Can ANYONE Go To Heaven?

Originally posted by Surtur
Lol wow, that's a lot of nonsense, but I have to give you props for saying this statement:

[b]"I have researched all that I have researched, studied all that I have studied, compiled all that I have compiled, and written all that I have written, to help you all COME TO A KNOWLEDGE OF THE TRUTH."

And then immediately following it up with, what I assume, was a serious question in "what does ego have to do with it?".

Good show chap. I have to say, if you're trolling you are doing an excellent impression of a Christian.

I would explain to you that the ant farm quote wasn't saying he was literally a child but...would it even make a difference at this point?

Call God an adult with an ant farm. Point is, if you had an ant farm would you notice if a few of the ants kill each other or get sick? If you somehow did notice, would you care?

If for some reason you really really love ants then just swap out ants for some bugs you don't like and pretend they sell them in farms too.

EDIT: Though speaking of ego, I have definitely met Christians who have said non-Christians will go to hell no matter how good they are. Are you going to tell me there isn't some ego to the thought a person is going to burn for all eternity because they don't worship your deity? It also completely kills the "God is compassionate and forgiving" narrative. [/B]

Nope, I’m definitely NOT a troll.

As far as non-Christians going to Hell no matter how GOOD they are. I think I should put this in the appropriate thread.

Here’s the thing: not even CHRISTIANS are GOOD enough to go to Heaven.

Let that sink in.

The Bible states that there is NONE righteous. In other words, NO ONE (Christians included) is GOOD enough to go to Heaven. The ONLY One Who was ever good enough to go to Heaven is the Lord Jesus Christ—because He NEVER sinned.

Also, the Bible teaches that people DO NOT go to Heaven based on their good WORKS, because ALL of our BEST EFFORTS (or RIGHTEOUSNESS) are like FILTHY RAGS. We can NEVER do or be enough to go to Heaven. Again, the STANDARD is not you compared to Adolf Hitler, or some serial killer, or some rapist or child molester.

God’s BAR or STANDARD OF RIGHTEOUSNESS is the Lord Jesus Christ (and He NEVER sinned).

Let that sink in.

The Bible says that there is NONE who does good (i.e. NO person other than Christ Jesus who meets His standard of righteousness). So our GOOD DEEDS (i.e. good WORKS) do NOT save us, or grant us entry into Heaven.

The Bible says that through GRACE (God’s UNDERSERVED and UNEARNED favor) are we saved (or fit to enter Heaven), and NOT of ourselves (i.e. NOT our OWN EFFORT, GOOD DEEDS, GOOD WORKS, OR ACTS OF RIGHTEOUSNESS)—it is the GIFT of God.

The authority (or right), and ability to enter Heaven when we die is a GIFT from God, wrapped and packaged as it were in the Person of Jesus Christ. All you have to do is RECEIVE CHRIST into your HEART and LIFE by CONFESSING (i.e. by ACKNOWLEDGING or ADMITTING) that JESU CHRIST IS LORD (i.e. your PERSONAL LORD AND SAVIOR WHO RESCUES YOU FROM YOUR SINS SO THAT YOU CAN ENTER HEAVEN).

ALL of the sins of EVERY person who has ever lived, is living right now, or will ever live has ALREADY been PAID FOR through the death by CRUCIFIXION, BURIAL, and RESURRECTION FROM THE DEAD OF THE LORD JESUS CHRIST.

It’s like being on DEATH ROW, and on the DAY OF YOUR SCHEDULED EXECUTION, an INNOCENT MAN (who has MIRACULOUSLY received PERMISSION from the state to DIE FOR YOUR SINS) walks into the prison, TAKES YOUR PLACE on the execution table, receives the lethal injection, DIES on the execution table, and SATIFIES THE STATE’S DEMAND FOR JUSTICE—FOR YOU. Now, you are FREE to leave. Those at the prison in charge of overseeing your out-processing follow all procedures to see to it that you are released as smooth as possible. They return any and all of your belongings that you entered prison with, and any other items that you accumulated while there. They escort you outside, buzz the gate, the gate opens, and you proceed toward a car filled with people who love you. The whole time that you are walking toward them you are TRYING TO FIGURE OUT WHAT JUST HAPPENED, and HOW you escaped THE PUNISHMENT THAT YOU DESERVED. Your family is both overjoyed and just as perplexed as you are about your release.

Well, similarly you were on SPIRITUAL death row, and on your way to Hell when you die. Approximately 2,000 years ago an INNOCENT MAN (Who MIRACULOUSLY received PERMISSION from God the Father to DIE FOR YOUR SINS) walked into the prison of GUILT, CONDEMNATION, and SIN, TOOK YOUR PLACE on the execution CROSS, DIED on the CROSS—and SATIFIED GOD’S DEMAND FOR JUSTICE for EVERY SIN THAT YOU HAVE EVER THOUGHT, SPOKEN, AND COMMITTED (He has done this for the WHOLE WORLD TOO). The innocent Man (The Lord Jesus Christ) died on BEHALF OF THE WHOLE WORLD (including YOU). Now, you (and ANYONE WHO WANTS TO BE SAVED) are FREE to leave the prison of GUILT, CONDEMNATION, and the wages of SIN.

The Lord Jesus has WASHED away YOUR sins. All you have to do is RECEIVE what the Lord Jesus HAS ALREADY DONE FOR YOU. The MOMENT that you tell the Lord Jesus that you want to receive what He has already done for you, He will come and LIVE INSIDE OF YOUR HEART. You will KNOW that you are FORGIVEN for ALL of your sins. You will KNOW that ALL of your sins are WASHED AWAY—FOREVER, and will NEVER be remembered against you ever again. You will KNOW that the Lord Jesus is your Savior who has credited you with HIS RIGHTEOUSNESS so that you can enter Heaven as a RIGHTEOUS PERSON. It’s NOT your BEST EFFORTS. It is TRUSTING CHRIST’S RIGHTEOUSNESS which is given FREELY to you, thus making you a child of God forever.

So, how do YOU (OR ANYONE ELSE READING THESE WORDS RIGHT NOW) receive Jesus so YOU can be forgiven for all of YOUR sins, made righteous in God's eyes (or good enough to go to Heaven), and receive everlasting life?

Romans 10:9-10,13
that IF YOU CONFESS WITH YOUR MOUTH THE LORD JESUS AND BELIEVE IN YOUR HEART THAT GOD HAS RAISED HIM FROM THE DEAD, YOU WILL BE SAVED. For with the heart one believes unto righteousness, and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation.

Romans 10:13
FOR "WHOEVER CALLS ON THE NAME OF THE LORD SHALL BE SAVED."

1. God says you must confess that Jesus Christ is Lord and believe in your heart that He (God) has raised Him (Jesus Christ) from the dead, and you will be saved. You will be forgiven for all your sins, and declared righteous to go to Heaven.

2. WHOEVER (this INCLUDES ANYONE ELSE READING THESE WORDS RIGHT NOW, YES YOU!) calls on the Name of Lord Jesus Christ for salvation shall be saved. Whoever sincerely believes in, depends on, and trusts in Jesus Christ with all their heart will be saved. Ask Jesus Christ to save you from your sins, to declare you to be righteous, and to give you everlasting life. Thank Jesus for forgiving you for all of your sins, for declaring you to be righteous, for making you good enough to go to Heaven, and for dying to pay for your sins.

Say this prayer from your heart (YES, YOU READING THESE WORDS):

Lord Jesus, I confess that You are Lord, and I believe with all of my heart that God raised You from the dead. I call upon Your Name for salvation. Also Lord Jesus, I repent (i.e. I TURN AWAY) from all of my sins. Thank You for saving me and giving me everlasting life now.

So Christians MUST trust the Lord Jesus to save them from the wages of their sin too. They have, so that's why they are going to Heaven. But ONLY because of their FAITH IN CHRIST, NOT because of their good deeds or works.

Originally posted by Adam_PoE

That's because salvation is a GIFT. You CANNOT earn a gift because a gift is given FREELY. Any gift you have to WORK for is NOT a gift.

The Lord Jesus Christ ALREADY DID ALL OF THE WORK. Christ did ALL OF THE HEAVY LIFTING so to speak.

Originally posted by Adam_PoE

Yes, according to some Christians, this is true.

However, many Christians do not believe this or they believe it is extremely difficult to genuinely repent and have a change of heart.

“We should take warning and not wait for the death-bed to repent, as we see the infant taken away by death, so may the youth and middle-aged, as well as the infant be suddenly called into eternity. Let this, then, prove as a warning to all not to procrastinate repentance, or wait till a death-bed, for it is the will of God that man should repent and serve Him in health, and in the strength and power of his mind, in order to secure his blessing, and not wait until he is called to die” (Smith, Teachings, 197).

“Repentance becomes more difficult as sin is more wilful; it is by humility and contrition of the heart that sinners may increase their faith in God, and so obtain from Him the gift of repentance. As the time of repentance is procrastinated, the ability to repent grows weaker; neglect of opportunity in holy things develops inability” (James E. Talmage, The Articles of Faith, 114).

Ultimately, it is not up to us to judge if a death-bed repentance is legit. Obviously, only God can make that Judgement. If it is genuine and true, then the person genuinely and truly repented.

Live a loving life bereft as hate. Seems to be the best policy.

Obviously, if Hitler had terminal cancer, renounced and repented of the evils he committed, and showed that he did not want to cause harm or commit anymore evils, then you are supposed to assume he has but exercise caution. Don't leave him in a room full of Jews, hand him a loaded machine gun, and walk away.

Originally posted by Adam_PoE

Some Jews REFUSE Christ's FREE GIFT of salvation. Many Jews DON'T BELIEVE that the Lord Jesus is the Messiah revealed in numerous Old Testament prophecies.

Again, salvation is a gift. There is NO quantity, number, or amount of good works or deeds that a person can do in order to be saved from their sins.

Jews don't get to go to Heaven because they are Jews. They were SUPPOSED to BELIEVE ON THE MESSIAH (THE LORD JESUS CHRIST) because they had FIRST RIGHT OF REFUSAL to RECEIVE the Messiah. But since many of them wouldn't believe, ANYONE can get in on the action (i.e. Jews and Gentiles).

The Blood of Jesus is powerful enough to save ANYONE, including Hitler. But I do not believe that Hitler was saved.

Hebrews 7:25
Wherefore HE [JESUS CHRIST] IS ABLE ALSO TO SAVE THEM TO THE UTTERMOST THAT COME UNTO GOD BY [OR THROUGH] HIM, seeing He ever lives to make intercession for them.

Originally posted by dadudemon
Yes, according to some Christians, this is true.

However, many Christians do not believe this or they believe it is extremely difficult to genuinely repent and have a change of heart.

“We should take warning and not wait for the death-bed to repent, as we see the infant taken away by death, so may the youth and middle-aged, as well as the infant be suddenly called into eternity. Let this, then, prove as a warning to all not to procrastinate repentance, or wait till a death-bed, for it is the will of God that man should repent and serve Him in health, and in the strength and power of his mind, in order to secure his blessing, and not wait until he is called to die” (Smith, Teachings, 197).

“Repentance becomes more difficult as sin is more wilful; it is by humility and contrition of the heart that sinners may increase their faith in God, and so obtain from Him the gift of repentance. As the time of repentance is procrastinated, the ability to repent grows weaker; neglect of opportunity in holy things develops inability” (James E. Talmage, The Articles of Faith, 114).

Ultimately, it is not up to us to judge if a death-bed repentance is legit. Obviously, only God can make that Judgement. If it is genuine and true, then the person genuinely and truly repented.

Live a loving life bereft as hate. Seems to be the best policy.

Obviously, if Hitler had terminal cancer, renounced and repented of the evils he committed, and showed that he did not want to cause harm or commit anymore evils, then you are supposed to assume he has but exercise caution. Don't leave him in a room full of Jews, hand him a loaded machine gun, and walk away.

God is NO respecter of persons.

If Adolf Hitler truly repented AND confessed and received the Lord Jesus as his personal Lord and Savior, then his sins are forgiven--and he is in Heaven.

However, I don't think that Hitler did this (especially considering how he died).

Christianinsanity

Oh, did I misspell that? Oops..

I'm gonna go with yes everyone since I'm a universalist and hell isn't something which I can reconcile with an all knowing all loving all powerful God.

Originally posted by Adam_PoE

Hitler was a Roman Catholic, as too were the NSDAP and the Croatian Ustaše, who were responsible for depraving acts of murder and genocide all supported and backed by the Catholic Church.

Originally posted by Ayelewis
Hitler was a Roman Catholic, as too were the NSDAP and the Croatian Ustaše, who were responsible for depraving acts of murder and genocide all supported and backed by the Catholic Church.

QFT.

Originally posted by Patient_Leech
Christianinsanity

Oh, did I misspell that? Oops..

I know. To you, and others who perish (or who do NOT know Jesus, are NOT born again, are NOT saved, and are NOT on your way to Heaven when you die) the preaching of the cross (and all things Christian) is foolishness.

But to us who are saved (i.e. those of us who KNOW Jesus, are BORN AGAIN, are SAVED, and are ON OUR WAY TO HEAVEN WHEN WE DIE) it is the power of God.

I know all of this sin, Heaven, Hell, cross, stuff is foolishness to you. I know that it just doesn’t make any sense to you.

I know. I was once WHERE you are.

My mind was once blinded by the god of this age (satan). I could not grasp anything that had to do with Jesus. It made no sense. It seemed ridiculous. I mocked God, and His Word (the Bible).

Then the Father (God) DREW me to His Son Jesus.

I started READING THE BIBLE (the same Book that I couldn’t/didn’t understand) and IT WAS ALIVE. The Lord Jesus began to MANIFEST (or REVEAL) Himself to me. I was riveted to the gospels (Matthew, Mark, Luke, and John). The events in THOSE BOOKS were no longer just Bible stories to me—THEY TRULY HAPPENED. I couldn’t put the Bible down. I kept turning page after page to see what was going to happen to Jesus.

I got to the end and noticed that they crucified the Lord Jesus. The INNOCENT Man Who went about DOING GOOD, and HEALING ALL who were OPPRESSED of the devil. The SINLESS Man Who performed miracle after miracle (which PROVED) that He was (and still is) Who He claimed to be: the Son of God (i.e. God in the flesh). This Man Who COMMITTED NO sin was beaten mercilessly, spit on, mocked, ridiculed, and insulted BY HIS OWN PEOPLE as well as by Roman soldiers. The Man in WHOM there is NO sin accused of BLASPHEMY for claiming to be the MESSIAH, SON OF THE BLESSED. This Man Who COULD NOT BE CONVICTED OF SIN bled profusely as He hung on a rugged cross between two thieves—until—He died.

But, then I noticed something UNPRECEDENTED as I continued to read the Word of God. UNLIKE ANY OTHER PERSON IN HISTORY WHO MADE CLAIMS—THIS MAN BACKED THEM UP BY RISING FROM THE DEAD—AND REMAINING ALIVE.

NONE of the below, so called

“…founders of religious traditions.”

“…historical figures credited with founding religions or religious philosophies or people who first codified older known religious traditions…those who have founded a specific major denomination within a larger religion.” End of quote. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_founders_of_religious_traditions

EVER ROSE FROM THE DEAD, and/or REMAINED ALIVE.

NO, NOT,

Zoroaster

Parshvanatha

Nebuchadnezzar II

Mahavira

Siddhartha Gautama

Confucius

Pythagoras

Mozi

Ezra

Epicurus

Zeno of Citium

Pharnavaz I of Iberia

Patanjali

Paul the Apostle

James the Just

Judah the Prince

Montanus

Marcion of Sinope

Nagarjuna

Plotinus

Mani

Arius

Pelagius

Nestorius

Eutyches

Mazdak

Bodhidharma

Muhammad

Songtsen Gampo

En no Gyôja

Huineng

Padmasambhava

Han Yu

Saichô

Kûkai

Adi Shankara

Ibn Nusayr

Ramanuja

Hamza ibn ‘Alî ibn Aḥmad

Sheikh Adi ibn Musafir

Basava

Hônen

Eisai

Shinran

Dôgen

Haji Bektash Veli

Nichiren

Madhvacharya

Sant Mat

John Wycliffe

Nâimî - Faýlu l-Lâh Astar-Âbâdî

Mahmoud Pasikhani

Jan Hus

Ramananda

Sankardev

EVER ROSE FROM THE DEAD, and/or REMAINED ALIVE.

NO, NOT,

(continued in next post)

Part 2/2
Continued:

Guru Nanak

Sri Chand

Vallabha Acharya

Martin Luther

Chaitanya Mahaprabhu

Thomas Cranmer

Ignatius of Loyola

Menno Simons

Conrad Grebel

Jacob Hutter

Sultan Sahak

John Calvin

Michael Servetus

John Knox

Akbar

Jacobus Arminius

John Smyth

Avvakum

George Fox

Philipp Spener

Jakob Ammann

Emanuel Swedenborg

Yisroel ben Eliezer "Baal Shem Tov

John Wesley, Charles Wesley, George Whitefield

Muhammad ibn Abd al-Wahhab

Ann Lee

Ram Mohan Roy

Swaminarayan

Auguste Comte

Nakayama Miki

Ignaz von Döllinger

Phineas Quimby

Allan Kardec

Joseph Smith

John Thomas

Abraham Geiger

Jamgon Kongtrul

Hong Xiuquan

Bahá'u'lláh

Báb

James Springer White

Wang Jueyi

Mary Baker Eddy

Ramalinga Swamigal

Dayananda Saraswati

Ellen G. White

John Ballou Newbrough

Subh-i-Azal

Helena Blavatsky

Ayya Vaikundar

Mirza Ghulam Ahmad

Guido von List

Charles Taze Russell

Wovoka

Rudolf Steiner

Swami Vivekananda

William Irvine

Sri Aurobindo

Mason Remey

Aleister Crowley

Charles Fox Parham

"Father Divine"

Edgar Cayce

Ngô Văn Chiêu

Guy Ballard

Frank Buchman

Alfred G. Moses

Mordecai Kaplan

Gerald Gardner

Felix Manalo

Frank B. Robinson

Noble Drew Ali

Marcus Garvey

Ernest Holmes

Sadafaldeo

Aimee Semple McPherson

Zélio Fernandino de Moraes

Ida B. Robinson

Wallace Fard Muhammad

Paramahansa Yogananda

A. C. Bhaktivedanta Swami Prabhupada

Ruth Norman

Swami Muktananda

Paul Twitchell

Ikurō Teshima

L. Ron Hubbard

Kim Il-sung

Chinmayananda Saraswati

Maharishi Mahesh Yogi

Samael Aun Weor

Mark L. Prophet

Ben Klassen

Ahn Sahng-hong

Huỳnh Phú Sổ

Yong (Sun) Myung Moon

Prabhat Ranjan Sarkar

Clarence 13X

Mestre Gabriel

Nirmala Srivastava

Sveinbjörn Beinteinsson

Sathya Sai Baba

Anton LaVey

Rajneesh

Mark L. Prophet; Elizabeth Clare Prophet

Adi Da

Claude Vorilhon

Marshall Vian Summers

Li Hongzhi

Ravi Shankar

Ryuho Okawa

Vissarion

Chris Korda

Tamara Siuda

Olumba Olumba Obu

Isak Gerson

Erdoğan Çınar

Abraham

Laozi

Saptarishi

John the Baptist

Queen of Sheba

NOT A ONE.

Wait, so Satan is the god of this age?

But, this age has been pretty good. Yes, lots of bad shit has happened, but lots of good shit too in terms of the progress of humanity. Just how far we've come in the last century is amazing.

Thanks Satan!

Also when you say God "drew" you to his son Jesus that not only sounds creepy, but it sounds like God straight up mind raped you into loving his kid.

Originally posted by JesusLovesYou
I know. I was once WHERE you are.

No, you weren't. But in fact I was where you are (except I was never nearly as obnoxious and presumptuous as you are). I was raised in a fundy Christian household. My father is still a fundy Christian. So, no, you have never been "WHERE I am." I was lucky enough to break free of the ridiculous delusions of Christianinsanity.

Originally posted by JesusLovesYou
I know. To you, and others who perish ... the preaching of the cross (and all things Christian) is foolishness.

It is foolishness. It is delusional and it's harmful because there is no evidence for such things. Just a book and centuries of brainwashed people.

What is it about Christianity where it almost always seems like someone who didn't always believe in God and "found" him at one point in their life is always a much bigger douche about their faith than someone who has been a Christian their entire life? You want proof I have two words for you: Kirk Cameron.

It's not that life long Christians don't also try to preach their religion to others to get them to join, but those who "found" God do it in some of the most condescending ways possible. More or less phrasing it like you're a lesser human being because you haven't discovered an all powerful being you want to blindly worship.

You both totally IGNORED the most important point that made:

NONE of the NUMEROUS people that I listed (i.e. Budda, Muhammad, Confucius, etc.) EVER ROSE FROM THE DEAD, and/or REMAINED ALIVE--like the Lord Jesus.

Originally posted by JesusLovesYou
NONE of the NUMEROUS people that I listed (i.e. Budda, Muhammad, Confucius, etc.) EVER ROSE FROM THE DEAD, and/or REMAINED ALIVE--like the Lord Jesus.

😂

Originally posted by JesusLovesYou
You both totally IGNORED the most important point that made:

NONE of the NUMEROUS people that I listed (i.e. Budda, Muhammad, Confucius, etc.) EVER ROSE FROM THE DEAD, and/or REMAINED ALIVE--like the Lord Jesus.

Thor's goats, Tanngrisnir and Tanngnjóstr, rise from the dead after he has cooked and eaten them, the next day.

Tanngrisnir and Tanngnjóstr >>>>>> Jesus Christ by virtue of faster, more efficient resurrection.