Why is Hulk above Herald tier...

Originally posted by Baziemarc123
Show me an example of past BZ's here

http://www.killermovies.com/forums/f105/t621902.html

Doesn't have to be as long winded as this one, lol.

Originally posted by carver9
This is the most ridiculous argument ever. I hate when people say things like this. So Reed not using EVERYTHING against Hulk means he was holding back? Black Adam not using EVERYTHING against Superman means he was holding back. Orion not using EVERYTHING against Superman means he was holding back. Silver Surfer not using EVERYTHING against Thor means he was holding back. Hell, every single fight Thor has had, he didn't use a fraction of his abilities which means, he was holding back in 99 percent of his fights. Surfer NEVER use anything in any of his fights, he is always holding back. Has Hulk even used everything in his arsenal in one fight? Cant think of an instance. Yep, he is holding back. Who debate like this?

those are the facts carv. don't blame arguments--it's the medium. STORY FIRST. so anyone claiming it's STORY that allows for these characters to be portrayed inaccurately in even the VAST majority of the cases IS right. if YOU had flash's powers, in the real world, you would, literally, never be hit by anyone or anything. EVER. yet it happens to flash all the time.

the medium makes STORY an issue that can never be fully resolved. /shrug

reed v hulk and reed gets prep? lol would be fun to see. not very competitive, but fun. you could even make it a single post, or one post one rebut. wouldn't take more than that to end it anyway.

And Reed can do whatever he wants, no outside help like summoning Galactus or Franklin or anything like that.

But everything else, goes. Battlefield is all of space and time, so no BFR is possible.

Originally posted by leonidas
those are the facts carv. don't blame arguments--it's the medium. STORY FIRST. so anyone claiming it's STORY that allows for these characters to be portrayed inaccurately in even the VAST majority of the cases IS right. if YOU had flash's powers, in the real world, you would, literally, never be hit by anyone or anything. EVER. yet it happens to flash all the time.

the medium makes STORY an issue that can never be fully resolved. /shrug

So people saying that Surfer won't bfr Superman 10/10 even though its within Surfer powers to do is wrong? Looking at it like this, Stardust can pull a clean sweep against most high Heralds, Thor can as well. Why use scans when we can debate powerset?

^did this fool say why debate characters and actual facts in the comics when you can debate imaginary fan of interpretations of power set..?seriously?

Originally posted by carver9
So people saying that Surfer won't bfr Superman 10/10 even though its within Surfer powers to do is wrong? Looking at it like this, Stardust can pull a clean sweep against most high Heralds, Thor can as well. Why use scans when we can debate powerset?

Intelligence is a power of Reed. It's like a defining trait of his. So you're actually ignoring a crucial part of his power set.

It's like making a thread and saying Hulk has no strength. Or Flash has no speed.

We can argue character if you want.

When WWH came to Earth, and was threatening his family etc....what did Reed do?

He tried to calm him down, lol. So yeah, that has NOTHING to do with a battle forum thread.

Full capacity, brah. I'm not arguing Reed suddenly becomes homicidal and boils Hulk's eyes off or whatever.

Originally posted by panthergod
^did this fool say why debate characters and actual facts in the comics when you can debate imaginary fan of interpretations of power set..?seriously?

Again, why post scans if we are going to debate powerset? Example, Flash gets a majority against everyone outside of skyfather due to debating primarily off of his powerset. Someone saying Flash pulls a majority against Hulk due to speed blitz/speed steal, what makes their post any better than me saying Thor pulls 10/10 against HP Doomsday via lightning bolt bfr?

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Intelligence is a power of Reed. It's like a defining trait of his. So you're actually ignoring a crucial part of his power set.

It's like making a thread and saying Hulk has no strength. Or Flash has no speed.

We can argue character if you want.

When WWH came to Earth, and was threatening his family etc....what did Reed do?

He tried to calm him down, lol. So yeah, that has NOTHING to do with a battle forum thread.

Full capacity, brah. I'm not arguing Reed suddenly becomes homicidal and boils Hulk's eyes off or whatever.

So Surfer is stupid? Is this what you are saying? He is dumb enough to not realize he have the ability to port Superman 10/10? Is Flash smarter than Surfer because you tend to always argue the speed steal/blitz argument? Or are you a bias DC fan? Let me know.

Nothing. That would never happen in character.

Originally posted by carver9
Again, why post scans if we are going to debate powerset? Example, Flash gets a majority against everyone outside of skyfather due to debating primarily off of his powerset. Someone saying Flash pulls a majority against Hulk due to speed blitz/speed steal, what makes their post any better than me saying Thor pulls 10/10 against HP Doomsday via lightning bolt bfr?

He does not get majority of anyone short of Skyfathers though. That's a goofy fanboy position.

Originally posted by carver9
So Surfer is stupid? Is this what you are saying? He is dumb enough to not realize he have the ability to port Superman 10/10? Is Flash smarter than Surfer because you tend to always argue the speed steal/blitz argument? Or are you a bias DC fan? Let me know.

Characters forgetting their powers, like they always do against Huk, is not the same as not using a particular tactic or approach.

Originally posted by carver9
So Surfer is stupid? Is this what you are saying? He is dumb enough to not realize he have the ability to port Superman 10/10? Is Flash smarter than Surfer because you tend to always argue the speed steal/blitz argument? Or are you a bias DC fan? Let me know.

But Superman is faster than Surfer can do it. Superman is ALSO smart (not arguing who's smarter; it's arbitrary at this point).

Lets not even start on Flash, lol.

Originally posted by carver9
Again, why post scans if we are going to debate powerset? Example, Flash gets a majority against everyone outside of skyfather due to debating primarily off of his powerset. Someone saying Flash pulls a majority against Hulk due to speed blitz/speed steal, what makes their post any better than me saying Thor pulls 10/10 against HP Doomsday via lightning bolt bfr?

Thor would do it, absolutely.

But by the time he tries it, DD would be in his face.

In all of his years fighting the Hill, he only used the lightning BFR at the end, lol.

Thor is the worst example to use. He's stupid.

Originally posted by panthergod
He does not get majority of anyone short of Skyfathers though. That's a goofy fanboy position.

You probably want to look at the Flash vs Odin thread or Flash and Zoom vs Galactus.

Originally posted by krisblaze
Characters forgetting their powers, like they always do against Huk, is not the same as not using a particular tactic or approach.

Post a fight where a character didn't forget their powers.

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Surfer's not stupid.

But Superman is faster than Surfer can do it. Superman is ALSO smart (not arguing who's smarter; it's arbitrary at this point).

Lets not even start on Flash, lol.

So Superman is going to drop Surfer before he can throw off an attack? Let's take your approach. Surfer survived and tanked the big bang. Start there for his durability.

But this is a forum fight, not a comic fight.

I don't think you quite understand how forum fights work. Its a fundamental thing to grasp.

Originally posted by carver9
So people saying that Surfer won't bfr Superman 10/10 even though its within Surfer powers to do is wrong? Looking at it like this, Stardust can pull a clean sweep against most high Heralds, Thor can as well. Why use scans when we can debate powerset?

you make a valid point. that's why i said the issue can't be resolved. bfr is terrible in the forum, which is why most say no bfr. but "operating at peak capacity" and "arguing based on powerset" often amount to the same thing. we try and factor in character into the argument with mixed success. /shrug

these are things that will always come up when arguing fiction. you have to know this by now.

Originally posted by carver9
So Superman is going to drop Surfer before he can throw off an attack? Let's take your approach. Surfer survived and tanked the big bang. Start there for his durability.

But yeah, ok. Superman whistles him out of existence. Who said anything about punching? 🙂

This is when you realize, actually, Superman fans hold back a LOT. If one time feats are used (which is fine) then....well.