Azog the Defiler vs Oberyn

Originally posted by Darkstorm Zero
For the purposes of vs debates, yes it is. You saying it is not does not make it so. You need to prove something is so, I don;t have to prove it is not so, that is called burden of evidence. and my evidence is that Gregor did not die immediately, and that nothing has been mentioned within the show that Oberyn slowed the poison.

Hum. Okay, for the sake of debate then i shall grant you that. Although Oberyns experience with venom means he can easily tamper them to his will.

But for the sake of debate, lets say it isnt that fast.

Still i that doesnt mean Azog wins, he is just prolonging the fight.

Originally posted by Josh_Alexander
Hum. Okay, for the sake of debate then i shall grant you that. Although Oberyns experience with venom means he can easily tamper them to his will.

But for the sake of debate, lets say it isnt that fast.

Still i that doesnt mean Azog wins, he is just prolonging the fight.

Like I said, if this were Foreign Cinema, or Spacebattles, you'd have me on point, and i would not be making the argument.

That being said, Azog's abilities to withstand poison and disease as an Orc is well known. These guys are built for that kind of rancid lifestyle... With that said, it's a lot more to do with wether or not Oberyn can actually put Azog down before he gets squashed. Unlike a human, Azog isn't going to flinch from pain and back away like most men in GOT that Oberyn fought in the pits.

I dunno... I simply don't see Oberyn pulling a win against someone like Azog. He is very very good at fighting men, even monsterous men like Gregor. I'd even give him odds on to win against freaks like Maelys the Monstrous, but Azog is so unlike a human in both looks and reactions that Oberyn may well be thrown off his game.

Originally posted by Darkstorm Zero
Like I said, if this were Foreign Cinema, or Spacebattles, you'd have me on point, and i would not be making the argument.

That being said, Azog's abilities to withstand poison and disease as an Orc is well known. These guys are built for that kind of rancid lifestyle... With that said, it's a lot more to do with wether or not Oberyn can actually put Azog down before he gets squashed. Unlike a human, Azog isn't going to flinch from pain and back away like most men in GOT that Oberyn fought in the pits.

I dunno... I simply don't see Oberyn pulling a win against someone like Azog. He is very very good at fighting men, even monsterous men like Gregor. I'd even give him odds on to win against freaks like Maelys the Monstrous, but Azog is so unlike a human in both looks and reactions that Oberyn may well be thrown off his game.

I manage to find stronger evidence.

This was taken from collection's edition: Game of Thrones: An inside guide to the Hit Show.

It is stronger evidence because it is based on the show. Again Oberyn delayed the poison.

Oberyn is too fast for the Orc. He will spear him to death!

Originally posted by Josh_Alexander
I manage to find stronger evidence.

This was taken from collection's edition: Game of Thrones: An inside guide to the Hit Show.

It is stronger evidence because it is based on the show. Again Oberyn delayed the poison.

Oberyn is too fast for the Orc. He will spear him to death!

Again, I refer you to the clip of the actual show.

YouTube video

This is the scene where that line was meant to be said. But there is no mention of the thickening. I need you to focus on the show here dude. As I mentioned before, you'll get railroaded by far worse than I if you continue to assert you are correct when you are not. I know it is difficult to accept, but sometimes you gotta lit things go.

Now, as to your assertion of Oberyn's lithness, None can say he is slow by any means, however, Azog has fought fast opponents before. Fast, Stong, experienced, small and large foes. The battle for Moria proves it, as does his fights with other orcs seen in the first hobbit movie, and later his fights in 5 Armies, against speedsters like Elves.

As good as Oberyn may or may not be, he is no Elf. He is fast, but not Elf fast. Bolg fights off Elves, and his father Azog brushes Elves aside.

Originally posted by Josh_Alexander
He wanted a confession and got near the mountain. The samething wont happen here.

I made some research, it appears Oberyn tampered the manticore venom to delay its effect. So that means the venom reacts faster than seen on screen.

Either way, Oberyn can evade Azog for hours if need be. And every minute Azog gets weaker too.

Well he uses the same poison seen on the show. There's no proof he can avoid Gregor for minutes since he failed to do so on the show.

Originally posted by quanchi112
He will have to get close just as he did to Gregor prior to his defeat.

Well he uses the same poison seen on the show. There's no proof he can avoid Gregor for minutes since he failed to do so on the show.

Why would he have to get close?

He doesnt. He got close to the Mountain to make him confess, i dont see how he wilk do that with Azog.

Originally posted by Josh_Alexander
Why would he have to get close?

He doesnt. He got close to the Mountain to make him confess, i dont see how he wilk do that with Azog.

Originally posted by quanchi112
Due to him getting very close to strike Gregor in their duel. He doesn't need to get close to hear him confess. His ears work. He let his guard down due to arrogance but was close to Gregor most of the fight.

Lol, he speared him several times.

And he is still fast enough to avoid that big mace of Azog!

Furthermore, Oberyn was playing and making fun of Gregor the whole match. Dancing and spinning. It was obvious he was being careless and not fighting seriously.

Azog won't be able to get him.

Originally posted by Josh_Alexander
Lol, he speared him several times.

And he is still fast enough to avoid that big mace of Azog!

Furthermore, Oberyn was playing and making fun of Gregor the whole match. Dancing and spinning. It was obvious he was being careless and not fighting seriously.

Azog won't be able to get him.

He wasn't fast enough to avoid the sword which destroyed his spear. Azog would break his spear as well.

Yes, Oberyn was but he was still tossed and had his weapon broken despite his arrogance.

Originally posted by quanchi112
And he was close when he did so.

He wasn't fast enough to avoid the sword which destroyed his spear. Azog would break his spear as well.

Yes, Oberyn was but he was still tossed and had his weapon broken despite his arrogance.

Lol i still don't see how will Azog be able to hit him. He is too agile for Azog.

He will stab and retreat.

Also Azog has only one arm, which would make it harder to fight a fast opponent.

You know this is Arena Combat right? That means that just like in the show, there is people with back up weapons in case something like that happens.

If his spear breaks, he can get another.

Originally posted by Josh_Alexander
Lol i still don't see how will Azog be able to hit him. He is too agile for Azog.

He will stab and retreat.

Also Azog has only one arm, which would make it harder to fight a fast opponent.

You know this is Arena Combat right? That means that just like in the show, there is people with back up weapons in case something like that happens.

If his spear breaks, he can get another.

He was unable to do so without acquiring another weak.

What makes you think Azog waits patiently by until he gets another weapon. Also why can't he just break that one as well.

Originally posted by quanchi112
Gregor broke his weapon. Someone weaker, less skilled, and less strong broke through his defenses.

He was unable to do so without acquiring another weak.

What makes you think Azog waits patiently by until he gets another weapon. Also why can't he just break that one as well.

Lol! The Spear was cut not broken.

Azog has a mace not a sword! How can a mace cut a spear?

Azog is a bit clumsy as well.

Oberyn is fast enough to evade and get as many spears as needed.

Originally posted by Josh_Alexander
Lol! The Spear was cut not broken.

Azog has a mace not a sword! How can a mace cut a spear?

Azog is a bit clumsy as well.

Oberyn is fast enough to evade and get as many spears as needed.

Have you seen the force he brings when he swings it. It will break.

Based off what ? Oberyn was caught off guard by just Gregor who isn't comparable to Azog.

Originally posted by quanchi112
It was broken and unusable.

Have you seen the force he brings when he swings it. It will break.

Based off what ? Oberyn was caught off guard by just Gregor who isn't comparable to Azog.

It wont break.

It is more likely for him to toss the Spear away.

Cause Oberyn put down his guard. Something that wont happen in this match.

Originally posted by Josh_Alexander
It wont break.

It is more likely for him to toss the Spear away.

Cause Oberyn put down his guard. Something that wont happen in this match.

without his hairs put down he was still tossed proving he wasn't avoiding Gregor prior to that.

Originally posted by quanchi112
Why won't it break when Azog hits it ?

without his hairs put down he was still tossed proving he wasn't avoiding Gregor prior to that.

It wont break. It will toss. A mace isnt a sharp ubject that can slice through wood. If he hits the spear it will toss it out of Oberyns hands.

Okay am not gonna repeat myself.

Oberyn was mocking the Mountain. It was a personal fight for him. He was angry, desperate, etc. He wont put his guard down in this match the way he did against the Mountain.

Originally posted by Josh_Alexander
It wont break. It will toss. A mace isnt a sharp ubject that can slice through wood. If he hits the spear it will toss it out of Oberyns hands.

Okay am not gonna repeat myself.

Oberyn was mocking the Mountain. It was a personal fight for him. He was angry, desperate, etc. He wont put his guard down in this match the way he did against the Mountain.

That's fine because the evidence still points to him initiating contact against a slower and lesser skilled foe than Azog.

Originally posted by quanchi112
With the strength he has he can definitely break it but disarming him works just fine.

That's fine because the evidence still points to him initiating contact against a slower and lesser skilled foe than Azog.

Lesser skilled i doubt. Faster yes, but not enough to catch on Oberyn.

Originally posted by Josh_Alexander
Lesser skilled i doubt. Faster yes, but not enough to catch on Oberyn.

Gregor caught him prior to the end. Azog definitely hits the guy.

Originally posted by quanchi112
You really believe Gregor is as skilled as Azog ??

Gregor caught him prior to the end. Azog definitely hits the guy.

If Thorin Oakenshield can evade him, Oberyn laughs at his face!