Originally posted by WolverineX25
No. But the point was brought up that just because the Silver Surfer is more versatile than Superman it does not make the Surfer more powerful. As you can see, I disagreed.The Silver Surfer isn't just more "versatile" than Superman, he can do more to win a fight with Supes at their level. Superman would have to rely on his Strength first, then his Speed to defeat the Surfer. That's really all he can offer in that kind of fight. Silver Surfer has more ways to win against Superman which gives him the probability in victory.
but doesnt that contradict your previous argument?
Originally posted by WolverineX25
You are technically correct, but in this case I think the conclusion applies: The Abilities of the Silver Surfer aren't just more versatile than Superman's or the others listed, they far exceed Superman's own with the exception of strength. Superman may have feats which are out of his ordinary, but over-all only his strength is consistently superior to the Surfer's, not his energy projection or manipulation over matter or space.
😂
This isn't even close to being true. But humor me.
I didn't say versatility, I said level of ability(ies). Surfer can do more than Superman, and has more ways to win. Not more ways to *fight*, more ways to actually *win*.
This isn't about ways to win. This is about raw power.
Not to mention Surfer doesn't has that many ways to win anyway as Superman can counter most of them. Surfer can't counter Superman's ways of winning though.
No because with the exception of speed, Thanos could do practically anything the Silver Surfer can do and more. Again, this is not about versatility, this is about the level of their abilities and what any character would have to offer in a fight. If a character has numerous ways to win a fight over a character who has less ways to win, the probability of victory goes to the former.
Except no, Thanos can't do everything Surfer can.
Have you actually read about both characters or just read their respect threads?
Obviously Mangog is more powerful than the Silver Surfer, and again it's not about versatility. Like you said, Iron Man has more technical weapon and abilities than the Hulk, but the Hulk's durability and strength far exceeds anything Iron Man has to offer.
Same with Superman and Silver Surfer.
Superman and the Silver Surfer are a close match. We're not talking about Superman VS Spiderman or Superman VS Magneto. We are talking about a cosmic entity who was created to search the galaxies for worlds to be consumed, someone who has unmeasurable speed and countless access to any energy source in the known universe.
That can be applied to any herald or most characters in herald tier. Green Lanterns are supposed to be cosmic cops who can do literally anything.
Descriptions are fine and everything but they don't mean much here.
Superman CAN defeat the Silver Surfer, obviously, but it's not guaranteed. Superman has to CATCH the Silver Surfer before he can even hope to land a single hit. Superman then has to beat the Silver Surfer with enough time and force to put him out. The Silver Surfer can literally form Kryptonite if he knew the elements that created it.
The Silver Surfer can drain any ambient energies from the sun disconnected Superman from any source that would increase his power.
Superman's strength would be his greatest asset, but is energy blasts, his freeze-breath, his heat-vision, etc. would just not be enough to subdue the surfer.
Heh, that's why Firelord has koed Surfer thrice using his heat based attacks, right?
HV is far more devastating than you think. If Superman pours on HV on Surfer for any amount of time, Surfer is ****ed.
Superman would literally have to keep the Surfer contained so he can repeatedly beat him to death. He just hasn't shown the energy projection necessary to subdue the Silver Surfer long-range. The Silver Surfer has more ways to defeat Superman than vise versa. That is why the Silver Surfer is just more powerful. It's not simply about how many abilities the Surfer has, it's about how powerful these abilities are and how he can apply them in this fight.
It's literally vice versa. Surfer doesn't has energy output to keep down Superman. If he plays long range fight, HV is more than enough to ruin his day.
You're talking about ways to win. I just don't see being mentioned any.
I'm sorry - Superman is not more powerful. He is by far stronger. He is a stronger minded and stronger-hearted character than the Silver Surfer, yes, I give him that. But he is not more powerful over-all. He's as close as a Kryptonian can possibly be, but he's just not at Surfer's level. Sorry.
Yeah, he is above that level consistently. Surfer is more or less GL level and I'm being generous here.
Superman is above that level.
Originally posted by abhilegend
No, but his time travelling is retconned as going through another dimension rather than going through timestream straight up.Except it happened due to Pietro's speed. Now if Quicksilver started a chain reaction which brings entire atmosphere on the guy, it wouldn't be on his speed.
So why didn't Durok get koed when Surfer was accelerating?
It wasn't his speed which koed Durok. For that I need to be wrong in the first place.
That's still his ability in play, and as you can see from the scan, his technique was overwhelming Durok. That's why he got KO'd.
Just like Surfer. He went to fast he started tearing through reality, unless you think circling the globe was for show? He was meant to create a show of power, and he did it, regardless of losing most of the earlier encounter.
He likely did, we don't see the exact moment of the KO, but we see his face blur as the speed increases to its max, which is the effect I assume causing the KO.
Ah now I see the issue. You're attributing the effects of crossing dimensions, to being the KO. No wonder you're saying that makes no sense, it's because it doesn't. It took speed to reach that breakage in dimensions or whatever. It wasn't like crossing a portal. Surfer spun him out of consciousness and the sensation was too much for Durok to bear.
Well you are, but we'll take as much as time as we need.
Originally posted by Damborgson
That's still his ability in play, and as you can see from the scan, his technique was overwhelming Durok. That's why he got KO'd.Just like Surfer. He went to fast he started tearing through reality, unless you think circling the globe was for show? He was meant to create a show of power, and he did it, regardless of losing most of the earlier encounter.
Surfer's speed isn't what koed Durok. Even Thor endured Surfer going FTL just fine.
It was the strain of time travel which did it. It was due to Surfer's speed but it isn't his own power.
He likely did, we don't see the exact moment of the KO, but we see his face blur as the speed increases to its max, which is the effect I assume causing the KO.
It was the tear in time and space which did it.
Ah now I see the issue. You're attributing the effects of crossing dimensions, to being the KO. No wonder you're saying that makes no sense, it's because it doesn't. It took speed to reach that breakage in dimensions or whatever. It wasn't like crossing a portal. Surfer spun him out of consciousness and the sensation was too much for Durok to bear.
Except Surfer didn't spin him out of consciousness.
Well you are, but we'll take as much as time as we need.
😂
We'll see.
Originally posted by WolverineX25
You are technically correct, but in this case I think the conclusion applies: The Abilities of the Silver Surfer aren't just more versatile than Superman's or the others listed, they far exceed Superman's own with the exception of strength. Superman may have feats which are out of his ordinary, but over-all only his strength is consistently superior to the Surfer's, not his energy projection or manipulation over matter or space.I didn't say versatility, I said level of ability(ies). Surfer can do more than Superman, and has more ways to win. Not more ways to *fight*, more ways to actually *win*.
No because with the exception of speed, Thanos could do practically anything the Silver Surfer can do and more. Again, this is not about versatility, this is about the level of their abilities and what any character would have to offer in a fight. If a character has numerous ways to win a fight over a character who has less ways to win, the probability of victory goes to the former.
Obviously Mangog is more powerful than the Silver Surfer, and again it's not about versatility. Like you said, Iron Man has more technical weapon and abilities than the Hulk, but the Hulk's durability and strength far exceeds anything Iron Man has to offer.
Superman and the Silver Surfer are a close match. We're not talking about Superman VS Spiderman or Superman VS Magneto. We are talking about a cosmic entity who was created to search the galaxies for worlds to be consumed, someone who has unmeasurable speed and countless access to any energy source in the known universe.
Superman CAN defeat the Silver Surfer, obviously, but it's not guaranteed. Superman has to CATCH the Silver Surfer before he can even hope to land a single hit. Superman then has to beat the Silver Surfer with enough time and force to put him out. The Silver Surfer can literally form Kryptonite if he knew the elements that created it. The Silver Surfer can drain any ambient energies from the sun disconnected Superman from any source that would increase his power. Superman's strength would be his greatest asset, but is energy blasts, his freeze-breath, his heat-vision, etc. would just not be enough to subdue the surfer.
Superman would literally have to keep the Surfer contained so he can repeatedly beat him to death. He just hasn't shown the energy projection necessary to subdue the Silver Surfer long-range. The Silver Surfer has more ways to defeat Superman than vise versa. That is why the Silver Surfer is just more powerful. It's not simply about how many abilities the Surfer has, it's about how powerful these abilities are and how he can apply them in this fight.
I'm sorry - Superman is not more powerful. He is by far stronger. He is a stronger minded and stronger-hearted character than the Silver Surfer, yes, I give him that. But he is not more powerful over-all. He's as close as a Kryptonian can possibly be, but he's just not at Surfer's level. Sorry.
All he needs is one punch.
This is absolutely a Hulk/ Iron Man esque scenario. Not quite the same distance.
Superman can hit Surfer whenever he wants and take him out with a single attack. Period.
Originally posted by abhilegend
Surfer's speed isn't what koed Durok. Even Thor endured Surfer going FTL just fine.It was the strain of time travel which did it. It was due to Surfer's speed but it isn't his own power.
It was the tear in time and space which did it.
Except Surfer didn't spin him out of consciousness.
😂
We'll see.
That doesn't matter. Just because Thor endures it doesn't mean Durok has to. Thor has endured millions of times light speed, yet a couple times it disoriented him pretty bad in this showing:
https://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/6/62547/3525600-uncanny+avengers+10.jpg
Shit happens. In this case Durok got KO'd by it.
You see that face on the bottom right? It shows that he's being affected by the process. And since you haven't provided any explanation other than disregarding it and hand waving common sense, I've got this well wrapped up.
Unless you want to argue that Durok's secret weakness is going through portals again?
Originally posted by Damborgson
That doesn't matter. Just because Thor endures it doesn't mean Durok has to. Thor has endured millions of times light speed, yet a couple times it disoriented him pretty bad in this showing:https://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/6/62547/3525600-uncanny+avengers+10.jpg
Which is contradictory to your position that Surfer's speed is what koed Durok. Durok was stronger and more durable than Thor, so if he was koed by simple speed Thor should be too.
Shit happens. In this case Durok got KO'd by it.
Yet Thor endured it just fine.
https://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/11/111099/2991389-ssann98_12a.jpg
https://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/11/111099/2991392-ssann98_25b.jpg
Durok is impressive in context to Thor. If you remove that, it's not that impressive as you think.
You see that face on the bottom right? It shows that he's being affected by the process. And since you haven't provided any explanation other than disregarding it and hand waving common sense, I've got this well wrapped up.
I gave you the reason, he was koed by the strain of time travel. Not due to Surfer's speed.
Unless you want to argue that Durok's secret weakness is going through portals again?
No, it's time travel.
Based on Abhilogic, Rulk isn’t taken down by Hulk. He’s taken down by shockwaves and apparently has a weakness to them.
https://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/12/124715/2620769-08_23_10_01_22_23.jpg
Originally posted by DarkSaint85
The biggest guys are always a target.
I know. I'm always targeted by Abhi because he cannot counter what I have to say. XD
Originally posted by xJLxKing
Its normally just the vultures and maggots that do this...especially in numbers
Yeah.
Talking about yourselves guys ?
