a scene where Supes was unable to catch some bullets being fired at some soldiers?
There is quite a bit of context in that scene. I don't think you will understand though.
And you want me to post Superman catching bullets, eh?
Again, you can clearly see the HV cutting a path along the ground in the panel where Batman is stopped and reaching for the mirror.
So you're unable to read. Got it.
It's the same as the scene with Logan. Impossible to determine because it's all taking place in the same panel. Again, that IS the kind of feat that street level guys get all the time. The feat with Surfer/Ikaris ISN'T. That's why you don't seem to be able to find any scans of street level guys doing it.
Katana did actually better than Surfer. First you ask that Logan is in a different panel when the blast is fired bug when I post Katana deflecting several light beams it's invalid because it's in the same panel?
Stay on the same logic will you? This is just hilarious.
The multiple panels are what remove ambiguity from Surfer's feat because we specifically see the blast headed towards him while his arms are down in one and then him block it before it hits in the next. With Wolverine and Cap we don't have that kind of knowledge.
Yes, we do. That's why Logan is swinging his arm to bat the blast away.
It's far Superior to Surfer merely raising his hand.
No there wasn't a "substantial gap". It was all one fight, ergo Surfer wasn't "one shotted".
No, it wasn't. Bill occupied Thor in the middle while Surfer was knocked out.
It was years ago, I didn't save the link lol.
So no proof. Good to know.
Because that's not how things work in a forum fight. Characters in forum fights are trying to WIN. They don't try to reason with their opponents or just throw the fight. They fight to win.
In character. And it's in character for Surfer to physically BFR opponents.
Only in your eyes abhi, only in your eyes 😆
That's quite enough for me.
