Sidious vs. Snoke

Started by Darth Thor14 pages

Originally posted by dadudemon
Then the novel would be wrong...(but I think you're mistaken about the novel).

Th Novel has Palpatine’s Lightning overpowering Mace’s lightsaber and Mace/Palpatine Both asking for Anakin’s help, and then Palpatine stop firing his Lightning for absolutely no reason.

The commentary has Palpatine feigning weakness when him and Windu are having a Saber clash.

So even though you’re right that all sources have Windu winning the Lightsaber fight, there's a legitimate case to be made for Sidious being =/> Windu once he starts using his Force lightning.

^ Can’t edit. Palpatine was feigning weakness when Mace and him were having the LIGHTNING clash, Not Saber clash.

Originally posted by The Ellimist
Another idiotic response. Losing some limbs doesn't tell us how powerful he is, and you have no way to compare Kenobi with Kylo. You still have, after dozens of attempts to post on your position, failed to give a single meaningful feat or indicator that Kylo is actually as powerful as you think he is. Why don't you stop f*cking around and do so? If you say "Luke feared his raw power" with no attempt to address the numerous holes people have picked in that ridiculous argument one more time I swear I'm putting you on f*cking ignore.

Kenobi is less powerful than Vader. Luke admits he's only felt this kind of power in Rey and Ben. A statement is required since we won't ever see Kenobi or Vader take on any of the newer characters. Luke is the lynchpin.

We don't need to see an energy bar for Vader wince we know he never reached his full potential. At the time of his defeat he was still more powerful than Kenobi but despite that he was only able to stalemate him in the force. I showed you the gif earlier so for a character to be able to bulldoze another you need to be ridiculously more powerful if not caught off guard. That's the point since someone of Anakin's caliber who was both more powerful and more skilled than Kenobi failed to best him in both force power and with a lightsaber. That's why it makes Snoke complete and utter domination of Rey even that more impressive since Ren was unable to do so.

😕 WTF does Poe Dameron have to do with this discussion? Are you f*cking high?
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Just another point leaning towards the obvious that Disney has gone bigger and badder in every single fashion with this newer trilogy.


Luke wasn't trying to kill Rey, you f*cking hypocrite. Do you realize how many times I've pointed out this double standard to you? Yet every single time you don't even give a bad reply - you give no reply at all, it's like you are just incapable of even understanding the point I'm trying to make to you.
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I never said she was. She wasn't even trying to hurt him. She pulls back. Superman doesn't ever pull back from harming WW. That's the difference. Your obstinance doesn't save you from acting like the circumstances were the same when they clearly weren't. Superman was out to defend himself in that scene whereas WW was trying to calm him down. At no point does Superman pull back from hurting WW. We see Rey pull the **** back when Luke falls on his ass.

Lol no it isn't, because Snoke was obviously more willing to use the Force on Rey than Luke was, and Rey did not start with her lightsaber a foot next to Snoke. Try again.

We already addressed this, remember? You should concede the rest of your case before going on this fall-back, and then we can talk.
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Luke used the force to protect himself. He also disarmed her. We don't see Luke easily disarm her with the force. We see Snoke easily do so. Luke also cut himself off from the force so it doesn't stand to reason he can easily do so to Rey all things considered under the duress of combat.

She needed to wield it and Luke had time to defend himself. He fell. 😂

You're insane tbh. You use double standards and don't seem to be able to grasp the differences here.


What are you talking about? We're comparing the resolve of Luke to the Justice League, not of Rey to Superman. Please try to keep up.

Lol all of this is still circular logic based on your arbitrary placement of Rey and Kylo on no evidence or information whatsoever.

He ragdolled them at will and then voluntarily let them down to fight them, lmao.
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We are comparing the intentions of all parties. Your case falls on its face because Rey stops from harming Luke after he hilariously loses his balance. Superman headbutts WW and then headbutts her again. At no point does he stop from harming her prior to Lois.

False. He used his force powers when they were left vulnerable. He was kicked by Maul and pushed. Sidious needed a drawn out duel to assert himself over Maul. Snoke disarmed at will. Snoke put Kylo down with one blast.

Concession accepted, if Sidious was there to balance out 10,000 Jedi at the height of their powers.

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Windu defeated him one on one. Don't be dense. Sidious was able to cloud their senses duentomthenforcr balancing out the light and the dark. Rey didn't do anything special her powers just rose due to balance. Just stop with your ridiculous fanboyism.


The obvious here is that Darth Sidious is meant to be the most powerful sith lord of all time while Snoke is some rando who dies unceremoniously.

You're like someone who watches Psycho and still insists Marion Crane is alive.

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Snoke isn't a Sith Lord so who cares. Snoke is clearly more powerful than Darth Sidious. Palpatine died by being hurled down a shaft without much to his character either but that doesn't take away from his power level. Your ridiculous notion that less screen time means less power is moronic.

Andy Serkis agrees. You're a biased hypocrite.


Uh, do you seriously think Snoke has any advantage in powerscaling or thematic intent over Sidious? On what grounds?

lmao yeah, clearly we're comparing Rey to ESB Luke here. What an impressively intelligent statement. [/B]

In relation to Rey and Ben who scared Luke. Luke also felt the power of Yoda, Vader, and Sidious.

Based off feats Yoda's struggle with the x wing is lesser than all those rocks in comparison. Unlike you I don't decide who wins off feats alone because I'm not 12 and a moron.

Originally posted by Arachnid1
Finally got around to seeing the movie. Snoke was pathetic. He's barely a footnote in the Star Wars saga, and Sidious mega stomps him.
False, but despite your worthless opinion what makes you think Sidious is more powerful and wins here ?

Snoke is clearly the more powerful character between the two.

Originally posted by TheLordofMurder
Says the guy who misinterpreted the scene in Days of Future Past where Bishop was killed...

😂

What are you talking about ?

Windu won. Sidious played the part of the victim to appeal to Anakin's sympathy and make him believe only he could save Padme. Anakin clearly made the fear based choice because he's a mentally weak person who abandoned the Jedi Order at a pivotal moment.

Originally posted by Darth Thor
Th Novel has Palpatine’s Lightning overpowering Mace’s lightsaber and Mace/Palpatine Both asking for Anakin’s help, and then Palpatine stop firing his Lightning for absolutely no reason.

The commentary has Palpatine feigning weakness when him and Windu are having a Saber clash.

So even though you’re right that all sources have Windu winning the Lightsaber fight, there's a legitimate case to be made for Sidious being =/> Windu once he starts using his Force lightning.

You've kind of got this wrong.

Mace could have killed Palps. Palps feigned weakness once Anakin showed up which is what the commentary is about. The commentary specifically says the Windu overpower Palps.

Sidious took over the galaxy, Snoke hid in the shadows like a little ***** and came out of those shadows once Sidious was gone.

Snoke is a little *****.

Originally posted by juggernaut74
Sidious took over the galaxy, Snoke hid in the shadows like a little ***** and came out of those shadows once Sidious was gone.

Snoke is a little *****.

So he should come out in the open and challenge him at the height of his power because ?

Quit being an idiot. Sidious hid in the shadows from a few thousand Jedi despite being supreme chancellor. He tried fleeing from a muppet with a cane. The guy is a textbook coward.

Snoke and his First Order would annihilate the empire at the height of its power. Also lol at Darth Sidious hiding from the worhtless Jedi. He ruled through deception whereas Snoke rules through intimidation and sheer force.

Leave it to quanchi to describe Yoda as a "muppet in a cane" as though that were an honest and holistic description of his abilities. 😆

Originally posted by The Ellimist
Leave it to quanchi to describe Yoda as a "muppet in a cane" as though that were an honest and holistic description of his abilities. 😆
He was a walking corpse in the Ot trilogy. You thought he might pass away at any moment. Yoda is the post muppet for failure. I always told you fanboys he was the epitome of failure now it's canon approved.

🙂

Uh we're talking about CGI RotS Yoda. I get you were being facetious but you have this general habit of casting really misleading descriptions of events pretty shamelessly.

BTW how do you rationalize Maul getting diced by TPM Kenobi without sounding like a massive hypocrite?

(Full response pending)

Originally posted by The Ellimist
Leave it to quanchi to describe Yoda as a "muppet in a cane" as though that were an honest and holistic description of his abilities. 😆
He tries with little knowledge he has so I'll give him that.

Originally posted by quanchi112
So he should come out in the open and challenge him at the height of his power because ?

Quit being an idiot. Sidious hid in the shadows from a few thousand Jedi despite being supreme chancellor. He tried fleeing from a muppet with a cane. The guy is a textbook coward.

Snoke and his First Order would annihilate the empire at the height of its power. Also lol at Darth Sidious hiding from the worhtless Jedi. He ruled through deception whereas Snoke rules through intimidation and sheer force.

Snoke was riding in Sidious' coat tails up to his meaningless end.

Originally posted by dadudemon
You've kind of got this wrong.

Mace could have killed Palps. Palps feigned weakness once Anakin showed up which is what the commentary is about. The commentary specifically says the Windu overpower Palps.

The commentary says “this scene always Started Off with Windu overpowering Palps”. That but is clearly referring to the Saber clash.

It doesn’t say anywhere Mace was overpowering Palps in the Lightning clash.

It does say Palps was feigning weakness during Lightning clash. Anakin was there throughout the Lightning clash.

The novel says Palps Lightning was overpowering Mace’s Lightsaber blade.

Those are just the facts. There’s no If’s or But’s there. The speculation bit comes in at who would have won the Lightning clash had Palpatine not feigned weakness.

Originally posted by quanchi112
He was a walking corpse in the Ot trilogy. You thought he might pass away at any moment. Yoda is the post muppet for failure. I always told you fanboys he was the epitome of failure now it's canon approved.

🙂

The irony is that the decrepit muppet still lifted more weight than Snoke ever did 😛

Originally posted by Darth Thor
The commentary says “this scene always Started Off with Windu overpowering Palps”. That but is clearly referring to the Saber clash.

It doesn’t say anywhere Mace was overpowering Palps in the Lightning clash.

It does say Palps was feigning weakness during Lightning clash. Anakin was there throughout the Lightning clash.

The novel says Palps Lightning was overpowering Mace’s Lightsaber blade.

Those are just the facts. There’s no If’s or But’s there. The speculation bit comes in at who would have won the Lightning clash had Palpatine not feigned weakness.

The novel also tells Dooku was told to hold back vs Anakin.

😕

Originally posted by juggernaut74
The novel also tells Dooku was told to hold back vs Anakin.

😕

I'm not saying follow the novel. I'm just pointing it out as added information that doesn't contradict the commentary or what we see onscreen.

Also the novel states Dooku changed his mind about not killing Anakin when him and Kenobi were providing too much competition.

Originally posted by Darth Thor
I'm not saying follow the novel. I'm just pointing it out as added information that doesn't contradict the commentary or what we see onscreen.

Also the novel states Dooku changed his mind about not killing Anakin when him and Kenobi were providing too much competition.

I don't remember that, I remember reading by the time Dooku realized he needed to up his game it was too late.

And Kenobi provided no competition, Anakin did the heavy lifting.

Originally posted by juggernaut74
I don't remember that, I remember reading by the time Dooku realized he needed to up his game it was too late.

And Kenobi provided no competition, Anakin did the heavy lifting.

He realized that while Kenobi was still in the game.

Plus his fights against Anakin in TCW, and Yoda's vision in the final episode, all indicate Anakin was simply superior by the time of ROTS.

That doesn't make Dooku weak. Dooku being so powerful is what gave impact to that scene.

Dooku is a pimp, most of his fights it don't even look like he's trying.

https://youtu.be/OcXaicGvcvA