Ozymandias vs. Black Panther

Originally posted by FrothByte
Ok, at least that clarifies it. I don't agree with your human physics theory entirely but at least you're no longer contradicting yourself.

It's sad that reaching this point is considered genuine progress with H1.

Originally posted by FrothByte
In the end though this doesn't matter as much, because there is no instance where a human took Bucky's metal arm and got right back up. Every person who's taken a hit from that arm and withstood it has been a superhuman.

And this is what it comes down to (and I have also been saying since the beginning). But H1 doesn't like the feat, so he will continue to try and cook up excuses to dismiss it. Even if it means assigning characteristics/feats from one limb/character to another (or, in this case, many more). I mean he is literally trying to assign Tony's one durability showing to everyone in the film, and assigning a human arm feat to the metal arm, while actively dismissing the metal arm feats. And this is the guy who, whenever people try to do things like use Captain America as a reference for people like Winter Soldier (because both are Super Soldiers), just to get a general benchmark/comparison (not even directly assigning anything, just making observations like Bucky would need comparable ballpark strength to be able to grapple with Steve and not get tossed around, considering their physical size and mass seems similar), claims you can't assign or share people's feats.

Originally posted by FrothByte
Tony taking an elbow from Bucky and Ozy not breaking faces with his punches is easy to explain. No decent fighter ever puts full power in all their hits. Some hits are feints, some are just distractions, some are used to setup a person for a more powerful hit, etc. Just watch boxers fight, their jabs won't usually be as strong as their crosses.

Bucky's elbow was obviously a set up for for Bucky's straight which floored Tony and took him out of the fight.

Same can be applied to Ozy but to a lesser degree, because his opponents withstood multiple punches to the face without serious injury, which seems to show that Ozy is not that much massively stronger than his opponents.

The kick is where your human physics theory comes in to place. Movie humans are undeniably tougher than regular humans. Able to survive hits that should knock them out or seriously injure..

In the end though this doesn't matter as much, because there is no instance where a human took Bucky's metal arm and got right back up. Every person who's taken a hit from that arm and withstood it has been a superhuman.

If you look at Bucky's face then you can see him clearly strain to be hitting Tony with basically all of his might. He even yells "yaahh" when delivering the blow.

And why set something else up when your initial elbow can kill a human in a single blow. That seems stupid doesn't it?

Plus even a jabbed elbow should ko or seriously bust the face of Tony easily from someone with superhuman strength.

So, what do you get when you apply your human star physics to the bullet catch?

Originally posted by Silent Master
So, what do you get when you apply your human star physics to the bullet catch?

When I first seen a fastball as a kid (it was 60mph), it looked like a blur. After much practice, a 90mph fastball looked like it was floating at one point in my life.

Originally posted by h1a8
If you look at Bucky's face then you can see him clearly strain to be hitting Tony with basically all of his might. He even yells "yaahh" when delivering the blow.

And why set something else up when your initial elbow can kill a human in a single blow. That seems stupid doesn't it?

Plus even a jabbed elbow should ko or seriously bust the face of Tony easily from someone with superhuman strength.

Yelling "yaah" doesn't mean your hit is at full strength. It means you yelled "yaah". If you look at the elbow delivered, you can clearly see that WS didn't put his weight into it. It was as short jab that was meant to pop Tony's head back which opened him up to Bucky's straight punch. And yet even that short elbow jab was enough to give Tony's face some severe bruising.

Besides, WS took out Tony with all of 2 hits. Both done with his human arm. Ozy hit his opponents multiple times before they were out. That just goes to show that Bucky hits harder than Ozy, and that's with his human arm. His metal arm hits even stronger and TChalla was able to take it.

Originally posted by h1a8
Nothing. According to the suspension of disbelief, it's not impossible to catch a bullet if one receives proper training of speed and perception.

When I first seen a fastball as a kid (it was 60mph), it looked like a blur. After much practice, a 90mph fastball looked like it was floating at one point in my life.

I knew you wouldn't be consistent.

By the way, I could easily say it's not impossible due to suspension of disbelief to say a normal human with the proper training and conditioning could withstand getting hit by someone with super strength. So your attempt to justify your double standard has failed.

Originally posted by FrothByte
Yelling "yaah" doesn't mean your hit is at full strength. It means you yelled "yaah". If you look at the elbow delivered, you can clearly see that WS didn't put his weight into it. It was as short jab that was meant to pop Tony's head back which opened him up to Bucky's straight punch. And yet even that short elbow jab was enough to give Tony's face some severe bruising.

Besides, WS took out Tony with all of 2 hits. Both done with his human arm. Ozy hit his opponents multiple times before they were out. That just goes to show that Bucky hits harder than Ozy, and that's with his human arm. His metal arm hits even stronger and TChalla was able to take it.

You are exactly like Silent, a troll. Why do you ignore relevant parts of my argument and nitpick others? You clearly see Bucky's face. He's using all of his might. Plus it's pretty dumb to yell when you are not using the high majority of your strength.

Tony's face should be broke. Nothing less.

Originally posted by Silent Master
I knew you wouldn't be consistent.

By the way, I could easily say it's not impossible due to suspension of disbelief to say a normal human with the proper training and conditioning could withstand getting hit by someone with super strength. So your attempt to justify your double standard has failed.

Originally posted by h1a8
Nothing. According to the suspension of disbelief, it's not impossible to catch a bullet if one receives proper training of speed and perception.

When I first seen a fastball as a kid (it was 60mph), it looked like a blur. After much practice, a 90mph fastball looked like it was floating at one point in my life.

Are you seriously going to continue trying to use your personal, unverified anecdotes as evidence in debates after your antics in trying to dismiss discussions right after Thor: Ragnarok was released, simply because no one from the US had "verified" the truth of people's claims at the time?

After all, by your own standards, for all we know, your claims could be exaggerated or completely fabricated. Any continuation on your part in using unverified personal anecdotes after your stance with regards to Ragnarok makes you a giant hypocrite.

Originally posted by TheVaultDweller
Are you seriously going to continue trying to use your personal, [B]unverified anecdotes as evidence in debates after your antics in trying to dismiss discussions right after Thor: Ragnarok was released, simply because no one from the US had "verified" the truth of people's claims at the time?

After all, by your own standards, for all we know, your claims could be exaggerated or completely fabricated. Any continuation on your part in using unverified personal anecdotes after your stance with regards to Ragnarok makes you a giant hypocrite. [/B]

Originally posted by h1a8
You are exactly like Silent, a troll. Why do you ignore relevant parts of my argument and nitpick others? You clearly see Bucky's face. He's using all of his might. Plus it's pretty dumb to yell when you are not using the high majority of your strength.

Tony's face should be broke. Nothing less.

Uh, you do know a person's strength is not dependent on how he yells right? I am not ignoring anything, but if you knew anything about body mechanics and fighting techniques you'd know that a there are some moves that don't pack as much power as others, especially short jabbing motions where you're unable to put your weight behind the blow.

After all, when was the last time you heard of someone getting knocked out by a quick jab? If you don't trust me try it out. Throw a quick jab with your fist and yell as loud as you can. Then throw a haymaker as strongly as you can without yelling. Tell me which one is the stronger punch.

Seems to me you're ignoring something that's right in front of your eyes. It also doesn't change the fact that Bucky took out Tony with only 2 hits, both made with his human arm.

Originally posted by FrothByte
Uh, you do know a person's strength is not dependent on how he yells right? I am not ignoring anything, but if you knew anything about body mechanics and fighting techniques you'd know that a there are some moves that don't pack as much power as others, especially short jabbing motions where you're unable to put your weight behind the blow.

After all, when was the last time you heard of someone getting knocked out by a quick jab? If you don't trust me try it out. Throw a quick jab with your fist and yell as loud as you can. Then throw a haymaker as strongly as you can without yelling. Tell me which one is the stronger punch.

Seems to me you're ignoring something that's right in front of your eyes. It also doesn't change the fact that Bucky took out Tony with only 2 hits, both made with his human arm.

This shit didn’t happen. It’s fiction. It’s all about what the writer is trying to portray. Only a liar (not even an idiot) would argue that Bucky wasn’t using the high majority of his strength in that elbow.

I'm not ignoring anything. A short jab of the elbow like Bucky delivered wouldn't leave too much of a mark if done by a regular human being. Maybe a slight cut to the cheekbone. It's not a strong hit. But due to Bucky's superhuman strength you see how even a quick elbow jab messed up Tony's face.

I don't see what your issue is. The results on Tony's face are consistent with Bucky's strength level.

Why are you even focusing on this when the relevant issue here is that Tchalla survived Bucky's metal arm punch, not a short jab from his human elbow.

Originally posted by h1a8
Irrelevant post. None of this rebuts my post. Just pointless rambling.

Not irrelevant at all. It shows that, by your own standards, claims about how fastballs etc. appear to you, personally, are not verified by other members here, and therefore invalid for debating. Continuing to do so is hypocritical on your part.

Basically, I don't need to rebut shit, because your claim remains unverified.

Originally posted by FrothByte
Why are you even focusing on this when the relevant issue here is that Tchalla survived Bucky's metal arm punch, not a short jab from his human elbow.

Because he has no proper counter, so he is going to continue to troll. It says a lot that he is focusing on a sound Bucky made when hitting Tony rather than the actual hit T'Challa took.

And hell, even if Tony took the hits without dying. That is a good feat for Tony. That doesn't magically now apply to everyone else because H1 decided it should. When John McClane survives things that would kill a normal person in the Die Hard movies, we don't assume it means anyone else in the films could do the same.

Originally posted by h1a8
Then you would be wrong. Plus there were scenes that contradicted Roschach durability.

I'm not wrong. Plus there were scenes that contradicted Ozy's perceptions and reactions.

Originally posted by Silent Master
I'm not wrong. Plus there were scenes that contradicted Ozy's perceptions and reactions.

Originally posted by h1a8
No there aren't. Comedian grabbing Ozy isn't one of them.

Yes there are.

But feel free to prove me wrong by making a case for "bullet-time" reactions without using the bullet catch.

Originally posted by Silent Master
Yes there are.

But feel free to prove me wrong by making a case for "bullet-time" reactions without using the bullet catch.

There was no scene that contradicted it. Even if there were then the most current character is what we argue. Ozy had bullet time reactions at the end of the movie.

Originally posted by h1a8
There was no scene that contradicted it. Even if there were then the most current character is what we argue. Ozy had bullet time reactions at the end of the movie.

No he didn't, that was just movie star physics.