Originally posted by The Ellimist
I mean if we want to go OOU, ANH has clear production limitations that don't really apply to TOR. The in-universe explanation is that Arcann was stalling anyway.
Answer: I'm pretty sure it has that capability.
The reason why that never happened is the same reason Arcann doesn't move faster than we can see either.
I'm also interested in seeing where Arcann was stalling.
Originally posted by DarthAnt66Kyp Durron is absurdly powerful but isn't even faster than Kyle Katarn, Mara or Jaina. And he actually trains with a lightsaber unlike Vitiate.
Missed this: care to point to specific examples of powerful Force users significantly slower than weaker Force users?
If you want to prove Vitiate has good reaction speed, I need more than "he's super powerful" - Force speed and lightsaber combat are skills that improve with training like any other.
Originally posted by ILS
Vitiate's a good one.How about you go ahead and show me where raw power and Force speed improve perfectly linearly.
Factually, the more midichlorians a Force-user has, the more Force energy flowing into them, logically meaning greater augmentation of speed.
There are exceptions to this rule in individuals who devote their Force energy specifically to speed, but they are weaker in all other areas (i.e. Raskta Lsu).
Mace is another exception in which, via Vaapad, he's able to augment his body with an amount of Force energy beyond that he normally could.
In the case of Vitiate vs Maul, there's no reason for normal conditions to not hold true. Based on what Vitiate does in KOTFE/KOTET, it definitely seems true.
Originally posted by DarthAnt66
There are exceptions to this rule in individuals who devote their Force energy specifically to speed, but they are weaker in all other areas (i.e. Raskta Lsu).
And yet Maul vs. Vitiate represents, to some extent, that dichotomy, as Maul has trained his entire life to be a ruthlessly efficient assassin and duelist while Vitiate demonstrates complete ineptitude any time he actually has to fight someone seriously. It's hardly implausible to imagine that Maul would have better refined close quarters reaction times due to a combo of greater practice using the Force in that context and generally superior awareness/training/etc.
Originally posted by DarthAnt66Speed augmentation is something that 1. requires training and 2. can be increased by pouring more effort into it specifically.
I would point to the prequel trilogy as the golden example, but I find the burden of proof is more on you, since my stance holds logically --Factually, the more midichlorians a Force-user has, the more Force energy flowing into them, logically meaning greater augmentation of speed.
To suggest that this isn't a craft that needs to be honed with intense training is a bit silly.
There are exceptions to this rule in individuals who devote their Force energy specifically to speed, but they are weaker in all other areas (i.e. Raskta Lsu).Yeah. What you spend time on, you tend to be stronger at.
Mace is another exception in which, via Vaapad, he's able to augment his body with an amount of Force energy beyond that he normally could.Mace's speed is a direct product of his intense training, the Sidious fight being irrelevant. His most impressive descriptions of speed tend to refer to his lightsaber mimicing the Vaapad creature the style is named after, which happens to be extremely fast.
In the case of Vitiate vs Maul, there's no reason for this not to hold true. Based on what Vitiate does in KOTFE/KOTET, it definitely seems true.Vitiate who has, to my knowledge, no worthwhile lightsaber accomplishments or any vested interest in training with one.
We're talking about novel Vitiate here.
Originally posted by ILS
Kyp Durron is absurdly powerful but isn't even faster than Kyle Katarn, Mara or Jaina. And he actually trains with a lightsaber unlike Vitiate.
Tbh I think that Vitiate's standing in relation to his speed needs to be revisited. This can greatly influence his postion in the pecking order too.
Example:
Originally posted by ILS
Vitiate demonstrates a Juyo lightsaber sequence, circa 3900BBY.